Originally Posted by Tarvus
I have a strong belief that lucid dreams and "astral projection" (I prefer the term "out of body experience") are somehow related. That being said, but having experienced a number of both, I still find them still to be quite distinct events. The following are just observations from my own experiences and are obviously my own speculation and beliefs - not necessarily "reality".
Fair enough.
In a lucid dream, you are aware you are dreaming. In an OBE, you are quite certain you are NOT dreaming. (Big distinction!).
I disagree with this statement, as many people are aware that an "OBE" is taking place, if that is what you meant. On the other hand, if you are not aware/lucid, that means an OBE could be a simple "dream" which masks itself as an OBE. You simply dream about being separated from your body. Many years ago I thought I had OBEs for months, and after learning about lucid dreaming I was able to find out that these OBEs were nothing more than WILDs. Why is everybody avoiding the question about doing a simple digital clock reality check in an OBE? They either ignore this question or say something similar to "numbers are always stable for me in dreams", which is 99% bull.
In a lucid dream, your focus of awareness is the "you" in the dream. In an OBE, you often observe your physical body from a focus of awareness outside the body. You may observe, from your physical body, the "outside you" actually separate from the "physical you" and later observe the reconnection from either or both perspectives. Your consciousness seems to reside in separate focuses but your awareness can be concentrated in one or the other.
A lucid dream has the power to make you observe your "body" lying in bed, as well as a feeling of separation from your body. A lucid dream has the power to do all those things. If you can be an animal in a lucid dream, grow limbs in a lucid dream, clone yourself in a lucid dream, and do a ton of other spectacular things, what makes you think a lucid dream can't also give you the feeling you're outside of your body? I hope you see where I'm going with this. It seems the biggest argument/evidence the astral travelers have is that it "feels different", and that's it.
Lucid dreams often lead to OBE's, but OBE's never seem to lead to lucid dreams.
Seeing how there is no solid evidence that OBE's are something other than dreams, this statement has no value.
Lucid dreams, though unusual, are still within the normal realm of human experience. Out of body experiences feel decidedly "not normal" - especially the first time you experience one. In fact, an OBE can change one's paradigm about the true nature of consciousness, reality, and spirituality.
Actually, the WILDs I had (and still have) made me change my paradigm about the nature of consciousness. If someone dreams they are out of their body and looking at themselves in bed, this might seem frightening at first, but there are also many other dreams and nightmares that can convince you that something supernatural happened.
Your first lucid dream is usually a fun experience. Your first OBE will likely scare the living daylights out of you!
Actually, my very first lucid dream scared the living daylights out of me, as did my first two or three WILDs.
Lucid dream settings can be virtually anywhere. OBE settings inevitably initiate from the location of your physical body.
Every single WILD I have had (and I've had hundreds) began in the room I fell asleep in, so I don't see anything significant in this statement.
In a lucid dream, your consciousness is already separate from your body. In an OBE, you witness the separation as it actually happens.
Dreams can create wonders. You can feel your body passing through walls, tasting food, having sex, flying, shapeshifting, growing additional limbs, and whatnot else... so why can't a dream recreate a realistic feeling of separation from your body?
Again, my belief is that lucid dreams, OBE's, false awakenings, sleep paralysis, hypnogogic and hypnopompic states are all related somehow, but the characteristics of the events themselves are markedly different.
My belief is that OBEs are dreams, no more no less. I don't see any reason to believe otherwise, and in my personal experience all me OBE's turned out to be dreams after doing a simple reality check. Again we see the popular pattern of people repeating "it feels really different" as a convincing argument.
"It's scary", "you look at your body", "you feel separating" are really really weak arguments.
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