Thread: Telekinesis?!?!? Plz read

Uh, shouldn’t this topic be in “Beyond Dreaming”?

And as much as I hate to get involved in debates like this, I’d like to point out that relying on “common sense” is not the mark of a skeptical and inquiring mind. It is rather a lazy appeal to a paradigm very poorly suited to judging the nature of physical reality. Most of the things we now know about the physical world at its most fundamental level run contrary to almost all conceptions of "common sense." Length contracts with an increase in relative velocity? Time slows in strong gravitational fields? Events viewed as simultaneous in one reference frame are not simultaneous in another? All objects exhibit a nature which is both particle and wave? Quantum systems do not have a definite state until observed?

Science has nothing to do with common sense, and neither does truth. Reality simply isn't "common.” Being a true skeptic requires a dedication to reviewing all available evidence and drawing from that a logical and well-researched conclusion. Entreaty to the tired and faulty paradigm of “common sense” is not skepticism - it’s sloth.

Sorry for the lecture, but I like to call myself a skeptical person, and those who use the word as a badge to protect themselves from having to do the real research footwork such a philosophy requires create a stigma of pig-headed stubbornness which I would prefer to not see perpetuated here.

If humans could telepathically communicate years ago, why did we stop and evolve with a supposedly less effecient way of communicating vocally? *

This is my opinion, and my opinion states that I do not believe that we have or ever had this ability. Evolution is a wonderful thing, and perhaps we'll attain it later... but we'll more likely die from the world's end or from global warming before we obtain telepathical abilities. [/b]

Have you ever heard of a vestigial organ? Evolution is not a system of constant improvements to organisms, it is a system in which if you survive and have offspring, your offspring will possess the same traits you do. The same things are no longer required to survive today as they were before, and so hence telepathy fell to language, but remember words are only like 10% of communication, and humans still use unconscious telepathy. I'm sorry but I can't fish out the article I read on this, but you understand the conceivability that if something isn't necessary to out compete other organisms for survival, usually it's lost to that organism.

And yes, we humans have many times been mistaken on how the Universe functioned, but lately we've dropped all the religion brawl, and now we're going by the scientific ways. We've got a lots of documentation for what we've discovered, and the documentation we see these days, is way more relieable, because we are not influenced by some powergreedy people in the *cough* Vaticane state *cough* [/b]

Religion is a mere type of paradigm which inflicts certain ideas, the most damage it's caused extraordinary to any other institution was its ability to inspire people to take action and oppose common sense, tolerance, etc... Scientists of any paradigm can just as easily become reactionary and conservative, and definitely will for many, many years to come, it's the way society works. Religion is only one source of conservatism when it comes to new ideas.

To lift something, we need a force that can lift the object. This force is apparently not vissible to the human eye, and it is not in contact with our body. Apparently you can control this force, to leviate objects, if you train your brain hard enough. [/b]

But the mind is very much connected with that object in as much a way as anything else. Take grabbing a cup, we know today when you tocuh a cup no single atom in your hand is coming in contact with a single atom from that cup, and that the feeling, the stimulus of touch is merely magnetic pressure.

And just because the arm is attached to the body does not mean it can be moved. If I stabbed a stick through my stomach could I move it? You move your arm due to electric impulses travelling through the motor system which triggers a chemical reaction causing them to move. The nerve cells don't even touch each other, either, they fire through little gaps because electricity travels faster than chemical reactions.

And again, if such a powerfull force as telekenisis has excisted for almost allways, how come we haven't got more confirmation, documentation, prove, evidence, eyewitness, than we've got? [/b]

Well, if you're not hunting down lucid dreaming information then how often do you read about it in history books? Sure... NOW it's getting more popular, as is telekinesis, but if you look at history, you have to really search and mince words a bit, but if you do, you can find ideas of telekinesis in the bible, in Gilgamesh, in writings on the Pyramid, mostly things like the witch doctor, druid or mama or whoever lead the career of meditating 3 times a day could perform things like moving objects with his mind. It was thought of as magic, and even in the 18th century when explorers swore they saw the priest of the village they were visiting cause things to happen, it wasn't believed or it was thought to the work of the Devil.

Telekenisis doesn't work. Theres no way unless you were equipted with special equipment in your brain. *
_________________
[/b]

I love you! your so center minded, plz find the first piece of evidence that can disprove it...bet u cant...so plz..how can u answer such a question you cannot proove...do your research like Manvo, and realize it is possible...It may not be possible for you cause your mind wont allow it to cross to that point..Just like you learned how to LD....it cna take YEARS to learn how to do this, but a person like you just Downgrading something yuou have no facts with...sounds like a bad lawyer!

HEy all you TELEKINESIS skepticz..i found an article and video for you all to look at and reaad..and you tell me it dont exsist...and plz, dont tell me there is a string or that the video is rigged..it was made before there was colored TV and no high tech video editing what we have now days..

READ THIS BEFORE YOU WATCH VIDEO:

In one significant filmed Moscow test, set up by a group of well known physicists, several nonmagnetic objects including matches were placed inside a large Plexiglas cube. The cube was to prevent drafts of air, threads or wires; methods long favoured by sceptics as the means by which Kulagina performed her ‘tricks’. Her hands moved a few inches from the Plexiglas cover and the objects danced from side to side in the plastic container. In another filmed experiment, a ping-pong ball is seen levitating and hovering in the air for a few seconds, before falling back onto the table. In yet another she is shown both indoors and outside in a garden, where objects near her spin round or slide in different directions.

that is one of the last paragraphs in the website i posted below the video

ANOTHER THING: In one of the (silent) films shot of experiments with Kulagina in her Leningrad apartment she is seen seated at a large, round, white table, in front of a lace-curtain window. According to Russian scientists she had, on this occasion, already been physically examined by a medical doctor, who had x-rayed her to make sure there were no hidden magnets or anything else concealed on her person, nor any pieces of shrapnel lodged in her body from her war injury. She was found to be clean and the experiment begun.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aa1_EEShWWU...&search=psychic

thats the video



here is the website

http://www.mysteriouspeople.com/Nina_Kulagina.htm

I think it could be possible. When I first saw this site on Lucid Dreaming I thought everyone hear who said they've had a lucid dream were just making it up. That is until I had a lucid dream.

Originally posted by Jared
I think it could be possible. When I first saw this site on Lucid Dreaming I though everyone hear who said they've had a lucid dream were just making it up. That is until I had a lucid dream.

Best argument I heard all night.

IM JUST POSTING IT AGAIN SO IT GETS ACROSS

HEy all you TELEKINESIS skepticz..i found an article and video for you all to look at and reaad..and you tell me it dont exsist...and plz, dont tell me there is a string or that the video is rigged..it was made before there was colored TV and no high tech video editing what we have now days..

READ THIS BEFORE YOU WATCH VIDEO:

In one significant filmed Moscow test, set up by a group of well known physicists, several nonmagnetic objects including matches were placed inside a large Plexiglas cube. The cube was to prevent drafts of air, threads or wires; methods long favoured by sceptics as the means by which Kulagina performed her ‘tricks’. Her hands moved a few inches from the Plexiglas cover and the objects danced from side to side in the plastic container. In another filmed experiment, a ping-pong ball is seen levitating and hovering in the air for a few seconds, before falling back onto the table. In yet another she is shown both indoors and outside in a garden, where objects near her spin round or slide in different directions.

that is one of the last paragraphs in the website i posted below the video

ANOTHER THING: In one of the (silent) films shot of experiments with Kulagina in her Leningrad apartment she is seen seated at a large, round, white table, in front of a lace-curtain window. According to Russian scientists she had, on this occasion, already been physically examined by a medical doctor, who had x-rayed her to make sure there were no hidden magnets or anything else concealed on her person, nor any pieces of shrapnel lodged in her body from her war injury. She was found to be clean and the experiment begun.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aa1_EEShWWU...&search=psychic

thats the video



here is the website

http://www.mysteriouspeople.com/Nina_Kulagina.htm

as sombody here said,we use 10% of our brain,but i think we don't use evin that much,i think that TK is posible,i'v seen some strange things,and i beleve in thins,are there tutorials,we can talk about this all we want whit no resoult,in every life our soul evolves,and i really beleve that my generation can evolv drasticly,since i was a little kid i knew to control chakra like an expert,thus i learned to telepaticly comunicate,read mnids on a really low lvl,and have a really good six sence,now lucid dreaming

so after all this starange things,in TK i beleve,are there any good tutorials?
whit every new ability we learn,we evolve more,beeing a skeptic is only makeing you dumber,the easyer way to learn TK is to open your mind in LDs,to explore and move some musles(i'm talking about the brain)that we never taught posible

i was once mediteiting,and i learned to move my ears really

if there are tutorials a link plz

the most unfathomable thing about the universe is that it be fathomable

it just depends how and where

let me tell you a story..

a friend of a friend was in tha amazonian jungle drinking a brew of Ayuhasca with the village elders, as he was sat in a trance he had a visitation from a team of 12 foot high beetles standing on thier back legs bathed in an ethereal light, they came to him and said.
'we have come from a distant galaxy to take over your planet'
they laughed a cold undreaming insect laugh and left
now my friends buddy couldn't hadle this apperation, to use a drug term he: spun the fuck out, after a bit of rocking back and forth and rubbing his chin against his knee he wen to the elder shaman and told him of the whole experience, the shaman laughed and said,
'yeah they always say that'

Originally posted by Gawain+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Gawain)</div>

Telekinesis is dealing with moving physical objects with another physical object at a distance. Physical things are bound to physical laws, and thus needs to be explained scientifically. [/b]

It’s being researched scientifically by many different factions.
I’m taking your referring to “physical things” with any sort of absolution means you’re not familiar with the scientific concept of wave/particle duality? Or the non-locality of electrons that seem to “teleport” from one area of orbit to another?
I’m not sure why you’d let your lack of information on something dictate to you that it doesn’t exist. Couple that with what seems to be your decision to take what you hear about on your world news and text books to be the end of the universe, and I’d say you’re well on your way to having to be spoon-fed through life.

[Edit: I do agree that it is nothing spiritual, though, if it does exist. You’re right about that one....(depending on how you interpret spiritual, of course)]



<!--QuoteBegin-Marvo
The human body and brain is a biological function, not a magic hat. *

To lift something, we need a force that can lift the object. This force is apparently not vissible to the human eye, and it is not in contact with our body. Apparently you can control this force, to leviate objects, if you train your brain hard enough. *

And yes, we humans have many times been mistaken on how the Universe functioned, but lately we've dropped all the religion brawl, and now we're going by the scientific ways. We've got a lots of documentation for what we've discovered, and the documentation we see these days, is way more relieable, because we are not influenced by some powergreedy people in the *cough* Vaticane state *cough* *

And again, if such a powerfull force as telekenisis has excisted for almost allways, how come we haven't got more confirmation, documentation, prove, evidence, eyewitness, than we've got? *

I am a very skeptic person when it comes to supernatural subjects, I know that, but hello, all the stuff we discover and find out is getting confirmed for real. I base much of my knowledge on my own logic sense and what I read. And I base my knowledge on relieable sources. What I find relieable after all. Let me point out, that TK might be possible, and it'd be great if it was, but compared on how stuff is looking right now, my is standpoint non-believer. *

Correction. (as Peregrinus explained) You are what we call a “pseudo-skeptic,” a person who uses the disguise of actual skepticism to exercise a faith-based disbelief in any certain subject, even when presented with evidence that contradicts your belief.

You have no interest in finding out just how little about the “scientific ways” that you’re talking about, because you believe that any evidence that contradicts your obviously limited understanding of those scientific ways is automatically false. This gives you a reason to ignore any that’s presented to you.

Being “skeptical” doesn’t mean you disbelieve something. Being “skeptical” means you haven’t seen enough information to convince you of something, but are open to information of the kind, if you can find it, and are given reason to believe it’s credible. I think you should really find a better word for you “close-minded disbelief,” than “skepticism.”

Your only argument (throwing aside all of your rhetoric about our “scientific ways” that is basically Wrong) is that you don’t believe TK exists because you make the assumption that if anything exists, it would be plastered all over the news paper and TV. Wrong again, but since this is the basis for your argument, own up to it, and don’t misquote science as your ally.

You ask why we haven’t had more confirmation, documentation, proof, evidence and eyewitnesses than we’ve got? We do. What are you talking about? Oh, you mean why haven’t you been told? Easy, because some things in life you just have to research yourself. (or listen to people that have done it, and can actually give you information. I was about 22 when I started discovering that fact, so maybe you’ll realize it a bit more over time.)

Stanford, Princeton, the CIA (you do know who they are, right?), the Society for Psychical Research, etc. These are all huge organizations (and are way above the league of your “few 17 year olds on the internet”) that have well-documented EFECTS with parapsychology. These documents don’t just disappear over time. They are all over the place for you to read them. After something is documented it takes another set of very-powerful eyes to edit the documents and decide whether they are suitable to be published and given out to the masses. Most people have been reluctant to do that with parapsychology though, because the effects, so far, are small and unstable.

These are facts printed in the documents, and even those from the CIA suggest parapsychology have as basis in truth, just nothing that is as of use to their programs.

And basically what you’re telling me is that your faith-based lack of information that you call “logic sense,” is superior to the facts printed about the greater-than-chance results of evidence for PK that all of these institutions have documented? Sorry, but that’s against my ”logic sense.”

Originally posted by DoomedOne

And yes, we humans have many times been mistaken on how the Universe functioned, but lately we've dropped all the religion brawl, and now we're going by the scientific ways. We've got a lots of documentation for what we've discovered, and the documentation we see these days, is way more relieable, because we are not influenced by some powergreedy people in the *cough* Vaticane state *cough*

Religion is a mere type of paradigm which inflicts certain ideas, the most damage it's caused extraordinary to any other institution was its ability to inspire people to take action and oppose common sense, tolerance, etc... Scientists of any paradigm can just as easily become reactionary and conservative, and definitely will for many, many years to come, it's the way society works. Religion is only one source of conservatism when it comes to new ideas.[/b]

Religion has caused war. Lots of war. And a difference of religion between two people can make them hate each other simply for the fact that they dont like the other persons belief.

Originally posted by xcrissxcrossx


Religion has caused war. Lots of war. And a difference of religion between two people can make them hate each other simply for the fact that they dont like the other persons belief.

nope
religion is used as a guise or ruse to encite hate to get people to fight,
just like nowadays really
every war in all history has all been about economy and a want or need of resources

Moved to Beyond Dreaming

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6H0TBIuEFA...Nina%20Kulagina

Read the description. In the end of the movie, the moves a tincan to the border of the table. Take a look how she is sitting in that moment.

Threading, I'm afraid.

Originally posted by Oneironaut
[Edit: I do agree that it is nothing spiritual, though, if it does exist. You’re right about that one....(depending on how you interpret spiritual, of course)] *

Hopefully by "You're right about that one..." do you mean you agree with me, as none of us can possibly determine what is right about what we call 'Telekinesis' at this point. I said spiritual just as a synonym for the supernatural and the Unknown/non-physical.

I'd love to click these YouTube links, but my laptop doesn't play them, so I guess I'm in the dark on those.

By "spiritual," I mean something exclusively to do with a spirit. This can mean a ghost, apparition, angel or a God, or even just a person that travels in spiritual circles. I think that the phenomenon, if it exists, has a psychological basis but deals with a force that we haven't yet learned to pin-down. For something to be "supernatural," would mean it's outside the scope of "nature." If TK exists, it is just as natural as electromagnetism, and "supernatural" would be a misnomer.
I don't agree with you that "none of us can figure what is 'right' about TK at this time," though. You are speaking from the logic of someone that has never read and/or seen credible evidence of TK testing with positive results.
What I "know is right" about TK, at this point, is that there is credible evidence for it. (and I'm not talking about youtube videos of people sitting around trying to make a cool "i can do TK" videos)
Whether or not you choose to ignore that the evidence exists is up to you, but what I also "know is right about TK" is that to make the assumption that it doesn't exist, without examining as much of the evidence of its existence as possible before solidifying that belief is, in no sense, logical.

Read the description. In the end of the movie, the moves a tincan to the border of the table. Take a look how she is sitting in that moment. *

Threading, I'm afraid.[/b]

Ok first of all, you didnt even bother taking the time to read the actual article about her, and about that experience that i posted up with my post...if you were to read..she was examined up and down for and magnets or anything that could help move what was on the table, and besides, if she was using a string to move it..when they put the glass cover over it, i hardly down she would beable to move the tincup without having an effect on the glass...so nice try..but again imma send you the news article so u can actually gather some information and facts before coming up with some lame excuse

http://www.mysteriouspeople.com/Nina_Kulagina.htm

PLEASE READ and gather information before making a conclusion...be like an actual scientist..right now your just making a hypothsis without then doing your experiment..

So read, then post again

Originally posted by spiritofthewolf+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(spiritofthewolf)</div>

Ok first of all, you didnt even bother taking the time to read the actual article about her[/b]

Yes, I am afraid I did.

<!--QuoteBegin-spiritofthewolf

and about that experience that i posted up with my post...if you were to read..she was examined up and down for and magnets or anything that could help move what was on the table, and besides, if she was using a string to move it..when they put the glass cover over it, i hardly down she would beable to move the tincup without having an effect on the glass...so nice try..but again imma send you the news article so u can actually gather some information and facts before coming up with some lame excuse

http://www.mysteriouspeople.com/Nina_Kulagina.htm

PLEASE READ and gather information before making a conclusion...be like an actual scientist..right now your just making a hypothsis without then doing your experiment..

So read, then post again

I must admit though, that I can't explain all the other stuff that is mentioned. But to be honest, I don't believe most of it.

All im going to say is.. Open Your Mind...Everything is possible in your dreams...Your Dreams are just your Reality dazed and confused...They didnt believe we could put a man on the moon...


Marvo let me ask you a question...Do you believe in God? Because I do....Just because you cant see it...Doesnt mean it dont exsist....

On some occasions I do actually say "Thank you god" or "God, please help me out here", but yet, I often say "I don't believe in god". I would love if there actually was a god, but the fact that some person controls the universe like "Doodilidoo", can't be possible in my logic sense.

But the answer would somewhat be yes. I believe that there is a god. [b]But[/i] I don't believe in the christian faith. It's corrupted, and what might've been the truth, has continously been changed by several might-greedy people. Islam is a more "relieable" faith, since it has not been modyfied as heavily, like the christian faith. Not as far as we know afterall.
Even though, I don't believe in Allah either. I don't believe that we have to go to church, I don't believe we have to rituals or sacrifices. If there is a god, he's a just a man sitting somewhere, controlling the entire world. He's allready got the right to control the entire world, that must be far enough. If I had the right to control the entire universe, I wouldn't give a shit if some random tiny little planet somewhere had maybe a billion people sacrificing them selfs to me.
I really don't want dead people in my dailymail. Not even if they're send with a good intension.

What I am trying to say about the subject you brought up, is that not far from all religions are utter bollocks made by people, who saw a good chance to get power, when they saw a cult of people worshipping a god. They then took the idea "god" and added alot of laws, ideas and other stuff, which could bring them incredible might.

We believe in religions, because we need to believe in something. Without religions the world would split apart. But some people saw a good chance here and unfortunately, they used religions to get power.

To end this, my conclusion is:
There certainly is a god, but he/she doesn't have any demands. However, we worship him/her, because that's how our brain works. We need to believe in something. That's why I, no matter how much I actually despise religion, still believe in something. I often get headache, when I try to imagine what was before Big Bang. Believing in a god, is way easier and puts away alot of wasted time, thinking

Everything people don't understand they call it 'coincidence'. It's always like that. I had precognition before, and it wasn't a coincidence. What was that then? How can we judge all things based only on your own "logic sense"? Same with TK. I've never experienced telekinesis before, but I believe it's possible. Why? Because you can't explain everything. Nothing is too small nor too big to lack measures, eh? Is our brain just a pink piece of flesh? How can we absolutely prove it? People these days.... so close-minded.

(By the way, i respect your opinion Marvo, and my intention is just to express mine.)

all i can say about u marvo, is i hope you find your faith someday...not downgrading you at all, everyone has their own beliefes and i respect yours...I can honestly stand here and say I believe in god and Jesus Christ as my savior...A waste of time? Who knows..But i believe and i feel jesus and god...And if you say its a waste a time its ok for you to say that...but on my behalf...I'd rather be safe..then sorry..



take care man

dj

and god bless..i hope you find your way

on this god thing i'll have to agree whit marvo,he's 100%,that was my opinion two

and i have a teory on god,that i got in a wery strange way....

Hoping we can get back on topic here, folks.

I don't think TK has much to do with whether or not God exists.