My Sleep Paralysis Question(s) -- WILD'ing

[DynoTAP]

How possible is it to maintain awareness when doing a WILD at bed time? So far I've been unable to have a lucid dream / go into SP at all when doing it at bed time (around 11 or 12 am), 3-5 am in the morning, and in the afternoon. Every night I go to bed at 10 pm, fall asleep around 12 am and wake up sometime around 8-9 am... so I have a pretty good sleeping pattern. What am I doing wrong? When I started trying to lucid dream I felt a very strong sensation of twitching in my feet - I reckon that was the sleep paralysis beginning. Now when I try I feel nothing. Is this normal? Is it the same with any of you out there? I've taken Raphael's advice and am doing my best to keep what I think he called an "anchor" to the real world to keep me from drifting off to sleep. I don't know what I did right 4 or 5 weeks ago when I was able to drift in and out of SP. Right now getting into sleep paralysis again is my main aim -- lucid dreams will follow. What do you do in order to go into sleep paralysis? -DynoTAP

[KingYoshi]

Hmm...first off, it is difficult to WILD or even reach SP when trying at be time. Though it is very possible, but it is soooo much easier during WBTB or naps. So, is your problem generally lose consciousness and falling asleep normally, or laying awake for long periods of time with no results? Also, what are you using as an anchor?

[DynoTAP]

Hmm...first off, it is difficult to WILD or even reach SP when trying at be time. Though it is very possible, but it is soooo much easier during WBTB or naps. So, is your problem generally lose consciousness and falling asleep normally, or laying awake for long periods of time with no results? Also, what are you using as an anchor? indeed reaching Full SP at bedtime is possible - I have come very close. As for your querstions, my problem would be both. First I lie down for 1-2 hours before I start feeling may be a little numb in my feet then I lie some more until I relax further -- at this point I stop counting -- then fall asleep. I'm very relaxed in the first place. I've used your method (reading a chapter or so) and I've done some other methods such as stretching then tensing and relaxing my muscles. -Dyno

[Robot_Butler]

1-2 hours is way too long to be lying there waiting for a dream. As Yoshi said, do it in the middle of the night when you know you are close to a long block of dreams. What you are probably doing now, is holding onto your awareness through all the early phases of sleep. You could achieve the same results if you slept for the first 2 hours, then woke up and did your WILD attempt in the last 5 minutes. Any wacky stuff you are experiencing is actually you being aware of your first few stages of sleep. There just aren't any solid dreams there for you to jump into, so you float around for a while waiting it out. Does that make sense?

[KingYoshi]

Well, getting into SP really shouldn't take more than 20-30 minutes at the most. Usually less than that. If you are laying there for hours, you either aren't tired enough to WILD, or are doing something to keep yourself from falling asleep. Maybe you need a more subtle anchor like observing the darkness, or listening to your breathing but not counting the breathes, feeling the bed beneath you, etc. Remember, all you are trying to do is fall asleep. I couldn't imagine laying still and awake for over an hour, you have more patience than me . Is this during your WBTB that you are laying for this long? Edit: I believe Robot has nailed it with the first phases of sleep explanation.

[DynoTAP]

@Robot_Butler Just 2 hours? Wow, that's surprises me. I thought I'd need at least 4 hours of sleep before I start WILD'ing. I haven't experienced much wacky stuff at all other than seeing my father when he was still 40 years old That was pretty much the only visual/audio hallucination I had. all the others were sounds.. my mom yelling at me for no reason. can't remember what she was shouting about. I'm sure I had more hallucinations based on sound. You're making perfect sense, but I just don't go all the way into full SP and if I did before (I can only recall one night).. since then, I haven't gone into SP. It's not because I'm afraid, it is as if I have forgotten how -- not that I knew exactly how to in the first place. EDIT: Then again I may have misunderstood your post.

[DynoTAP]

@KingYoshi Should I perhaps read more than one chapter or go to bed later? I will change my anchor to just listening to my breathing (as prescribed) -- I won't count or think anything. Though I really thought it would be best if I did... so that I don't go into an unconscious state of being. Um, in one of your previous posts you said I must not focus on my anchor, could you explain how to do this? As for being patient, I was born patient - just kidding. It is something I have acquired over the years. (this post may undergo some revision). -Dyno

[KingYoshi]

Hmm, I say whichever will make you more tired. You could try them both out and see which one does a better job. Yeah, you don't really want to focus too much attention on anything while WILDing. You want to just relax and just feel as comfortable as you could possibly be. The breathing will be like a running background to your entire process. You don't want to get to where you are forcing your breathing, anticipating it, analyzing it, or thinking too much about it. You just want to hear it as you work toward falling asleep. Once you get into SP, you can use the HH to keep you conscious, but until then, keep your anchor subtle.

[DynoTAP]

@KingYoshi Would the HH be where I start repeating to myself "I'm entering a dream" or something similar?

[KingYoshi]

Yeah, you could do that, but I would just relax and observe the HH. Just experiencing the HH should be enough to anchor you itself.

[DynoTAP]

@KingYoshi I am under the impression that I wasn't tired enough last night when I went to bed because I just couldn't go into SP when I woke up. Also, my headphones fell off my head some time during the night - my MP3 Player is used as an alarm - so I missed the 2 and 4 hour mark (I am forced to wear headphones because the walls here are paper-thin when it comes to sound-proofing). I did wake up later - around 5 or 6 AM but wasn't able to do a WILD because I was too awake and aware by then. As for repeating a mantra to myself during the HH, I think I will rather go with what you said KingYoshi and leave the mantra out. May be I'll do it before I start WILD'ing

[KingYoshi]

Yeah, mantras are very helpful, but with WILDs they really tip-toe that line of keeping you too conscious/focused. I know there are plenty out there who have been successful using mantras with WILDs, but I have never had success with them (with regards to WILDing. they are great for aiding DILD/MILDs). They tend to keep me awake and there is nothing I hate more while WILDing than laying awake for long periods of time with limited results. I try to stay on the tired side as much as possible. Even if you fail by losing consciousness and falling asleep normally, your mind was on dreaming up to the end. This alone can help spark DILDs.

[DynoTAP]

Hey thanks for checking in on my thread, you have been very supportive.

[DynoTAP]

[QUOTE=KingYoshi;1635080]Yeah, mantras are very helpful, but with WILDs they really tip-toe that line of keeping you too conscious/focused. I know there are plenty out there who have been successful using mantras with WILDs, but I have never had success with them (with regards to WILDing. they are great for aiding DILD/MILDs). They tend to keep me awake and there is nothing I hate more while WILDing than laying awake for long periods of time with limited results. I try to stay on the tired side as much as possible. Even if you fail by losing consciousness and falling asleep normally, your mind was on dreaming up to the end. This alone can help spark DILDs.[/QUOTE Heck, that would be why I could never attain full SP when WILD'ing before-- I stopped saying the mantras for the most part after unsuccessfully trying to enter the first stages of SP more recently. By the way does it feel like you are giving into tiredness just before you go into transition?

[KingYoshi]

Yeah, once you get to that point, just give-in to the tiredness. Allow SP to set in and just takeover control of the situation.

[DynoTAP]

Yeah, once you get to that point, just give-in to the tiredness. Allow SP to set in and just takeover control of the situation. Man, I've then been so close to full SP (though it must have been weeks ago). When I felt the wave of tiredness coming on, I would get a fright thinking I was falling asleep so I'd start repeating a mantra over and over until I was back in my comfort zone. Alright, well I look more forward to tonight. Last night was yet another fail -- I think I lay still for just under 4 hours. Earlier in the day I went to my favorite coffee/chocolate shop, had coffee a bit too late in the afternoon. Thanks for answering that question, I'm certain it will help for future WILD attempts. EDIT: I must add that my legs and arms were numb after a while of laying still.

[Robot_Butler]

I agree that, given the choice, it is always better to fall asleep early than be too awake. Like Yoshi said, practice falling asleep while just watching your HH, thoughts and what happens as you transition. If this doesn't give you a lucid dream, it will at least help you understand how you fall asleep.

[DynoTAP]

I agree that, given the choice, it is always better to fall asleep early than be too awake. Like Yoshi said, practice falling asleep while just watching your HH, thoughts and what happens as you transition. If this doesn't give you a lucid dream, it will at least help you understand how you fall asleep. Wow that piece of information must have slipped right by. Thanks for pointing it out and putting some emphasis on it. Regarding your most recent reply, I feel like sleep paralysis is my current goal. Once I am able to enter SP quickly and easily I will then see if I can lucid dream.

[JessLapin]

You might be trying too hard. When I first started trying to WILD I was so focussed on it that it didn't happen, it was when I relaxed and let my mind wander a bit that the random thoughts started turning into dream imagery. I always find it works best after about 4 hours sleep.

[DynoTAP]

Just being curious, once you have succeeded in reaching full sleep paralysis and have given in to the wave of tiredness, do you just find yourself in a dream? I've read that some people imagine having a second body and step into their dream world, is there perhaps an easier method? Is this even necessary? What do you do instead?

[KingYoshi]

Once full SP sets in, I just wait for the dream scene to form around me. I then simply stand up and carry on with the dream. Sometimes, I am already standing, but most of the time I am still laying down in the same position I was already in. I wouldn't worry about any complex techniques for entering into the dream. Just wait for the dream to form around you and you should be fine. If you have any difficulties, we can help you out with those if they come.

[DynoTAP]

Hi all, I haven't written back for quite a few days now. I am finding it increasingly difficult to do a WILD or WBTB after waking up in the middle of the night. It's not that I find it impossible, I'm just too sleepy to realise that I must do a WBTB. Can anyone relate to this? I feel a greater need to practice the WILD method at bedtime -- even if it takes me longer.

[KingYoshi]

Sure, I can thing of many times where I have intended to perform a WBTB WILD, and never made it out of bed . I suggest setting your alarm clock away from you so you have to literally get up to turn it off. If this isn't possible, you can try to leave a glass of water at your bedside, and when you alarm goes off, chug the glass of water. It should wake you up enough so you can perform a proper WBTB. You could also try to drink some fluids just before bed, so during your WBTB, you will have to get up to go use the restroom.

[DynoTAP]

My sister said she induced a lucid dream when she was 11. She told me she that she would think of a certain object wanted to put into her dream -- a bottled genie in her case (something that couldn't possibly exist in reality) -- and apparently it worked. I cannot say it would have worked immediately, but I am sure time took care of it for her.

[DynoTAP]

Sure, I can thing of many times where I have intended to perform a WBTB WILD, and never made it out of bed . I suggest setting your alarm clock away from you so you have to literally get up to turn it off. If this isn't possible, you can try to leave a glass of water at your bedside, and when you alarm goes off, chug the glass of water. It should wake you up enough so you can perform a proper WBTB. You could also try to drink some fluids just before bed, so during your WBTB, you will have to get up to go use the restroom. In reply to your suggestions, I do drink 3 tall glasses of water before bed though I haven't tried drinking water before doing a WILD at the middle of the night.