Thread: Meditation before sleep...LD induction?

I have tried meditating before sleep to induce LD's, and did so for a while, however I then realise my success rate didn't change after I stopped. On another note today I went into the lotus post in an LD (one of my dream goals) and floated around behind my house- was very fun & realistic.

Hah that is cool!

Did you success rate increase when you meditated compared to before?

Originally Posted by BenMurrie

Hah that is cool!

Did you success rate increase when you meditated compared to before?

as I said, it did not- however my success rate is quite high so I might not have noticed the difference (only been actively LD-ing for a month or so)

Depends how you meditate, but meditation can have an effect for sure.

eg: Enter theta state purposely to get vivid images in your mind = more vivid dreams.

I meditate for the sole purpose of dreaming. The meditation technique I use to WILD is the following:

I close my eyes, and place my attention only on the center of my forehead (between my eyebrows) and on my breath. That's it.

Why does it work? Because that is where the pineal gland, the third eye, the minds eye is located. By imagining sensations at that location, you directly stimulate it. The pineal gland is the gland that secretes melatonin, which is one of the hormones responsible for dreaming. You can increase stimulation the better you can concentrate on it and the better you can induce sensations or vibrations in that area. The better your imagination, the better this technique works. The longer you use this technique, the faster you will get into a WILD.

This is a 5000 year old tantra technique, as the story goes, one of the 112 meditations given by Shiva to his consort Parvati. Still works like a charm, and it's the easiest WILD technique out there IMO. This one directly induces dreaming. I also already managed to go into dreaming during meditation without laying down, all I need to do is close my eyes and concentrate for a while. The litteral translation of the tantra technique is the following:

"With intangible breath in center of forehead, as this reaches heart at the moment of sleep, have direction over dreams and over death itself."

ChaybaChayba, that is exactly the meditation technique I use for WILD's! The Brow or Third Eye Chakra is energetically linked to the pineal gland as you know and the pineal gland is also responsible for producing natural DMT - the spirit molecule as well as melatonin, basically DMT is responsible for catalysing the separation of the mind from the body, be it for out of body experiences, when taking psychadelics (that contain DMT) and even at death or near death experiences. I wouldn't rule out it being released in very small amounts when dreaming too.

I also run an energy circuit between the Hara or Dan Tien (energy storage centre I think between the 1st and 2nd Chakras) and up to the Crown Chakra which results in my tounge going numb with vibrations like a car battery is stuck to it LOL (you should have it resting lightly on the roof of your mouth to help close the circuit) I also create an energetic bridge between the crown chakra and the brow. I also run energy through my hands and feet as they have minor energy exchange chakras located there.

After this my entire body is numb with energetic vibrations and I feel the energy body generating as the etheric arms and etheric body start moving independently from the physcial. This is where SP sets in I think, but I think my consciousness is more integrated with the energy body than the physical body at this point to feel typical SP symptoms. Then I just shake myself loose by rolling out of the body, or gyrating or floating upwards, or imagining climbing a rope with my arms etc etc. Then you have a WILD or OBE! I've only achieved this a handful of times though. Working on it more regularly after joining this forum! Its been great for motivation!

I've also entered dreams through meditation but more often than not (since I can't achieve a full lotus posture) my head drops forward and I wake myself up just as I'm immersing into the hypnogogic imagery... I think its better to maintain yourself in the altered state at the threshold of theta and sleep... at the threshold of the veil.

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

I close my eyes, and place my attention only on the center of my forehead (between my eyebrows) and on my breath. That's it.

hmm I'll try this today!

Spread the word! This is the best technique for WILD's I think! :-)

Meditating before bed never got me lucid, it only gave me scary ass hypnogogic imagery. Shadow people, bodiless entities in my room... Freaked me out and I stopped doing it.

btw quick question- do you meditate before the initial sleep or before the wild and for how long? And what's your success rate?

The WILD technique I described is a meditation on itself. All you need to do is that technique. Succesrate? What is success? I always get into a WILD, but it's staying there that's hardest for me.. usually, after a few minutes or even seconds I forget I'm dreaming and lucid dream turns into a normal dream! Or I get too excited and I wake up. WILDing is nothing but a waiting game, if you are too busy with your own thoughts you'll miss the train.

ahh, so you do that technique while trying to WILD?

Originally Posted by yuriythebest

ahh, so you do that technique while trying to WILD?

LOL. No, the technique is WILDing. This technique will induce a dream while you are awake. You only do that technique, nothing else.

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

LOL. No, the technique is WILDing. This technique will induce a dream while you are awake. You only do that technique, nothing else.

right, that's what I meant. so to avoid confusion- you wake 3:30-ish and then lye still while concentrating on your breathing and in between your eyebrows? is there anything else?

Wow I often meditate before going to bed, but normally Zen meditation. This sometimes leads me to coming back to the focus of my attention during meditation (the breath) during a dream, then becoming lucid. Tonight I'll check out this meditation technique

That roof of the mouth thing isn't anything special I do that anyways it atleast seems to make me focus less on salivation/swallowing in my case anyways. The rest of the stuff is just basics of WILD. As for meditation, I didn't notice it really increasing my chance of having a lucid; actually noticed no difference personally.

Originally Posted by yuriythebest

right, that's what I meant. so to avoid confusion- you wake 3:30-ish and then lye still while concentrating on your breathing and in between your eyebrows? is there anything else?

Oh ok, I misread sorry.. and nope, theres nothing else, not that I know off. I don't do anything else, atleast.

Originally Posted by BenMurrie

Right. So generally, what do you think would happen if I meditated for say...20 minutes? And then attempted to Lucid Dream...what would happen/has happened?

And is there any chance of success? You would assume because of the relaxed state, going through the sleep cycles would be quicker and stabler...when that is what I would assume.

I have also heard some uncomfortable experiences people have had with meditating for an hour before going to sleep.

Cheers
Ben

Technically when you meditate your pretty much doing the same thing when you sleep before you dream. Before you goto sleep your breathing slows down and your mind becomes clear of any thoughts. Meditation is pretty much the same.

If you meditated for 20 minutes, the same would happen as if you didn't meditate. Or if you took a nap for 20 minutes, your going to get the same out come.

Forget everything you have heard about meditation.

Before going to sleep, start feeling. Your body against the cool sheets etc., whatever.
Don't visualise this, feel it instead.

Don't go astray following thoughts or ANYTHING.
Don't be expecting anything, just let yourself be completely without conceptions of anything.

Just feel whatsoever totally. From there, figure it out yourself, any guidance will only lead you astray, INCLUDING from your mind.

There is a shifting point from waking life to dream. Be so alert that you do not miss it.

Do not repeat what you have read either, read it once and that's enough.
You don't keep coming back to a signpost to ask for more directions or say it constantly after you've read it, so don't!

Relax.

Hello

Well thank you very much everybody who has commented, this has been really helpful. But don't let this post stop any of you from continuing to post messages discussing meditation.

Well I did try the meditation with focus on the third eye chakra...I had a vivid dream which I still remember which doesn't happen often. So whether that was a coincidence or not, it still sounds like a good meditation technique.

Cloud: I understand your post fully. Meditation could almost be taken to mean being 'present' and thoughtless. So I see what you mean about doing it by feel. I did it by feel once a long time ago...as in I just sat upright and relaxed with no thoughts for about 15 minutes. I was so unbelievably relaxed that I just slipped into a sleep. I think this is a very appropriate way of looking at meditation.

Cheers,
Ben

Originally Posted by ClouD

Forget everything you have heard about meditation.

Before going to sleep, start feeling. Your body against the cool sheets etc., whatever.
Don't visualise this, feel it instead.

Don't go astray following thoughts or ANYTHING.
Don't be expecting anything, just let yourself be completely without conceptions of anything.

Just feel whatsoever totally. From there, figure it out yourself, any guidance will only lead you astray, INCLUDING from your mind.

There is a shifting point from waking life to dream. Be so alert that you do not miss it.

Do not repeat what you have read either, read it once and that's enough.
You don't keep coming back to a signpost to ask for more directions or say it constantly after you've read it, so don't!

Relax.

Thats fantastic advise for everyone here, thanks ClouD. The techniques we discuss are just tools and should not be followed prescriptively or thought about incessantly when trying them,

own the technique don't let the technique own you

It all boils down to being aware... the tactile awareness that ClouD was talking about is a way of being aware of the moment, to be present. This can even be done during the day

being lucid in waking reality.

Originally Posted by Ajna

This can even be done during the day

being lucid in waking reality.

this SHOULD be done during the day. Consider daytime an opportunity to practice for the real deal- and the lucid dream is just an indicator of your progress.

Ah that is exactly right. I suppose everything comes down to the 'Power of Now' if any of you are into that or have read that book. It is by Eckhart Tolle...I highly recommend it...or even 'A New Earth'.

Those books all talk about being present and being aware - living in the present moment...not living in the past or future etc. And I have come to realise that that is also applicable in sleeping...it never dawned on me before for some odd reason.

Do you ever play music while going off to sleep or meditating? Just out of interest.

Yes I think The Power of Now is a fantastic book, he seems to speak right to that part of you that knows... I agree with both of you on this point of awareness

Never tried playing music in that way, I like using a Tibetan singing bowl to help calm the mental static sometimes and I do want to try chanting one day and maybe Indian drumming to induce altered states.

Do you play music when meditating BenMurrie?