Thread: Is there more to lucid dreaming than most of us realise?..

Hi,
Your right. Bad choice of words on my part. Change the word born to "has".

This thread is getting really stupid, no offence.

"Having to see something to believe it is being blind to invisible things. People who believe in anything are blind to reality"

"Everything is possible but not everything is true"

Just think about these two quotes I've just invented on the spot! Anyways, back to topic:

I haven't watched the whole video but if you meant that the Dream World might be an actual world that is not just are mind, I will have to say that I don't belive in it because nothing is stable in a dream. Maybe it's some place between the worlds, but being its world itself, I don't think... DCs would be the inhabitant of this world then which would mean that they would be a little bit smarter and stable... I mean, why do some of them just change and don't even realize or some of them are people you know but not really. It would be quite weird if it was true.. So I won't believe in it.


Anyways, I'm not sure this was the thing but yeah...! DreamQueen, I sorta agree with you. I guess that as a child it seemed like a great theory that he might be the chosen one... I don't think that a UFO transforming into a telephone means that he was chosen. I think it represents more his own will to communicate with them or to be the chosen one...

Originally Posted by Neko-san

It's not called being blind, it's just being smart and logical. Why believe in some higher might/spiritual stuff when you got no proof? If you have experienced it somehow your self then it would be logical, but if not then I see no reason to believe.

To me dreaming is just dreaming, nothing spiritual.

Ok my smart logical friend.... how are you ever gonna "see" any of these things if you're completely closed to the idea!? you think their isn't anything more to it and your mind obeys you... it shuts off from seeing anything else beyond your own nose...

you didn't even give it a chance

whatever, i think us humans grow up in a wrold where they make up all these rules, and they become a habit to us... we couldn't possibly believe anything beyond these rules, because its what we 'know' and we have a tendency to be afraid of the unknown, cause we have a tendency to protect ourselves, we stick to what we can "see" and never let go completely in fear of the dangers there might or might not be in the way... so in a way... yes... we choose to be blind sometimes, to maintain a status quo...

pretty sad, but true in a way (in my opinion of course )

My first impression of this guy is that he is sort of a nut job, not because of the material he talks about which is fascinating but because I think he might just be a little in love with him self and a bit delusional. If he is the incarnate of Casey I am disappointed.

I share your faith, however there is no point in getting angry here- a persons beliefs are very personal and aren't going to be swayed by angry statements. It is okay to state what you believe though as testimony top your faith and hope that it gets into a persons heart. The way I see it is that faith is not blind proof is everywhere if we choose to open our eyes. You cannot see the wind, but it is there you can see the effects it has and so you believe. The effects that a spiritual relationship has are there to see.. Today is another day that I woke up again, that I have clothes to wear and food to eat. Life is not a lottery it's an carefully and lovingly orchestrated gift.

It's not called being blind, it's just being smart and logical. Why believe in some higher might/spiritual stuff when you got no proof? If you have experienced it somehow your self then it would be logical, but if not then I see no reason to believe.

Well I challenge you to Why not believe? What do you have to lose? Why is it so hard to fathom that your life is special and it's not a string of random events resulting in death. That this universe is more beautiful and deeper and mysterious than we can ever imagine. I think a life only believing in what you see would be a lonely one.

I have a thought for all of those out there who find it illogical to believe in something at they cannot see- Albert Einstein one of the greatest minds in history and who was a very logical man has many quotes regarding God and the universe. - "I am convinced that He (God) does not play dice." Einstein

Originally Posted by shannyball

Well I challenge you to Why not believe? What do you have to lose? Why is it so hard to fathom that your life is special and it's not a string of random events resulting in death. That this universe is more beautiful and deeper and mysterious than we can ever imagine. I think a life only believing in what you see would be a lonely one.

If what the guy in the video says is fake, then it would proof that believing in something that is not true is a big waste of time. Imagine if he hadn't done this... I'm sure many people have thought him crazy... for a reason (if he's wrong). That can ruin a life to be thought insane and not taken seriously by anyone... to be humiliated and all this for nothing.

My belief is that nothing is white, nothing is black, it's grey. I think that if you have to see to believe, you're missing something but if you're just gonna believe in anything you hear, than you will a victim of some sort of mest up @#!8&

Believing in something that doesn't exist has its side effects but not believing insomething true is not better (if not worst)... Which risk will you take? This is your decision...

ITT: Nobody understands what each other thinks.


I can easily say that you're wrong about how I view believing all together, and I think I can say that for probably all non-believers in this thread.

Originally Posted by jessie1203

Ok my smart logical friend.... how are you ever gonna "see" any of these things if you're completely closed to the idea!? you think their isn't anything more to it and your mind obeys you... it shuts off from seeing anything else beyond your own nose...

you didn't even give it a chance

whatever, i think us humans grow up in a wrold where they make up all these rules, and they become a habit to us... we couldn't possibly believe anything beyond these rules, because its what we 'know' and we have a tendency to be afraid of the unknown, cause we have a tendency to protect ourselves, we stick to what we can "see" and never let go completely in fear of the dangers there might or might not be in the way... so in a way... yes... we choose to be blind sometimes, to maintain a status quo...

pretty sad, but true in a way (in my opinion of course )

You could say pretty much all that to most believers aswell
I consider myself to be a sceptic, as most atheists will do.

This means that we won't ever blindly believe ANYTHING before we have reasons to do so.

Everybody should challenge their own beliefs, to find out if they are wrong.
Blindly believing in God, and dismissing every challenge is being blind.
Blindly dismissing God, and ignoring signs is also being blind.

As a believer, you have to look in the eyes of the challenge, and find the truth. (Not protect your belief, but try to see it from another angle, to see if that might be true.)
As a non believer, you have to consider the other side aswell, for all we know, God could be there, so we have to see it from their angle aswell, and really try to see if it might be true.

Again, don't follow the man who says he has the truth, instead, follow the man who seeks it.

Originally Posted by shannyball

Well I challenge you to Why not believe? What do you have to lose? Why is it so hard to fathom that your life is special and it's not a string of random events resulting in death. That this universe is more beautiful and deeper and mysterious than we can ever imagine. I think a life only believing in what you see would be a lonely one.

I have a thought for all of those out there who find it illogical to believe in something at they cannot see- Albert Einstein one of the greatest minds in history and who was a very logical man has many quotes regarding God and the universe. - "I am convinced that He (God) does not play dice." Einstein

The universe IS beautiful, deep and mysterious, I don't need a God that crazy people tells me about, when I can look up at the stars myself.

That sounded pretty epic in my head, FYI.

I guess you're right

don't know how from reincarnation we went to god but whatever... In a certain way i kinda agree with you... we shouldn't blindly follow just one thing and shut ourselves off from everything else... we should alwasy be open to different points of view, and different ideas with their own little different reasons...

It just sounded kinda like you were closing yourself to the idea the first dude had and tried to impose your own beliefs! that's why i argued, but yeah whatever... i wasn't trying to pick a fight everyone!!

It just kinda' brings me down when womeones trying to ask something and of a sudden things take a GREAT twist and up being some big arguement about something that really has NOTHING to do with the first thing LIKE RIGHT NOW!!
talking about god, when (at least for what I KNOW) the bible doesn't even approve of reincarnation!, at least not the god that most people look up to...

Anyways!! whatever, I guess we all see things and Take what other people say very differently, so if i missunderstood, MY BAD! ok.... back to the topic... (hopefuly)

Originally Posted by shannyball

My first impression of this guy is that he is sort of a nut job, not because of the material he talks about which is fascinating but because I think he might just be a little in love with him self and a bit delusional. If he is the incarnate of Casey I am disappointed.

I share your faith, however there is no point in getting angry here- a persons beliefs are very personal and aren't going to be swayed by angry statements. It is okay to state what you believe though as testimony top your faith and hope that it gets into a persons heart. The way I see it is that faith is not blind proof is everywhere if we choose to open our eyes. You cannot see the wind, but it is there you can see the effects it has and so you believe. The effects that a spiritual relationship has are there to see.. Today is another day that I woke up again, that I have clothes to wear and food to eat. Life is not a lottery it's an carefully and lovingly orchestrated gift.


Well I challenge you to Why not believe? What do you have to lose? Why is it so hard to fathom that your life is special and it's not a string of random events resulting in death. That this universe is more beautiful and deeper and mysterious than we can ever imagine. I think a life only believing in what you see would be a lonely one.

I have a thought for all of those out there who find it illogical to believe in something at they cannot see- Albert Einstein one of the greatest minds in history and who was a very logical man has many quotes regarding God and the universe. - "I am convinced that He (God) does not play dice." Einstein

Why wasting all your life believing when what you believe when most of the truth is just under your nose? I see no reason to believe. For example: I see religion as a tool to get control over people, at least it was before. Just look at back in the days, the church had all the power, people were forced to believe and if you didn't then you would eighter be killed or you would lose a lot of rights as a human being. And why do we not have the gods we had thousands of years ago? What about the egyptian gods? We asume the egyptian gods to be just made up, but what about the gods we believe in now? In a few thousand years we will most likely have new gods and will look back and laught.

I chose to believe what I see, I chose to believe what I have right now and make the best out of it. Yes, if I could chose, then yes I would like that there was a good that created the universe and that we will go to heaven. But no, that's not the truth (for me), we live this life and make the most out of it, and then we die. Our base role on this planet is really to reproduce.

I have a thought for all of those out there who find it illogical to believe in something at they cannot see- Albert Einstein one of the greatest minds in history and who was a very logical man has many quotes regarding God and the universe. - "I am convinced that He (God) does not play dice." Einstein

He was just using God in his lectures to make a point, like you would talk about apples to explain gravity to somebody.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_...eligious_views

The dream world as another real world? I've often thought of that as concept for a movie. Surely somebody's already filmed one. Funny how we can spot a galaxy 15 billion light years away yet the human brain and mind will probably be the last scientific frontier that we conquer. We're barely figuring out how memory works (the non computer kind).

Many who believe in God believe it to the deepest of there being to be true.
Some just get this feeling that cannot be pushed aside, while others don't get a feeling whatsoever. It is this feeling that their beliefs are based on and just because you don't feel it doesn't mean that one who believes is foolish.

You can believe as you wish. As simple as that.

Many of your opinions are very logical. Logic that is based on all your knowledge and everything you know to date, since you were born. One day that logic could be tipped upside down as new discoveries are made. Perhaps discoveries that can actually link the scientific world with the spiritual world.

I live life with an open mind because I am expecting for many discoveries to be made. But this doesn't mean I believe everything I see right now.

Originally Posted by Lucid Lobster

The dream world as another real world? I've often thought of that as concept for a movie. Surely somebody's already filmed one. Funny how we can spot a galaxy 15 billion light years away yet the human brain and mind will probably be the last scientific frontier that we conquer. We're barely figuring out how memory works (the non computer kind).

Hell, we don't even know about the bottom of the sea yet

Sometimes, I get the feeling that, maybe we're going to have a hard time understanding the UNIVERSE untill we understand the things that are right here on Earth with us right now ...

Originally Posted by Maeni

Hell, we don't even know about the bottom of the sea yet

Sometimes, I get the feeling that, maybe we're going to have a hard time understanding the UNIVERSE untill we understand the things that are right here on Earth with us right now ...

I get the no matter how much technology we have or fancy stuff, we'll never get to understand things not even in earth if we don't even understand ourselves!!! we don't even know ourselves! or what we're capable of!! lol till then, we will be blind to everything around us

Very crazy.

Yeah, we're far far far too much ahead with our technology than we are mentally.
Really, think about it, why the fuck would we still need our 'fight or flee' instinct mechanism, and why are our sexual lust so strong?

Nature treats us like we're still so young, and as if we still need 'help' to work...
We're really pretty primitive in some areas, and really far ahead in others. That gives us some pretty fancy conflicts.

We observe everything with our brain, so I agree fully with you, we need to understand the brain before we go on using it for far too advanced stuff

It's like trying to draw with something you don't know what is. Or trying to eat something you don't know what is. Not a good idea.

Except it won't damage us, it just won't give us 100% reliable results

Well I believe in the possibility of there being multiple realities, each with unique qualities and features. For example, there may be another reality where magi indeed does exist, and it's explanation can be proven using the physics of that specific reality, just as readily that you can look at the sun and say it's bright. There may be an alternate reality where there may be a race above humans in evolution.

The way I see it, the more you can imagine a different reality other than your own, the more accepting you would be should they be right. I would rather be called crazy in this life and be proven right in the next, than be closed minded and get blindsided.

I mean think about it. Say one guy believes in no life after death, he will expect it, believe in it and honestly think that when you die, it will just be infinitesimal darkness,a void. Okay, I can accept that, now take another guy, who thinks here will be life after death, that death is just the curtain that separates 2 rooms, one life, the other afterlife, to use a metaphor, and the act of dying is just crossing the threshold. Now lets say, the first man is right, they both die, infinite darkness, abysmal void yada yada.. neither will be conscious to realize who was right and wrong. say the second guy was right, they cross into another life, for sake of argument, they keep their conscious and their memories of their past life. The second guy will realize, hey, I'm right there is an afterlife, the first will probably be blindsided, completely avoiding the subject of an afterlife in life, he will have no idea of what is going on.

Granted this is really a dramatization, my point is, there IS no point in not believing in an afterlife simple b/c of lack of solid evidence, because you have to friggin die to get your proof, I would rather see death as another adventure and be happy in life, and wrong when i die, than fear death as a endless void and be right, after all, who's going to be around to gloat in the void?

Originally Posted by jessie1203

I get the no matter how much technology we have or fancy stuff, we'll never get to understand things not even in earth if we don't even understand ourselves!!! we don't even know ourselves! or what we're capable of!! lol till then, we will be blind to everything around us

I still personnaly think that it is easier to understand what's outside our body...

Originally Posted by Reanchi

Granted this is really a dramatization, my point is, there IS no point in not believing in an afterlife simple b/c of lack of solid evidence, because you have to friggin die to get your proof, I would rather see death as another adventure and be happy in life, and wrong when i die, than fear death as a endless void and be right, after all, who's going to be around to gloat in the void?

Agree 100% ^_^b


I'm gonna be God and get to create my own world when I die.
Hurr durr.

Originally Posted by Maeni

Agree 100% ^_^b


I'm gonna be God and get to create my own world when I die.
Hurr durr.

Lol! yup, same here

Originally Posted by shannyball

Well I challenge you to Why not believe? What do you have to lose? Why is it so hard to fathom that your life is special and it's not a string of random events resulting in death. That this universe is more beautiful and deeper and mysterious than we can ever imagine. I think a life only believing in what you see would be a lonely one.

I have a thought for all of those out there who find it illogical to believe in something at they cannot see- Albert Einstein one of the greatest minds in history and who was a very logical man has many quotes regarding God and the universe. - "I am convinced that He (God) does not play dice." Einstein

Why not believe? Too many choices, all of them with equal proof and unprovable. What do I have to lose? Time, sanity, etc.
There is nothing special about life, it just is. Beauty and mystery are all human concepts from our lack of understanding or rather primitive point of view. Along with randomness. And besides, nobody only believes in what they see.

Einstein didn't believe in a god the way many who use his quotes to prove their point would think. You can clearly see that if you look at his god related quotes.

There is no need for me to believe in gods, souls, chakras or universal energies. It just may seem impossible to people who hold such believes.
Why spoil the true "awesomness" of the universe with trivial and limited ideas that in the end don't even matter. So believe whatever you want to believe as long as you're having fun.

One of my favorite quotes of Einstein's of all time:

"A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death."

Talkin' bout technology. Most people do not realise that our technology is improving exponential. At some point there will be a singularity. Believe it or not, this is what scientists are researching right now at the singularity institute. It's no science fiction. Here's a rather funny video explaining it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFw0MYAS9qA

anyone who tries to use einstein to back up religion fails.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it." - Einstein

Originally Posted by SleepyCookieDough

I still personnaly think that it is easier to understand what's outside our body...

EXACTLY!!! yes it is easier to understand what's outside!!! that's why we focus in that! and we forget to look at ourselves... we don't look at ourselves cause it too hard so we just give up and move on to whatever is easier to understand....

problem is, that can make us blind from seeing what really DOES matter...