Thread: How is this possible?

I have often thought about the phenomenon you are describing. Basically you're asking how come we can think about things in dreams without manifesting them in the dreamscape if the dreamscape is taking place where are thoughts form. I'm guessing the process of thought occurs in another part of the brain and there is a conscious filter of some kind that we have some control over that prevents all of our thoughts from leaking into the dream.

Very cool topic - thanks for bringing it up DDP!

Yeah, there definitely must be a specific part or parts of the brain that's generating the dream, like a subprogram that to some extent includes a feedback loop from your reacting mind, but meanwhile you're able to react to the dream. So it's sort of like a single-player video game where part of your mental circuitry is maintaining and controlling the dream in realtime and another part is the 'you' experiencing it.

I guess that's the same setup it uses in waking life to some extent as well - there's the part of the brain that's always processing info coming in from the sensory organs and turning it all into a realtime 3d environment complete with avatars of people or animals that are near you, and this is like an environment in which your 'self' moves and reacts.

I have problems with summoning in lucid dreams so I experience that all the time. Seeing the image of an object I want to summon in my mind but the object doesn't appear in the dream. Somehow I can tell the difference between my imagination in my dream or an actual event that's happening in the dream. Perhaps they are stored in different memories container?

The answer is fairly simple, and the problem is in your original premise, or rather your understanding of reality. When perceiving reality, i.e. external stimuli, the brain is doing the same thing as it is when you are in a dream, perceiving "reality" in the dream. A way of looking at it is that we are always "dreaming" but when we are awake the dreams are bound by external stimuli and when we are sleep, due to sensory deprivation, your brain is able to perceive things freely. So, that is why you still have an imagination/mind's eye when still in a dream, because cognition/perception/the state of being aware is the same whether you are awake or asleep.

I have no direct answer to your question, but what you say about imagination and sensory perception is interesting. While I also see these two phenomena on two different planes of experience, I did not know that the physical representation of them is the same in the brain.

Digging further into it, I believe that there is no such thing as 'outside of the mind', everything is mind. Would this universe be, if it were not perceived? Mind or consciousness is the foundation of all within existence ('I am is the name of God' (and everyone/thing is 'I', the same one actually)), so whether it is visualization, sensory perception or even dream state is irrelevant, because they are (equivalent) results of you existing.

What I'm saying is that there are no things 'stored' outside ourselves to choose from to experience, but you are the direct and self sustaining cause of all experience, invoking the universe out of nothing in every now that you create. But I have no clue on the actual mechanics of this, which is what you are asking about . So perhaps this is off topic, but somehow the OP made me wanna write this

Great thread.

As I see it, and to build with the video game analogy, the subconscious is the video game engine. It makes the laws, keeps the dream chugging along, and feeds in data that builds your dream world. Your conscious mind, the voice inside your head, is the "player", who explores the world and obeys the laws governed by the subconscious.

When you close your eyes and try to summon, your subconscious says "nope, that doesn't work right now. I make the rules."

However, like many PC gamers know, there are things called "console commands." This is when you alter the nature and rules of the ENGINE (your subconscious) to spawn items, kill characters, change the game from night to day, and any number of wacky things. To change our dream engines, we must be ADVANCED lucid dreamers. To summon something in a lucid dream is to edit the nature of your SUBCONSCIOUS. To alter it like a console command and to spawn something into your dream, to negate gravity, to see 360 degrees, etc.

So all in all, I believe that when lucid dreaming the subconscious is that "Separate Place" that does all the calculating, meshing, data uploading and law making. Your subconscious is usually free to think as it likes, so it doesn't abide by standard laws of imagination.

Originally Posted by Nelzi

I have no direct answer to your question, but what you say about imagination and sensory perception is interesting. While I also see these two phenomena on two different planes of experience, I did not know that the physical representation of them is the same in the brain.

Digging further into it, I believe that there is no such thing as 'outside of the mind', everything is mind. Would this universe be, if it were not perceived? Mind or consciousness is the foundation of all within existence ('I am is the name of God' (and everyone/thing is 'I', the same one actually)), so whether it is visualization, sensory perception or even dream state is irrelevant, because they are (equivalent) results of you existing.

What I'm saying is that there are no things 'stored' outside ourselves to choose from to experience, but you are the direct and self sustaining cause of all experience, invoking the universe out of nothing in every now that you create. But I have no clue on the actual mechanics of this, which is what you are asking about . So perhaps this is off topic, but somehow the OP made me wanna write this

I read a quote which is, "There is nothing which can come into human experience, Which does not come as thought." In other words, All things come into a person's life as a thought. I thought my way here, I thought my way to a gas station, I thought my way to having a garden, Etc.

Though I get the feeling I'm repeating something in this topic, Perhaps the quote will be helpful to someone.