Thread: Forced Brief Awakening (FBA) Induction Technique - Early Testing

That's a pity that, for now, the Aurora seems less good at detecting rem than the REM dreamer, and don't do so much more things thant the RD does.
But the good point is if you implement the software you can make it more efficient.

I'm still with my two RemDreamers. Comfort is not an issue to me, I only wear it in the late morning.
I'm trying different settings in term of threshold of sensitivity and use short clues with flash and beep to explore the DEILD approach.

Ezzo, in what does your routine consist exactly when you just have been awoken by the aurora (or anything else) ?
I know you use SOBT (Raduga) and I had been using it with succes when I used supplements , but what are your 3 cycled visualisations?
(just by curiosity).

Originally Posted by Kaan

That's a pity that, for now, the Aurora seems less good at detecting rem than the REM dreamer, and don't do so much more things thant the RD does.
But the good point is if you implement the software you can make it more efficient.

I'm still with my two RemDreamers. Comfort is not an issue to me, I only wear it in the late morning.
I'm trying different settings in term of threshold of sensitivity and use short clues with flash and beep to explore the DEILD approach.

Ezzo, in what does your routine consist exactly when you just have been awoken by the aurora (or anything else) ?
I know you use SOBT (Raduga) and I had been using it with succes when I used supplements , but what are your 3 cycled visualisations?
(just by curiosity).

Hi Kaan, what I do is this... The alarm wakes me and i do my best to remain still. I then spend about 5 seconds doing nothing, thinking nothing as this pulls be back towards sleep (its called forced falling asleep) after about 5 seconds if nothing strange has happened I will then turn my attention to the natural hissing in my ears. Sometimes at this point the hissing will roar into an almighty noise. At this point I will simply get out of bed and find im in an 'obe'. What also might happen is that I experience vibrations over my upper body. If I feel vibrations them I will wait till they calm down and then once again get up into an obe.

If nothing happens with the hissing or theres no vibrations them i wil switch my awareness between 'looking at the back of my eyelids and listening to the hissing for about 5-10 seconds each until a minute has passed.

There no magic here! Its simply a way to keep my awareness alive as my body falls back to sleep.

I also believe that vibrations are a unique (and very common) sensation. Although no one knows what causes these I have a damn good theory which I believe is correct. As we go from awakefulness to rem sleep our body will become paralysed. I believe the vibrations felt is the release of a chemical from the brain into the body to creat the sleep paralysis (much like the release of adrenaline). Once the body has released enough chemicals to paralize the body then the body is asleep and a separation can happen

Many times I have tried to separate whilst the vibrations are actually happening (and this is the advice given in many forums) however if my theory is right then the body is not fully asleep and I can wake myself up whilst attempting to separate.

It makes much more sense to me to wait until the vibrations have stopped as at this point I would have descended past the 'chemical release' and into sleep paralysis and can now separate.

A lot of 'astral projectors' believe that the vibrations are something to do with the soul separating from the body but I dont believe any of that

What do you guys think?

Kaan - id suggest simply 'play dead' for a few seconds and then focus on something like your hearing. The reason I swap my awareness to another sensation is to stop myself falling asleep for real.

Also Kaan - I have great success with RemDreamer but then I started to worry that the sensor that is constantly reading your eye movement could be dangerous to the eye. I contacted some electricians on forums and they said they would never wear the device even though the makers of RemDreamer say its 100% safe - what do you think? For me the rem detection is much much much more reliable than Aurora at present

Ezzo

Originally Posted by ezzolucid

Hi Kaan, what I do is this... The alarm wakes me and i do my best to remain still. I then spend about 5 seconds doing nothing, thinking nothing as this pulls be back towards sleep (its called forced falling asleep) after about 5 seconds if nothing strange has happened I will then turn my attention to the natural hissing in my ears. Sometimes at this point the hissing will roar into an almighty noise. At this point I will simply get out of bed and find im in an 'obe'. What also might happen is that I experience vibrations over my upper body. If I feel vibrations them I will wait till they calm down and then once again get up into an obe.

If nothing happens with the hissing or theres no vibrations them i wil switch my awareness between 'looking at the back of my eyelids and listening to the hissing for about 5-10 seconds each until a minute has passed.

There no magic here! Its simply a way to keep my awareness alive as my body falls back to sleep.

I also believe that vibrations are a unique (and very common) sensation. Although no one knows what causes these I have a damn good theory which I believe is correct. As we go from awakefulness to rem sleep our body will become paralysed. I believe the vibrations felt is the release of a chemical from the brain into the body to creat the sleep paralysis (much like the release of adrenaline). Once the body has released enough chemicals to paralize the body then the body is asleep and a separation can happen

Many times I have tried to separate whilst the vibrations are actually happening (and this is the advice given in many forums) however if my theory is right then the body is not fully asleep and I can wake myself up whilst attempting to separate.

It makes much more sense to me to wait until the vibrations have stopped as at this point I would have descended past the 'chemical release' and into sleep paralysis and can now separate.

A lot of 'astral projectors' believe that the vibrations are something to do with the soul separating from the body but I dont believe any of that

What do you guys think?

Kaan - id suggest simply 'play dead' for a few seconds and then focus on something like your hearing. The reason I swap my awareness to another sensation is to stop myself falling asleep for real.

Also Kaan - I have great success with RemDreamer but then I started to worry that the sensor that is constantly reading your eye movement could be dangerous to the eye. I contacted some electricians on forums and they said they would never wear the device even though the makers of RemDreamer say its 100% safe - what do you think? For me the rem detection is much much much more reliable than Aurora at present

Ezzo

Interesting points.
About the vibrations, I only had one real strong experience of OBE (which I believe is just another kind of WILD) and felt strong vibrations, but most of my WILD/DEILD experiences didn't contain any kind of vibrations.
I don't know where the vibrations come from, I guess it's rather the lack of external stimulus, but here is an interesting quote about REM atonia I found in a wikipedia page about REM sleep

REM atonia, an almost complete paralysis of the body, is accomplished through the inhibition of motor neurons.

When the body shifts into REM sleep, motor neurons throughout the body undergo a process called hyperpolarization: their already-negative membrane potential decreases by another 2–10 millivolts, thereby raising the threshold which a stimulus must overcome to excite them. Muscle inhibition may result from unavailability of monoamine neurotransmitters (restraining the abundance of acetylcholine in the brainstem) and perhaps from mechanisms used in waking muscle inhibition.[44] The medulla oblongata, located between pons and spine, seems to have the capacity for organism-wide muscle inhibition.[45] Some localized twitching and reflexes can still occur.[46] Pupils contract.[14]]

Galantamine + choline make transitions from awake to REM easier but I'd like to be able to achieve the same thing without any supplement, only an alarm that wakes me up from a REM stage..
I have been successful several times without any supplements though (and without alarm, I was lucky) , and It happens when I am focusing on what I'm seeing or on the feeling of touching an object, or when I'm jumping or doing some imaginary body movements.
just before I enter the LD, I don't really see, feel or hear something, it's rather foggy, like a daydream, but few seconds later it becomes very real and I enter in the LD.
I think, like Sageous often says, that focusing on the real body feelings, or vibrations, everything that Sageous calls "noise" can prevent you from entering the LD/OBE.
It sounds better to focus on the feelings that comes from the incoming dream.

I have never thought of just doing nothing during 5 seconds before attempting a visualisation, that's a good idea, I'll test it.

About the infrared LED I don't think it can cause any damage to the eye which is only sensitive to visible light.
Infrared light has at lower frequency than the lowest visible light in the visible spectre, so it's less dangerous than sleeping under the day light , all the more so as your eyelids are closed most of the time while you wear the RemDreamer, aren't they?
I never had any side effect since I have been using RD or even the NovaDreamer 20 years ago.

How long and how strong is the alarm that wakes you up?

On the RD I'm testing 4 flash/beeps with one second between each.
When I notice the beep/flashes, I count them. if there only 3, or 2, or 1 I know that at least one beep/flash is missing which means I was asleep just before.
That's a good indication that the RemDreamer didn't go off when I was awake. So it means that I have chances to achieve a DEILD.

Originally Posted by ezzolucid

I have a damn good theory which I believe is correct. As we go from awakefulness to rem sleep our body will become paralysed. I believe the vibrations felt is the release of a chemical from the brain into the body to creat the sleep paralysis (much like the release of adrenaline). Once the body has released enough chemicals to paralize the body then the body is asleep and a separation can happen.

That is brilliant. I had never heard it before, but it sounds right.

Originally Posted by ezzolucid

A lot of 'astral projectors' believe that the vibrations are something to do with the soul separating from the body but I dont believe any of that.

Depends on what they mean by soul. If it's another way to say the awareness, separating from the physical body as it drops into paralysis, then I would agree - but yeah, many of them mean something much more metaphysical.

Originally Posted by Kaan

REM atonia, an almost complete paralysis of the body, is accomplished through the inhibition of motor neurons.

When the body shifts into REM sleep, motor neurons throughout the body undergo a process called hyperpolarization: their already-negative membrane potential decreases by another 2–10 millivolts, thereby raising the threshold which a stimulus must overcome to excite them. Muscle inhibition may result from unavailability of monoamine neurotransmitters (restraining the abundance of acetylcholine in the brainstem) and perhaps from mechanisms used in waking muscle inhibition.[44] The medulla oblongata, located between pons and spine, seems to have the capacity for organism-wide muscle inhibition.[45] Some localized twitching and reflexes can still occur.[46] Pupils contract.[14]]

Hmmm - sounds like a fancy way to say it causes sleep paralysis.