Thread: Reporter Flips and Tells it Like it is.

Originally Posted by tommo

Not sure if serious. But it is Hans lol It's from Inception. Fit that video perfectly, made it so epic lol
I love that guy (in the video).

I just wonder, whether it is even possible to make money in the way the second video said, if the system gets changed due to the Occupy movement.
Hopefully they all go bankrupt.

Ah, didn't know hans did inception. Lucky guess on my part about it being Hans. I took a guess because of his Pearl Harbor music like tennessee.

First off what we do now isn't protecting the poor. When companies are failing we bail them out, when the banks were failing we bailed them out, the poor people never got bailed out. What we are doing are protecting the rich. Instead of letting the rich fail when they mess up we reward them and bail them out. That doesn't help the economy or the poor.

Under capitalism however, poor people are not harmed. It is usually the taxes that harm the poor far more than free trade, which actually creates jobs and thus helps the poor.

I prefer communitarian capitalism, whereas tax dollars are and regulations are used to help the poor. But our country has never been very good at that. They tried this shit after the great depression, too. They bailed the banks out, even bailed the pigs out but it wasn't until FDR became president that they started taking initiative for the common people.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

See, I was wondering the same thing. In the video, the guy says he was investing in more 'stable' (can't remember exact word he used at the moment) trends, 'like the U.S. Dollar'. I was under the impression that the U.S. Dollar has been doing pretty poor lately?

The US Dollar will be the flight to safety option for money fleeing the Euro as it crashes. The US Dollar will have a short pop (measured in months) When the Euro goes down, and then the Dollar will crash as well once the systemic ties to a failed Euro start to take effect. In the short term, the Dollar is safe but if you are buying Treasuries for safety, you should be working out your exit strategy even as you are entering that market.

I remember when I realized how easily the US system allows corruption and how no-one seemed to mind (it was on DV, ofc). Really shocked me.

And O, sometimes it seems strange to me that you don't simply use your authority as a mod to end discussions that seems pointless

Originally Posted by khh

And O, sometimes it seems strange to me that you don't simply use your authority as a mod to end discussions that seems pointless

Well, you see, with great power comes.......uhm..........something...
How's that go, again? I forget.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Well, you see, with great power comes.......uhm..........something...
How's that go, again? I forget.

Lotsa bitches.

Originally Posted by Heavy Sleeper

Lotsa bitches.

Oh yeah, that's it!

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Nobody is 'worrying' about the video, and I'm still lost on why you assume that. That video was posted - as I thought was stated and restated - as a wake-up call to people who do not understand the world is run by money. It's not run by ethics, or political values, or any of the other bullshit that people fight about, all the time. The powers that (truly) be don't care about whether the economy is bad, or people are having trouble feeding their families or getting a good education, or how the middle class is being pushed into obscurity. It's a 'money over humanity' philosophy, and some people have a really hard time swallowing that pill.

He was talking about himself though, when he was talking about people not caring about whether things collapse.

It's the same with you, and everybody else; you don't worry about if it's going to collapse, because there's nothing you can possibly do about it: you worry about how to make the best of whatever situation occurs. And this is sensible, 'moral' behaviour.

People in power not caring about the consequences of their decisions except where they impact upon themselves is of course a big modern problem (with asset strippers and all the rest), but I don't recall him ever referring to those people.

I think the greatest investment one could make at this time would be lower-end luxuries.

Take the Lipstick Effect. Basically, when the economy drops people assume luxuries drop as well, but this is not true. The truth is that lower-end luxuries increase while higher end luxuries decrease. I.E. people stop buying expensive fur-coats and use that money to buy cheaper luxury items like lipstick instead.

This makes me agree with the guy in OPs second vid because the US is not likely to go into default. While it may hyper-inflate, the catastrophe caused by hyper-inflation will still not cause the bonds to completely lose their value. You're investing in the integrity of the state which is more reliable than the integrity of the stock market.

Even so, I personally would not spend a dime on bonds but I understand why the guy is promoting them. I'm waging on total government collapse. But that may just be wishful thinking.

The absolute worst time to buy US bonds is right now. We all know inflation is coming, but the bond yields have not yet increased to account for that. If you bought a bond now, you'd be in the situation where either: the yield is WAY below inflation, so holding it is losing you money, or if you sell it after the yields jump, you'll lose money on the bond price. The best time to buy bonds is when inflation is obvious and everyone is aware of it, like in the late 1970s. They had bonds back then with 10+% coupon rates. Now they're less than a percent.

In a hyperinflation situation, treasury bonds can easily become worthless. You could have a 10,000 dollar treasury that is only worth 20 cents in modern terms, because the dollar devalued so much. The worst part however, is that you are locked in and no one is going to buy your treasury bond. You can't sell them in a hyperinflation situation, because people try to spend their money as quickly as possible in order to get the most out of their money, because its losing value so quickly. There are stories of hyperinflation in places, where people got paid and their money was worth half its value by the next day.

You might be able to slip in with a year treasury bond, but 5, 10 or 30 year bonds are insanely risky. Any one who buys a 30 year bond is just stupid. I wouldn't touch that even if there was like 80% rate on it, and right now its like 3%. You have to keep in mind that you are stuck with them for that time period. Right now you can sell them and get out if you need to, but if things go very badly, no one is going to buy them, not even for pennies on the dollar.

Originally Posted by Xei

He was talking about himself though, when he was talking about people not caring about whether things collapse.

He was also talking about the millions of other traders out there, along with firms like Goldman Sachs and - by extension - the rest of the people that 'really rule the world', and about how indifferent they are to the state of the economy and the people living within it. Again, there are a lot of people who still don't understand that concept. I thought (and still think) it was relevant.

And sometimes I wonder if you feign incomprehension, just to try to keep an argument going. If it was really that hard to understand, then I apologize, but I have a hard time believing that you truly didn't get my point.

Whatever, tho. Moving on...

Originally Posted by Alric

In a hyperinflation situation, treasury bonds can easily become worthless. You could have a 10,000 dollar treasury that is only worth 20 cents in modern terms, because the dollar devalued so much. The worst part however, is that you are locked in and no one is going to buy your treasury bond. You can't sell them in a hyperinflation situation, because people try to spend their money as quickly as possible in order to get the most out of their money, because its losing value so quickly. There are stories of hyperinflation in places, where people got paid and their money was worth half its value by the next day.

You might be able to slip in with a year treasury bond, but 5, 10 or 30 year bonds are insanely risky. Any one who buys a 30 year bond is just stupid. I wouldn't touch that even if there was like 80% rate on it, and right now its like 3%. You have to keep in mind that you are stuck with them for that time period. Right now you can sell them and get out if you need to, but if things go very badly, no one is going to buy them, not even for pennies on the dollar.

Like I said, it's best to wait for the time when inflation is obvious and is being priced in, like the late 1970's. It's ok to buy bonds under 10% inflation if the yields are also 10%. But right now, we're in the situation where inflation is high but yields haven't caught up.

By the way, I'm fairly certain the US won't experience a Weimar-style hyperinflation. There's too much vested interest in the game to let that happen. More likely is a currency revaluation, perhaps based on a basket of other (stable) currencies. The welfare recipients will be fucked, but the middle and upper classes will benefit.

Well..... I'm going to retain my fantastic job, my assets, and everything of value that I have. Political propaganda is really just the lower class plebeians trying to feel important in the socio-political spectrum, necessary evil of capitalism: living with lower class.

< SORRY, ALLOW ME TO BE MORE CLEAR >

When I mentioned propaganda, I meant the absurd, unsubstantiated, radically speculated sensationalist theories that stem from unsophisticated, depressed people that unrelentingly try to feel meaningful. In all intents and purposes they get attention, and their voice is heard. But their voice is analogus to a 2 month old baby's voice, and following that, it is pretty silly to seriously consider a 2 month old baby's crying and moaning.

Is it really mind blowing that extremely busy, intelligent, and influential people don't ask for the opinion of the dumbass majority when it actually matters?

That is why there is voting and other trivial democratic pursuits to keep the majority from going into a uproar about their "rights".

Originally Posted by Dreams4free

Political propaganda is really just the lower class plebeians trying to feel important in the socio-political spectrum

Heh. Riiiiight. Because it's only the lower class that engages in political propaganda, yeah?

The problem is the out of control debt. If it keeps going up eventually it gets to the point where it is impossible to pay back unless you use inflation. If they keep letting it go out of control eventually they need massive hyperinflation. At this point we are near the level we can't pay it off, and it keeps getting worse and there is no will in government to fix this problem.

Now unless Ron Paul wins the election, they are probably going to continue the status quo, and by the time they realize they have to fix it, its going to be impossible to pay off.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Heh. Riiiiight. Because it's only the lower class that engages in political propaganda, yeah?

I should of been more clear. I meant absurd, unsubstantiated, radically speculated sensationalist theories that stem from unsophisticated, depressed people that unrelentingly try to feel meaningful. In all intents and purposes they get attention, and their voice is heard. But their voice is analogus to a 2 month old baby's voice, and following that, it is pretty silly to seriously consider a 2 month old baby's crying and moaning.

Is it really mind blowing that extremely busy, intelligent, and influential people don't ask for the opinion of the dumbass majority when it actually matters?

That is why there is voting and other trivial democratic pursuits to keep the majority from going into a uproar about their "rights".

The problem is we often don't have intelligent people in the positions of great influence. Getting elected is often more about appealing to the majority and being 'popular' than about actually knowing anything.

Originally Posted by Dreams4free

But their voice is analogus to a 2 month old baby's voice, and following that, it is pretty silly to seriously consider a 2 month old baby's crying and moaning.

I'll try to keep that in mind, next time I read a news story about a mother putting her infant child in an oven, or dumping their newborn in a river. Everything is relative, and sometimes those newborn children know more about what they actually need to survive than their out-of-touch parents.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

He was also talking about the millions of other traders out there, along with firms like Goldman Sachs and - by extension - the rest of the people that 'really rule the world', and about how indifferent they are to the state of the economy and the people living within it.

There's just one thing I'm wondering about this topic.
Not everyone engages in short selling. Does every big firm do it?
Although I suppose they would if the economy was crashing.
Still, someone has to lose in that situation. So they can't all win, and I
think a lot of them would still be worrying about whether they will survive in the market or not.

Originally Posted by Dreams4free

Well..... I'm going to retain my fantastic job, my assets, and everything of value that I have. Political propaganda is really just the lower class plebeians trying to feel important in the socio-political spectrum, necessary evil of capitalism: living with lower class.

< SORRY, ALLOW ME TO BE MORE CLEAR >

When I mentioned propaganda, I meant the absurd, unsubstantiated, radically speculated sensationalist theories that stem from unsophisticated, depressed people that unrelentingly try to feel meaningful. In all intents and purposes they get attention, and their voice is heard. But their voice is analogus to a 2 month old baby's voice, and following that, it is pretty silly to seriously consider a 2 month old baby's crying and moaning.

Is it really mind blowing that extremely busy, intelligent, and influential people don't ask for the opinion of the dumbass majority when it actually matters?

That is why there is voting and other trivial democratic pursuits to keep the majority from going into a uproar about their "rights".

You are an absolute moron. I do not like you.

People who trade stocks successfully are not necessarily intelligent. Almost anybody can do it. Most people just decide not to spend their life doing something so pointless and trivial and unhelpful.

Also, I like the fact that you say the "plebeians" are kept amused with trivial pursuits to stop them revolting. Yet there are protests going on worldwide right now regarding the rampant corruption in government, who are being bought buy these "intelligent, busy, influential" people.

Don't worry, I used to be similar to you. Had a pretty harsh view of the world and figured anyone who is not well-off financially or looked up to by people is worthless.
It's a pretty sad existence though. I do hope you come around and see things from a different angle.

Originally Posted by Dreams4free

Is it really mind blowing that extremely busy, intelligent, and influential people don't ask for the opinion of the dumbass majority when it actually matters?

Are you referring to the politicians, or the Banks that pay their campaigns? The banks simply don't care about the people if it hurts their bottom line, and what makes you think the politicians are intelligent? Here are three very influential politicians, each dumber and less educated than the last.


And you do know that voting doesn't work right? The banks and other big corporations select who we can vote for. A political campaign costs millions, only the wealthiest can afford that, or those backed by enormous companies.

with the exception of the original post made by the OP, the majority of this thread makes me sick

only the depressed argue that meaningful is something you try to feel