Thread: would it be a sin?

Originally Posted by RedfishBluefish

I think if I were God I would leap at the chance to see my creations doing new and interesting things, not just the same old stuff all the time. In addition what right has anyone to care about what two people do together in private, and call it a 'sin'?! Do bisexuals deserve an eternity of torture? Hell no! (no pun intended)
Call me communist if you will, but there it is.

EDIT:
Bisexual - read "person who does bad things in lucid dreams (etc.)"
It basically works out as the same argument.
So, no it's not a sin.

Of course you would do that if you were God, but God isn't like you. He does things differently. He's completely different in the way he thinks.

Originally Posted by dsr

Then when did homosexuality come into existence? (And please don't say that it doesn't exist in the present but is rather a choice certain people make to be different. If that's you're argument, let me inform you that individuals of many other animal species exhibit homosexuality.

I don't know what you mean, homosexuality doesn't "exist", it's just something you are or do. (I don't mean you...)

Oh, I thought you were saying that there is no such thing as a "heterosexual" or "homosexual" but that it's a person's choice to partake in gay acts. I gave the link because the fact that homosexual individuals are present in other species of mammals just like in Homo sapiens suggests that homosexuality is at least partly genetic and proves that it is not some kind of unusual behavior that people exhibit deliberately to be different or whatever. Since this appears not to have been your argument, this whole discussion is irrelevant. Besides, this thread is about whether committing a sin in an LD is a sin IRL, so let's get back on topic. Sorry for going off on a tangent; I just agreed with MoD that the Bible seems to contradict some incredibly strict interpretations of itself such as the idea that while God gives you freedom of thought, you will go to hell for thinking violent thoughts. Nevertheless, God says in Leviticus 20:13 that people who exhibit homosexual behavior should be put to death.

I really look at the new testament dictionary defines Testament as a like a contract. Gods Contract With Humanity. Now alot of Christinaity as a whole is based off of St. Paul not Jesus. Jesus said to love one another Paul says wha does righteousness have with unrighteousness? Paul had alot of pride and he always hated someone. First he hated Christians than he became one and spread a different message than what Christ taught for example:

Sex POV(Point of View) of Paul(1 Corinthians 6:9-10 ): "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."
*CONTRADICTION*
POV of Christ(Matthew 21:32 ): "Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you. 32For John came to you to show you the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes did. And even after you saw this, you did not repent and believe him."



Woman POV of Paul(1 Corinthians 14:34-35 ): "women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. 35If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."
*CONTRADICTION*
POV of Christ: "Just then his disciples returned and were surprised to find him talking with a woman. But no one asked, "What do you want?" or "Why are you talking with her?""
*CONTRADICTION*
Slavery POV of Paul(Ephesians 6:5): "Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ."
POV of Christ(Matthew 23:8): "But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers."

So you see Christainity is founded almost entirely by Paul it seems like. Along with the stereotypes people assume to be comprised of someone devoted to GOD and Jesus Christ. Jesus asked for LOVE. Love others as you would yourself, Love God and Have Unconditional Love. Humanity would drop the hate if we accepted one another for who we are. Jesus went against Social norms. If there is a law that does interfere with Love than it should be taken down.

Paul said to accept those who rule over you Good or Bad. Jesus said to love the lord your God. Accept God's will NOT The Governments will if it goes against God's Will.

Like I said I take mainly from New Testament to prove my points there are a few from Old Testaments by I only take Words of Wisdom like Proverbs, Jobs and Eccelanties(Spelling). Mainly from Christ. Thats why I say I am a true christian not catholic, lutheran or any other denomination of the church. I follow Christ words. Common sense If The Pope told You To Do "A" and God Told You To Do "B." Which would you do? *Times Up* Go with "B!"

Originally Posted by Jeremysr

I don't think you are sinning by being bisexual, but when you do something wrong, bisexually, you are sinning and that's wrong. The reason is, God didn't design us to be bisexual and we are going against God by doing things he didn't design us to do.

But doing something bisexually could just be normal hetero stuff. That makes you all sinners!

Perhaps this should be moved to the Religious Discussion forum...

No. The Extended Discussion forum is not for questions regarding lucid dreaming. We just need to get back on topic (that seems to be mostly my fault).

She's not talking about it's relevance to Lucid Dreaming, she's referring to the amount of religious talk within this thread.

In regard to lucid dreaming or not, things regarding religion are kept in the religion section usually for good reason.
Anyway, "would it be a sin?" how much more of a religious thread is there? We've kind of figured out that it's subjective. Each person thinks something different, and you're not going to get a definitive answer to such a question.

Personally I think this does need moving.

Though, based on Christianity, if you're married and intentionally (lucid) dreamed of having sex with another woman, I believe that the religion states that even the thought of it is adultery.

Originally Posted by Tranquil Toad

I'm not a christian, but from what i read there i wouldn't agree with you. You said "that God examines your heart and mind," so he sees your inner motives and morals regardless of any action you perform. This would lead me to believe that, since in lucid dreams you are essentially only interacting with your subconscious, no one is harmed. And furthermore, you are fully aware that no one is coming to harm (or the woman you are lusting over is actually just part of yourself, the ultimate form of masturbation ), god knows that you do not have ill intentions. As someone mentioned before, it’s essentially the same as killing a person in a video game. Does god look down at me for running all those people over in GTA?

I totally agree with this statement. No one's hurting anyone in a dream, and really, all a dream is is your subconscious. It's common sense!

Originally Posted by towarmforacoat

Some of this is true, but have you ever heard of the reason people have locks on their doors. "It's not to keep bad people out, but it is to keep the good people out," basically, laws are like locks, they can't truly stop people, but they remove temptation from the good people.
I'm sure that although there would be more crime and murder, many of the extra people doing so would really not be evil but tempted. Not to say that they would not be sinning, since temptation is a sin, but they would not be evil people.
Also, if there were no laws in the first place, then that means that people wouldn't be doing something wrong; their perspectives would be different from ours. To us, killing is evil, meanwhile to lawless community, it is just natural impulse.
There is no law in the dream world and no locks to hold you back, so if you just acted impulsively eventually you will get the impulse to kill someone (It happens all the time very naturally) and you would. It works the same with rape and other crimes. This is just what I believe, and if you don't agree, fine.

Interesting quote; I'm liking all the insight on this topic. I thought I'd seen the most looked at topic when I saw the whole "felt-like-the-dream-was-a-month" topic, but I was SO wrong lol! Sorry to bring it up don't wanna change the subject.

Originally Posted by SEBSTER

Wait bro, i think you are judging religious people way too quickly. i mean im not religious but you see religious people think the way they do not because they are afraid of it's outcome but because it is a commandment of their God. Its just people following the rules they have chosen to follow.

I sort of agree w/this. Not only do Christians obey God to follow the rules they've "chosen to follow", but it makes them feel good about themselves, and there's a sort of freedom associated with Christianity. I really don't want to get into all of it, but when you sin, you feel guilt, that's universal. In Christianity, God frees you from all that, and if anyone's not a Christian, then whatever, but there's definately a sense of freedom when you're a Christian. There's more than following rules that they've chosen to follow just for the heck of it. AND they don't want to go to hell when they die.

Originally Posted by Nefarious

Religion was made to allow people belive in something they would think is right and base some kind of a system around it. I am not an Atheis I have no idea how you would call a person like me, I belive in god wich is a system that make things happen and sometimes I might even ask that system for help cause I think it would help me. But I dont like religion at all people have worked something to limit the people in certain things to mentain this belif in god, its just like I would ask for help from that "system" but they made it abit more complicated I dont like that and I dont have any religion.

I could clearly see in a few years that some religions would be totally against lucid dreaming, because like I said religion keeps developing or at least it should cause it did before. The development of humanity makes people atheists the start to belive in science and not in god, religion supose to avoid that and develop together with science.

People explain things they dont understand with either theory or religion, I would rather mix it to a point where I dont need the limits of religion and I donat take theory too seriously untill its a proven fact. However this is going off topic

Well. Alot of stuff to work through on this quote. Religion was not made to allow people to believe in something they think is right!!!! That's ludicrous!! That is a totally twisted view on what religion is!!! Religion is all about believing in what you can't see, and a sense of freedom that comes along with it! It's (normally) a guarantee of what happens to you when you die, NOT a system of what's right and wrong!

Originally Posted by hbash089

to religious people, EVERYTHING is a sin.

TOTALLY not true. I really hope you're being sarcastic.

Originally Posted by MoD

Well, dont rely on the Bible for answers. Its unclear and symbolic. It teaches you to love your neighbour but also tells you to kill homosexuals (very popular among fondumentalists). Thats if your a Christian.

Secondly, the game argument is the best one in this thread. And no, a video game is not diffrent than LDs ( other than compared to LDs it has VERY bad graphics,sound and it limits you to specific actions ). And you dont feel bad about it when you kill someone in a video game... Why not? Because no one got hurt and you didnt really do it.

In a LD, it is simmilar, well ok, I wouldnt play a video game which involves raping... But heck, even that is a videogame. So in a LD its the same. You didnt hurt no one and thats the point.

Now there is the question of you feeling bad about your actions in LDs. Well, thats got absolutely nothing to do with sin, but with you feeling bad about yourself...

Besides, whats with all the sin. God is all forgiving, he doesent punish us... Oh, that depens on which part of the Bible you read... Oh well

yes, you definately should rely on the Bible for answers. Yes, it's confusing, but you work through it and then you take out what is morally right and what God says. It's symbolic, but you interpret what the symbolism means.

Originally Posted by Jeremysr

It was part of the Law in the Old Testament I think. If you were caught doing a homosexual act the Law said you would have to be put to death. Somehow people want to believe the Bible is "wrong" and "evil" so they take that and say that the Bible says "kill homosexuals". But actually it doesn't say anything about "homosexuals", because no one was really homosexual. It wasn't something you were, just something you did. And if you did do it, you were to be put to death. Also, the law doesn't apply today, because it was a law for Moses or whoever to follow for his people. But it is still a sin.

I disagree with this. In the Bible somewhere, I know it says this, it would say "kill the sinful nature" if that's what the Bible meant. if the Bible says to kill homosexuals, then that means kill homosexuals. Frankly, I don't trust the Old Testament, I just trust what Jesus said in the new Testament. Jesus came and made "the old the new" or something like that, and we should trust his words instead of the Old Testaments.

Originally Posted by Jimbo9889

To sidenote: Homosexuality is condemned yes but when the say kill a homosexual they do not mean the person they mean the sin. Kill a Liar means Kill Your Need To Lie. Kill a Homo means Kill your Homosexual Tendencies. Theres a saying in Christianity "Love the sinner, Not the Sin"

But you should work on improving your mind and body. I am not a perfectionist but I am humble and you should humble yourself to the power of your own mind. To be honest its between you and god if doing a lustful act is really a sin in your dreams. I guess I am pulling my own beliefs into it to Philosophize: "If I said it was wrong b/c religion said so an athiest might say to be unbaised and he will bring in his views and say its up to you. So I cant say do it but I cant say dont do it..." So dont bother thinking about it and move on.

OR

"They say when faced with temptation to chose the lesser of two evils. So instead of raping why not just take advantage of a passive and naive person that person would be the person you wanted to rape." I mean thats if the temptation is strong enough to make you do that.

Wierd.

Originally Posted by RedfishBluefish

I think if I were God I would leap at the chance to see my creations doing new and interesting things, not just the same old stuff all the time. In addition what right has anyone to care about what two people do together in private, and call it a 'sin'?! Do bisexuals deserve an eternity of torture? Hell no! (no pun intended)
Call me communist if you will, but there it is.

EDIT:
Bisexual - read "person who does bad things in lucid dreams (etc.)"
It basically works out as the same argument.
So, no it's not a sin.

Very . . . strange quote here.
FIRST: YOU'RE NOT GOD!!! Deal with it! If God wanted His creation to do new and interesting things, he'd do it, without a thought because HE'S GOD!!! If he wanted his creation to do different stuff, He'd make them that way, able to change whenever they wanted.

Wow, alot of text, but well, there it is.

Basically, follow what Jesus taught and not these dogmatics from Paul. If christ was here and told you a message that went against of what Paul said would you not listen to Jesus? So raping I would still say no and focus on the love not the lust of anything.

Originally Posted by Jimbo9889

To sidenote: Homosexuality is condemned yes but when the say kill a homosexual they do not mean the person they mean the sin. Kill a Liar means Kill Your Need To Lie. Kill a Homo means Kill your Homosexual Tendencies. Theres a saying in Christianity "Love the sinner, Not the Sin"

It is proven, that you can't kill your homosexual tendencies. Sure, you can suppress them all you want. That's what I thought a bit about doing, just staying hetero, despite my bisexuality, but I quickly realized, that such a thing is impossible. It will always be there.

And, since I really don't want a sucky life, where I'm unsecure about my sexuality, I'm just gonna accept it, embrace it, and enjoy it.

Originally Posted by dsr

Lonewolf, killing someone in an LD doesn't mean you love violence. Does playing Grand Theft Auto (or any video game rated T or M, for that matter) doom you to hell?

First of all, I don't believe in hell. The teaching of a literal hellfire where people burn eternally is unscriptural actualy. (Hell in the bible is actualy reffered to as the grave). So know playing Grand Theft Auto doesnt doom you to hell, but it does mean you enjoy violence. I have even read in magazines of kids who were influenced by playing games and wanted to act it out and even kill someone. Of course that is extreme but it can still bring on a hostile attitude and that can get you to be more aggressive and agression branches off to different things, more easier to sin.

If you SEEK out in a dream to kill someone it means you want to experience the thrill, especially if you repeatedly do it, it could mean you love violence. I am talking about a FULLY lucid dream, not in just regular semi or pre lucid dreams where you still don't have total control.

Originally Posted by MoD

Well, dont rely on the Bible for answers. Its unclear and symbolic. It teaches you to love your neighbour but also tells you to kill homosexuals (very popular among fondumentalists). Thats if your a Christian.

If you look at the context and cross-reference you can tell which parts of the bible is symbolic. I can show you an example if you want. Also, where in the bible does it say to kill homosexuals? Please quote it.

Originally Posted by MoD

Now there is the question of you feeling bad about your actions in LDs. Well, thats got absolutely nothing to do with sin, but with you feeling bad about yourself...
Besides, whats with all the sin. God is all forgiving, he doesent punish us... Oh, that depens on which part of the Bible you read... Oh well

If you feel bad about yourself you feel guilty and that would mean something hurt your conscience--which would be your morals,
Definition of conscience: the inner sense of what is right or wrong in one's conduct or motives, impelling one toward right action
Also, yes God is forgiving, everyone sins and he forgives them. What he hates is people who PRACTICE sin, who actualy seek it out.

sorry i realized i came in late

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

First of all, I don't believe in hell. The teaching of a literal hellfire where people burn eternally is unscriptural actualy. (Hell in the bible is actualy reffered to as the grave).

While the concepts of heaven and hell are not directly taken from biblical text, I believe heaven is modeled after גן עדן (Garden of Eden where your soul goes to after your body returns to dust) from the Torah/Old Testament, and hell is like a worse version of the purgatory referenced in the Tanach. I don't know if the Old Testament in Christianity encompasses all of the Tanach or just the Torah because I believe purgatory is referenced somewhere in כתובים (eleven books of various writings, the first of which is Psalms). The modern concept of hell, though, was invented by a medieval pope to help control the people iirc.

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

If you SEEK out in a dream to kill someone it means you want to experience the thrill, especially if you repeatedly do it, it could mean you love violence.

If a person is violent IRL, I could see him/her wanting to act violently in an LD, but it's not biconditional. All mammals are animals, but not all animals are mammals. If you shoot someone in an LD because you know no one suffers IRL and it's fun to act out James Bond, then how are you conditioning your mind to love violence? I don't know why, but there seems to be a thrill associated with pulling a trigger. Just look at the success of the paintball industry. You'd be enjoying the thrill of pulling a trigger, not the thrill of ending someone's life (at least if I were the one having "violent" LDs).

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

If you look at the context and cross-reference you can tell which parts of the bible is symbolic. I can show you an example if you want. Also, where in the bible does it say to kill homosexuals? Please quote it.

I already quoted it.

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

...I have even read in magazines of kids who were influenced by playing games and wanted to act it out and even kill someone.

Yeah, OK. You do realize that children also like to lie their asses off to avoid having to tell the truth, right? Kids have blamed everything from games to dares to the devil. Video games have become the cop-out of the ages. Where is personal responsibility?

If you SEEK out in a dream to kill someone it means you want to experience the thrill, especially if you repeatedly do it, it could mean you love violence.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

sorry i realized i came in late

There's an edit button for a reason. That reason is so that you don't keep having three posts in a row within minutes of each other. I'm just saying.

Originally Posted by dsr

your thoughts only matter if they influence your actions, and they won't if your violent thoughts only exist in the context of the imaginary world. If you believe that God gives you freedom of thought but won't tolerate violent thoughts, yet he instructs you to slaughter homosexuals, then please change your beliefs.

1) some religions believe that having lustful thoughts is a sin if you dont do anything about it, even if it doesn't effect your actions
2) God doesn't instruct us to slaughter homosexuals, where did you hear that? He's only instructed us not to be homosexual, (if you believe in God that is)

Originally Posted by dsr

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."
--Leviticus 20:13

So when people say "if you had sex in a dream, it would be like having sex with yourself, so it's not a sin" but if a man "commits adultery" with a woman, it is both their faults,(unless it's rape, then it's just the rapists fault) so that means it would be your fault anyway. It would be like... sorry if this sounds weird... having sex with your mind, but that would make your mind and your thoughts at fault.

Originally Posted by RedfishBluefish

what right has anyone to care about what two people do together in private, and call it a 'sin'?! Do bisexuals deserve an eternity of torture?

answer to first question: God has that right, he's the person who commanded people NOT to do that until they're married and to only do that with the opposite gender
second question: no, being bisexual wont give you an eternity in hell, because there are ways to get to heaven even if you do sin, if that wasn't true then EVERYONE would be damned to hell because it's absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to go a lifetime without doing one wrong thing. also, one sin isn't enough to damn you to hell unless it's very serious like murder or suicide, and still even after that if you feel bad enough about it and repent there are still ways

Originally Posted by Jimbo9889

So you see Christainity is founded almost entirely by Paul it seems like. Along with the stereotypes people assume to be comprised of someone devoted to GOD and Jesus Christ. Jesus asked for LOVE. Love others as you would yourself, Love God and Have Unconditional Love. Humanity would drop the hate if we accepted one another for who we are. Jesus went against Social norms. If there is a law that does interfere with Love than it should be taken down.

Paul said to accept those who rule over you Good or Bad. Jesus said to love the lord your God. Accept God's will NOT The Governments will if it goes against God's Will.

Like I said I take mainly from New Testament to prove my points there are a few from Old Testaments by I only take Words of Wisdom like Proverbs, Jobs and Eccelanties(Spelling). Mainly from Christ. Thats why I say I am a true christian not catholic, lutheran or any other denomination of the church. I follow Christ words. Common sense If The Pope told You To Do "A" and God Told You To Do "B." Which would you do? *Times Up* Go with "B!"

That's a very good perspective, i agree completely

I do remember reading something in the bible saying, along the lines, that if a man has a dream and does something bad in it, they must put them self outside the camp's walls and stay there for the day.
This might not seem so bad but in those days, you would have been easily killed. I can't exactly remember what book it is in but i do remember talking about it. I remember saying its pretty unfair because you can't control a dream, which at that time i thought it was impossible. I'll have to search for it but if it says so when you don't control a dream, then controling a dream is just as bad. Jesus did say that if you think of murdering someone then you have already sinned. True its yourself but you still have the intent of doing murder in a dream and even though its okay, its still the thought what counts. Its pretty unfair as well that your going to murder your self really because its a figment of a dream you made up form yourself.

All verses in the Bible that mention dreams:

Gen 20:3 But God came to Abimelech in a dream in the night, and said to him, Truly you are a dead man because of the woman whom you have taken; for she is a man's wife.
Gen 20:6 And God said to him in the dream, I see that you have done this with an upright heart, and I have kept you from sinning against me: for this reason I did not let you come near her.
Gen 28:12 And he had a dream, and in his dream he saw steps stretching from earth to heaven, and the angels of God were going up and down on them.
Gen 31:10 And at the time when the flock were with young, I saw in a dream that all the he-goats which were joined with the she-goats were banded and marked and coloured.
Gen 31:11 And in my dream the angel of the Lord said to me, Jacob: and I said, Here am I.
Gen 31:24 Then God came to Laban in a dream by night, and said to him, Take care that you say nothing good or bad to Jacob.
Gen 37:5 Now Joseph had a dream, and he gave his brothers an account of it, which made their hate greater than ever.
Gen 37:6 And he said to them, Let me give you the story of my dream.
Gen 37:8 And his brothers said to him, Are you to be our king? will you have authority over us? And because of his dream and his words, their hate for him became greater than ever.
Gen 37:9 Then he had another dream, and gave his brothers an account of it, saying, I have had another dream: the sun and the moon and eleven stars gave honour to me.
Gen 37:10 And he gave word of it to his father and his brothers; but his father protesting said, What sort of a dream is this? am I and your mother and your brothers to go down on our faces to the earth before you?
Gen 37:19 Saying to one another, See, here comes this dreamer.
Gen 37:20 Let us now put him to death and put his body into one of these holes, and we will say, An evil beast has put him to death: then we will see what becomes of his dreams.
Gen 40:5 And these two had a dream on the same night; the chief wine-servant and the chief bread-maker of the king of Egypt, who were in prison, the two of them had dreams with a special sense.
Gen 40:8 Then they said to him, We have had a dream, and no one is able to give us the sense. And Joseph said, Does not the sense of dreams come from God? what was your dream?
Gen 40:9 Then the chief wine-servant gave Joseph an account of his dream, and said, In my dream I saw a vine before me;
Gen 40:12 Then Joseph said, This is the sense of your dream: the three branches are three days;
Gen 40:16 Now when the chief bread-maker saw that the first dream had a good sense, he said to Joseph, I had a dream; and in my dream there were three baskets of white bread on my head;
Gen 40:18 Then Joseph said, This is the sense of your dream: the three baskets are three days;
Gen 41:1 Now after two years had gone by, Pharaoh had a dream; and in his dream he was by the side of the Nile;
Gen 41:5 But he went to sleep again and had a second dream, in which he saw seven heads of grain, full and good, all on one stem.
Gen 41:7 And the seven thin heads made a meal of the good heads. And when Pharaoh was awake he saw it was a dream.
Gen 41:8 And in the morning his spirit was troubled; and he sent for all the wise men of Egypt and all the holy men, and put his dream before them, but no one was able to give him the sense of it.
Gen 41:11 And we had a dream on the same night, the two of us, and the dreams had a special sense.
Gen 41:12 And there was with us a young Hebrew, the captain's servant, and when we put our dreams before him, he gave us the sense of them.
Gen 41:15 And Pharaoh said to Joseph, I have had a dream, and no one is able to give me the sense of it; now it has come to my ears that you are able to give the sense of a dream when it is put before you.
Gen 41:17 Then Pharaoh said, In my dream I was by the side of the Nile:
Gen 41:22 And again in a dream I saw seven heads of grain, full and good, coming up on one stem:
Gen 41:24 And the seven thin heads made a meal of the seven good heads; and I put this dream before the wise men, but not one of them was able to give me the sense of it.
Gen 41:25 Then Joseph said, These two dreams have the same sense: God has made clear to Pharaoh what he is about to do.
Gen 41:32 And this dream came to Pharaoh twice, because this thing is certain, and God will quickly make it come about.
Gen 42:9 Then the memory of his dreams about them came back to Joseph, and he said to them, You have come secretly to see how poor the land is.
Num 12:6 And he said, Now give ear to my words: if there is a prophet among you I will give him knowledge of myself in a vision and will let my words come to him in a dream.
Deu 13:1 If ever you have among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams and he gives you a sign or a wonder,
Deu 13:3 Then give no attention to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams: for the Lord your God is testing you, to see if all the love of your heart and soul is given to him.
Deu 13:5 And that prophet or that dreamer of dreams is to be put to death; for his words were said with the purpose of turning you away from the Lord your God, who took you out of the land of Egypt and made you free from the prison-house; and of forcing you out of the way in which the Lord your God has given you orders to go. So you are to put away the evil from among you.
Jug 7:13 When Gideon came there, a man was giving his friend an account of his dream, saying, See, I had a dream about a cake of barley bread which, falling into the tents of Midian, came on to the tent, overturning it so that it was stretched out flat on the earth.
Jug 7:15 Then Gideon, hearing the story of the dream and the sense in which they took it, gave worship; then he went back to the tents of Israel, and said, Up! for the Lord has given the army of Midian into your hands.
1Sa 28:6 And when Saul went for directions to the Lord, the Lord gave him no answer, by a dream or by the Urim or by the prophets.
1Sa 28:15 And Samuel said to Saul, Why have you made me come up, troubling my rest? And Saul in answer said, I am in great danger; for the Philistines are making war on me, and God has gone away from me and will no longer give me any answer, by the prophets or by dreams: so I have sent for you to make clear to me what I am to do.
1Ki 3:5 In Gibeon, Solomon had a vision of the Lord in a dream by night; and God said to him, Say what I am to give you.
1Ki 3:15 And Solomon, awakening, saw that it was a dream; then he came to Jerusalem, where he went before the ark of the agreement of the Lord, offering burned offerings and peace-offerings; and he made a feast for all his servants.
Job 7:14 Then you send dreams to me, and visions of fear;
Job 20:8 He is gone like a dream, and is not seen again; he goes in flight like a vision of the night.
Job 33:15 In a dream, in a vision of the night, when deep sleep comes on men, while they take their rest on their beds;
Psm 73:20 As a dream when one is awake, they are ended; they are like an image gone out of mind when sleep is over.
Psm 126:1 <A Song of the going up.> When the Lord made a change in Zion's fate, we were like men in a dream.
Ecc 5:3 As a dream comes from much business, so the voice of a foolish man comes with words in great number.
Ecc 5:7 Because much talk comes from dreams and things of no purpose. But let the fear of God be in you.
Isa 29:7 And all the nations making war on Ariel, and all those who are fighting against her and shutting her in with their towers, will be like a dream, like a vision of the night.
Isa 29:8 And it will be like a man desiring food, and dreaming that he is feasting; but when he is awake there is nothing in his mouth: or like a man in need of water, dreaming that he is drinking; but when he is awake he is feeble and his soul is full of desire: so will all the nations be which make war on Mount Zion.Isa 56:10 His watchmen are blind, they are all without knowledge; they are all dogs without tongues, unable to make a sound; stretched out dreaming, loving sleep.
Jer 23:25 My ears have been open to what the prophets have said, who say false words in my name, saying, I have had a dream, I have had a dream, I have had a dream,
Jer 23:27 Whose purpose is to take away the memory of my name from my people by their dreams, of which every man is talking to his neighbour, as their fathers gave up the memory of my name for the Baal.
Jer 23:28 If a prophet has a dream, let him give out his dream; and he who has my word, let him give out my word in good faith. What has the dry stem to do with the grain? says the Lord.
Jer 23:32 See, I am against the prophets of false dreams, says the Lord, who give them out and make my people go out of the way by their deceit and their uncontrolled words: but I did not send them or give them orders; and they will be of no profit to this people, says the Lord.
Jer 27:9 And you are not to give attention to your prophets or your readers of signs or your dreamers or those who see into the future or those who make use of secret arts, who say to you, You will not become servants of the king of Babylon:
Jer 29:8 For this is what the Lord of armies, the God of Israel, has said: Do not let yourselves be tricked by the prophets who are among you, and the readers of signs, and give no attention to their dreams which they may have;
Dan 1:17 Now as for these four young men, God gave them knowledge and made them expert in all book-learning and wisdom: and Daniel was wise in all visions and dreams.
Dan 2:1 In the second year of the rule of Nebuchadnezzar, Nebuchadnezzar had dreams; and his spirit was troubled and his sleep went from him.
Dan 2:2 Then the king gave orders that the wonder-workers, and the users of secret arts, and those who made use of evil powers, and the Chaldaeans, were to be sent for to make clear to the king his dreams. So they came and took their places before the king.
Dan 2:3 And the king said to them, I have had a dream, and my spirit is troubled by the desire to have the dream made clear to me.
Dan 2:4 Then the Chaldaeans said to the king in the Aramaean language, O King, have life for ever: give your servants an account of your dream, and we will make clear to you the sense of it.
Dan 2:5 The king made answer and said to the Chaldaeans, This is my decision: if you do not make clear to me the dream and the sense of it, you will be cut in bits and your houses made waste.
Dan 2:6 But if you make clear the dream and the sense of it, you will have from me offerings and rewards and great honour: so make clear to me the dream and the sense of it.
Dan 2:7 A second time they said in answer, Let the king give his servants an account of his dream, and we will make clear the sense.
Dan 2:9 That if you do not make my dream clear to me there is only one fate for you: for you have made ready false and evil words to say before me till the times are changed: so give me an account of the dream, and I will be certain that you are able to make the sense of it clear.
Dan 2:16 And Daniel went in and made a request to the king to give him time and he would make clear the sense of his dream to the king.
Dan 2:24 For this reason Daniel went to Arioch, to whom the king had given orders for the destruction of the wise men of Babylon, and said to him, Do not put to death the wise men of Babylon: take me in before the king and I will make clear to him the sense of the dream.
Dan 2:25 Then Arioch quickly took Daniel in before the king, and said to him, Here is a man from among the prisoners of Judah, who will make clear to the king the sense of the dream.
Dan 2:26 The king made answer and said to Daniel, whose name was Belteshazzar, Are you able to make clear to me the dream which I saw and its sense?
Dan 2:28 But there is a God in heaven, the unveiler of secrets, and he has given to King Nebuchadnezzar knowledge of what will take place in the last days. Your dreams and the visions of your head on your bed are these:
Dan 2:30 As for me, this secret is not made clear to me because of any wisdom which I have more than any living man, but in order that the sense of the dream may be made clear to the king, and that you may have knowledge of the thoughts of your heart.
Dan 2:36 This is the dream; and we will make clear to the king the sense of it.
Dan 2:45 Because you saw that a stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that by it the iron and the brass and the earth and the silver and the gold were broken to bits, a great God has given the king knowledge of what is to take place in the future: the dream is fixed, and its sense is certain.
Dan 4:5 I saw a dream which was a cause of great fear to me; I was troubled by the images of my mind on my bed, and by the visions of my head.
Dan 4:6 And I gave orders for all the wise men of Babylon to come in before me so that they might make clear to me the sense of my dream.
Dan 4:7 Then the wonder-workers, the users of secret arts, the Chaldaeans, and the readers of signs came in to me: and I put the dream before them but they did not make clear the sense of it to me.
Dan 4:8 But at last Daniel came in before me, he whose name was Belteshazzar, after the name of my god, and in whom is the spirit of the holy gods: and I put the dream before him, saying,
Dan 4:9 O Belteshazzar, master of the wonder-workers, because I am certain that the spirit of the holy gods is in you, and you are troubled by no secret; this is the dream which I saw: make clear to me its sense.
Dan 4:18 This dream I, King Nebuchadnezzar, saw; and do you, O Belteshazzar, make clear the sense of it, for all the wise men of my kingdom are unable to make the sense of it clear to me; but you are able, for the spirit of the holy gods is in you.
Dan 4:19 Then Daniel, whose name was Belteshazzar, was at a loss for a time, his thoughts troubling him. The king made answer and said, Belteshazzar, do not be troubled by the dream or by the sense of it. Belteshazzar, answering, said, My lord, may the dream be about your haters, and its sense about those who are against you.
Dan 5:12 Because a most special spirit, and knowledge and reason and the power of reading dreams and unfolding dark sayings and answering hard questions, were seen to be in him, even in Daniel (named Belteshazzar by the king): now let Daniel be sent for, and he will make clear the sense of the writing.
Dan 7:1 In the first year of Belshazzar, king of Babylon, Daniel saw a dream, and visions came into his head on his bed: then he put the dream in writing.
Joe 2:28 And after that, it will come about, says the Lord, that I will send my spirit on all flesh; and your sons and your daughters will be prophets, your old men will have dreams, your young men will see visions:
Zec 10:2 For the images have said what is not true, and the readers of signs have seen deceit; they have given accounts of false dreams, they give comfort to no purpose: so they go out of the way like sheep, they are troubled because they have no keeper.
Mat 1:20 But when he was giving thought to these things, an angel of the Lord came to him in a dream, saying, Joseph, son of David, have no fear of taking Mary as your wife; because that which is in her body is of the Holy Spirit.
Mat 2:12 And it was made clear to them by God in a dream that they were not to go back to Herod; so they went into their country by another way.
Mat 2:13 And when they had gone, an angel of the Lord came to Joseph in a dream, saying, Get up and take the young child and his mother, and go into Egypt, and do not go from there till I give you word; for Herod will be searching for the young child to put him to death.
Mat 2:19 But when Herod was dead, an angel of the Lord came in a dream to Joseph in Egypt,
Mat 2:22 But when it came to his ears that Archelaus was ruling over Judaea in the place of his father Herod, he was in fear of going there; and God having given him news of the danger in a dream, he went out of the way into the country parts of Galilee.
Mat 27:19 And while he was on the judge's seat, his wife sent to him, saying, Have nothing to do with that upright man, for I have had much trouble this day in a dream because of him.
Act 2:17 And it will come about, in the last days, says God, that I will send out my Spirit on all flesh; and your sons and your daughters will be prophets, and your young men will see visions, and your old men will have dreams:
Jud 1:8 In the same way these dreamers make the flesh unclean, having no respect for authorities, and say evil of rulers.

oh my god.
i wish there was something in the bible mentioning LDs. i would feel hella motivated after haha.

Originally Posted by Mr.caramel

Jesus did say that if you think of murdering someone then you have already sinned.

if you're actually going to do it with intentions of doing it that it becomes a sin, but if someone's talking about it and the thought simply pops into your head, it's not a sin. just thinking about it isn't doing anything wrong if you dont plan on doing it