Thread: So let's talk about gun control

Well I'm going to use emotion on this one. When I said accidents I didn't mean literally..

I mean shit like the travon martin situation or where police end up shooting people ( mostly us blacks ),

In all of these cases, people were shot or killed because of fear

Guns are made for killing/hurting someone or something. So if you don't plan on killing or hurting someone..what do you need a gun for????

I just noticed that this forum is mostly conservatives lol

Originally Posted by Majestic

Well I'm going to use emotion on this one. When I said accidents I didn't mean literally..

I mean shit like the travon martin situation or where police end up shooting people ( mostly us blacks ),

In all of these cases, people were shot or killed because of fear

Guns are made for killing/hurting someone or something. So if you don't plan on killing or hurting someone..what do you need a gun for????

I just noticed that this forum is mostly conservatives lol

It's the same reason that police carry firearms. They don't delude themselves into thinking everyone is going to be nice. Unfortunately, we live in a world where people feel entitled to take what is yours, and will do harm to you to do so. I keep a gun because if someone decides to break into my house, or harm me or my family, I will have a means to defend myself.

I hope I never need to use it, but I feel better knowing that if the situation ever arises, I do have a means within reach.

You have to remember:

There are over 80 million registered gun owners in the USA alone. What you see happening, even with mass shootings, that represents less than 1% of 1% of all gun owners. We're talking fractionally insignificant. I see no reason to punish the 99.9999% of people, because of the actions of 0.0001% of the total Gun Owners.

To put it into perspective, it's like stubbing your toe, and getting your whole foot amputated to try to solve the problem of stubbing it.

Originally Posted by Majestic

Well I'm going to use emotion on this one. When I said accidents I didn't mean literally..

I mean shit like the travon martin situation or where police end up shooting people ( mostly us blacks ),

In all of these cases, people were shot or killed because of fear

Guns are made for killing/hurting someone or something. So if you don't plan on killing or hurting someone..what do you need a gun for????

I just noticed that this forum is mostly conservatives lol

It's not actually. I'm not conservative, and I wouldn't claim that my view on the second amendment is a conservative one anymore than universal mind would claim his religious views are liberal. I'm making a rational argument. I think it's terrible what happened to Travon Martin and my honest opinion on gun control is that we need more legislation targeting the police than the people. I believe cops should be fined for removing their guns from their holsters without probable cause, for example.

But making guns illegal won't make them go away. I like the idea of background checks, but I don't think any other limitations should be put in place, and I'm not afraid to say New York was being fucking retarded when they passed that law to ban concealed weapons from schools after Sandy Hook. A concealed weapon can prevent those tragedies. The NRA is being equally retarded by calling for armed guards in schools. The last thing schools need are more cops, and the last way to prevent violence is by removing concealed weapons. It just baffles me to think that only cops should get guns and one should be stationed at every school when all you need is a pistol locked away in the principle's car, or even their office.

Originally Posted by Majestic

I just noticed that this forum is mostly conservatives lol

It's really not. Americans are just fucking obsessed with following the constitution (or bill of rights? whatever) to a T.
So many liberals still want gun rights.

Originally Posted by Original Poster

It's not actually. I'm not conservative, and I wouldn't claim that my view on the second amendment is a conservative one anymore than universal mind would claim his religious views are liberal. I'm making a rational argument. I think it's terrible what happened to Travon Martin and my honest opinion on gun control is that we need more legislation targeting the police than the people. I believe cops should be fined for removing their guns from their holsters without probable cause, for example.

The Trayvon Martin killer was not a cop.

Originally Posted by Original Poster

But making guns illegal won't make them go away. I like the idea of background checks, but I don't think any other limitations should be put in place, and I'm not afraid to say New York was being fucking retarded when they passed that law to ban concealed weapons from schools after Sandy Hook. A concealed weapon can prevent those tragedies. The NRA is being equally retarded by calling for armed guards in schools. The last thing schools need are more cops, and the last way to prevent violence is by removing concealed weapons. It just baffles me to think that only cops should get guns and one should be stationed at every school when all you need is a pistol locked away in the principle's car, or even their office.

YEAH, great idea let more people conceal weapons!
No.

You won't stop a shooting by allowing people to conceal weapons.
Remember that thing in NY where the guy started firing, injured a couple of people, and then the cops came, tried to blast him and ended up severely injuring about 20 people?
And cops are trained with guns, regular people probably aren't. Especially not children (generally).

Armed guards are completely useless, the fact is school shooting are not a big problem, it's goddamned distraction from real issues.
The money it would cost is ridiculous to prevent a tiny amount of deaths.

I'll just copy and paste this post from another thread.

Thing is, with all the guns around in America, there's no way to get rid of them.
And if you look at this graph

hmmm.jpg

You will see what the real problem is.
Hmmmm..... what happened to cause those peaks I wonder?
For the slow, it's the drug war and alcohol prohibition

I have no doubt that they know this. But they want to keep their private prison labour camps going, it's the most profitable business they have
and if they legalised drugs, they'd lose 90% of it.

Gang violence causes the massive spikes. And by gangs I mean opportunistic people who see a demand and try to fill it.
But their trade is illegal, so they can't take disputes to court, they have to kill people.

End the drug war and gun violence/violence in general will go back to around the same level as any other country.

It's really not. Americans are just fucking obsessed with following the constitution (or bill of rights? whatever) to a T.
So many liberals still want gun rights.

Yeah, it's crazy to want to follow the very thing our country was founded on... I know. Having rights and all that is pretty crazy.

The Trayvon Martin killer was not a cop.

There's also more and more proof that has come out corroborating Zimmerman's version of what happened.

YEAH, great idea let more people conceal weapons!
No.

You won't stop a shooting by allowing people to conceal weapons.
Remember that thing in NY where the guy started firing, injured a couple of people, and then the cops came, tried to blast him and ended up severely injuring about 20 people?
And cops are trained with guns, regular people probably aren't. Especially not children (generally).

Clackamas mall shooter faced man with concealed weapon | kgw.com Portland
Pearl High School shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (specifically, the principle who confronted the shooter with his .45)

Yes, you will stop shootings when people are in a position to defend themselves and others. Yes, there are incidents when cops get a little nuts, but that doesn't justify disarming EVERYONE. Cops are not as trained with firearms as people believe. Typically they only need to qualify for their firearm once every 6 months to a year, sometimes longer. There are a great many police who go their entire career without ever having to fire a single shot. Hell, I've probably fired more shots and had more practice with my firearm than many cops in my area.

The idea that if we just disarm people, they'll somehow be safer is ridiculous. You know who will follow those new gun laws? The law abiding citizens. You know who won't? The criminals. There's a reason a great many of these shootings such as Sandy Hook happen in Gun Free zones.

End the drug war and gun violence/violence in general will go back to around the same level as any other country.

This however, I completely agree with. The biggest issue we face is gang violence stemming from the "drug war". If we solve that, we might finally get around to reducing the overall death rate surrounding firearms. It's estimated that anywhere from 50-60% of our overall gun violence stems from Gang on Gang activity.