Verdict On Sleep Paralysis?

**xpin2winx** · 09-16-2012 06:32 PM

Alright, there is too much confusion on this board about Sleep Paralysis. I read Sleep Paralysis Demystified by Mzzck and they were thinking of changing the name to Sleep Awareness. It seems to me that half the people who talk about sleep paralysis dont even refer to actual Sleep Paralysis where you wake up in REM sleep fully paralyzed.

So what exactly is Sleep Paralysis if it isnt full body paralysis?

**Sivason** · 09-16-2012 09:32 PM

In medical science there is a sleep disorder called sleep paralysis. It has nothing to do with lucid dreaming, at least not for anyone who does not have the medical disorder. Those unlucky people with the disorder sometimes wake but can not move and have scary intense feelings at the same time.

Why the confusion? Some people reported once upon a time that they could take advantage of this disorder in order to lucid dream. An interesting thing for those people who have this some what rare disorder. The problem is that the method will not work for the vast majority who do not have the problem.

The state is caused by a chemical change that happens during sleep. It is called REM atonia, which simply translates to 'no muscle tone in REM sleep.' Normally REM atonia only prevents you from acting out your dreams. It will not prevent willful concious movement. Imagine you are dreaming and your alarm goes off, you can reluctantly force yourself to reach over and hit the snooze button. Dispite being in REM atonia it just seems burdensom to reachover and hit snooze. It may even feal hateful and difficult, but almost everyone can do it. Now, imagine a kid pokes your foot with a needle while you are dreaming, most people can jump right out of bed and start yelling at him, with little to no effort.

In most conversations about trying to WILD the term SP has come to be used to describe the state where your body has fallen asleep and moving is going to require concious intent. We have all used it a little differently I assume. For me it means a mile post along the way, so I can judge if I am asleep, and when I should stop using an ancor and move to trying to initiate an LD.

The major problem with us all refering to the chemical change that you can feel happen when REM atonia or other clear signs of true sleep arise, as SP is that it confuses everybody. If you reach that state then you are honestly truely asleep! So, if you foolishly attempt to move your body to test the supposed SP, then you will be able to move and you will wake yourself up! trying to test SP by moving, is likely the most common mistake keeping people from pulling off a WILD.

Simplified: The term SP has come to mean the state where you are finally asleep and can start trying to dream, but it is confusing, because it ONLY prevents dream movement from becoming actual movement. It does NOT prevent intentional movement. This misunderstanding with beginners causes them to constantly wake themselves up and ruin their WILD attempt, by attempting to test SP.

Sleep Awarness: I think if we used a term like this, it would be less confusing. The idea is that you can feel the point when your body uses chemical changes to keep you from acting out your dream. By being AWARE of the sensation, and knowing what it should feel like and what you should expect, then you will know when to try and transition into a dream state. This is infact more or less exactly how we have all been using the term SP. However, the term SP has caused endless misunderstandings, so many of us wish there was some way to stop using it and stop confusing beginners.

**idkwhattoput** · 09-17-2012 12:30 AM

weeelllllll

**AURON** · 09-17-2012 01:54 AM

Here we go.

SP=Body can't move during NREM, eyes can open. Traditionally happens while waking up (hypnopompic) , but can occur while going to sleep (Hypnagogic). (generally happens once in a persons lifetime, or multiple occasions if the person has ISP[/B] )
REM Atonia=Body can't move during REM. (happens every night for normal people)
Transitional Phase=NREM state where HI HH occur. Can lead to NREM or REM dreaming. (this is what happens when people normally attempt a WILD and get close)
Isolated Sleep Paralysis (ISP)= condition where a person chronically goes into SP throughout their lifetimes (rare)

SP checklist
[ ]have you ever had the inability to move your body while waking up or going to sleep?

ISP checklist
[ ]have you ever had the inablility to move your body while waking up or going to sleep several times a month/week/year?

Conclusion....if you don't have Isolated Sleep Paralysis, then don't worry about going through SP to WILD....you're probably not going to ever get it. If you DO have ISP, you should have reached SP several times in your life before you even knew about lucid dreaming, but you're still not guaranteed to get SP while trying to WILD.

bonus FAQ

Spoiler for DAT BONUS:

**Empedocles** · 09-17-2012 03:40 AM

Why complicate things this much?

Sleep paralysis cannot be mistaken for anything else. It is literally being unable to move. It feels as if you are being "blocked". Everything, your arms, your legs, your head. In SP I have to try very hard, with great strength, to move my head, and that way (with lots of "pushing") I am able to break SP. It feels exhausting afterwards. So if someone describes their experience as finding it difficult to move, but nonetheless being able to move, then he/she definitely did not experience SP.

The problem: Some people have never experienced SP, and therefore they will mistaken SP for something else which isn't even remotely related to it.

SP happens either 1.) when falling asleep, or 2.) when waking up.

I have had SP since I was a kid, but I also know many people even in their 60s who have never experienced it. Why that is, I don't know, it beats me. But those who experienced sleep paralysis will know they had it. There is no doubt about it.

Therefore, let's keep it simple. When you feel sleep paralysis, you won't be able to move. It will feel as if you are stuck in an extremely tight box with no space whatsoever. The best way to "get out of it" seems to vary from person to person. For me, it's attempting to move my head with great effort, and then I break out of it.

SP feels uncomfortable, especially to people who don't know what it is, or to those who aren't used to it. For me, an experienced lucid dreamer who also experienced SP countless times, sometimes I feel absolutely OK with it, and I use it to go into a WILD, but yet other times it feels uncomfortable and I simply have to break out of it.

Either way, SP is a feeling you can't mistake for anything else.

**Sivason** · 09-17-2012 04:09 AM

Originally Posted by Gills

Why complicate things this much?

Sleep paralysis cannot be mistaken for anything else. It is literally being unable to move. It feels as if you are being "blocked". Everything, your arms, your legs, your head. In SP I have to try very hard, with great strength, to move my head, and that way (with lots of "pushing") I am able to break SP. It feels exhausting afterwards. So if someone describes their experience as finding it difficult to move, but nonetheless being able to move, then he/she definitely did not experience SP.

The problem: Some people have never experienced SP, and therefore they will mistaken SP for something else which isn't even remotely related to it.

SP happens either 1.) when falling asleep, or 2.) when waking up.

I have had SP since I was a kid, but I also know many people even in their 60s who have never experienced it. Why that is, I don't know, it beats me. But those who experienced sleep paralysis will know they had it. There is no doubt about it.

Therefore, let's keep it simple. When you feel sleep paralysis, you won't be able to move. It will feel as if you are stuck in an extremely tight box with no space whatsoever. The best way to "get out of it" seems to vary from person to person. For me, it's attempting to move my head with great effort, and then I break out of it.

SP feels uncomfortable, especially to people who don't know what it is, or to those who aren't used to it. For me, an experienced lucid dreamer who also experienced SP countless times, sometimes I feel absolutely OK with it, and I use it to go into a WILD, but yet other times it feels uncomfortable and I simply have to break out of it.

Either way, SP is a feeling you can't mistake for anything else.

Thanks for a first hand account Gills. Gills is clearly explaining what SP really is according to the correct scientific version of SP. The fact is simply that somehow we, as a group, have been using the term SP to describe something else. The majority of us will never experience true SP like Gills is describing, and that is why so many of us are frustrated with the fact that the term is being used to describe a state in WILD attempts. SP like Gills describes is fairly rare, and perhaps it can be used as a tool for lucidity, but that will have no impact on the majority. You can not reach a state of true medical SP, unless like Gills, it is a condition you have.

The state most of us experience is just an awareness of being asleep, and having our motor function supressed. It is helpful in identifying when to attempt a transition, but by no means is the kind of SP Gills describes. It really should not be called SP. Thanks again Gills for explaining, first hand, what actual SP is like.
To clarify the difference, Gills is sayng he must try very hard, with great strength, to break it,, and most of us would be able to break out of the state (REM atonia and other states) with only a serious intention. Think about when you wake and getting up seems dreadful and very difficult. That is clearly not what Gills describes. It is what the LD community in general has been calling SP, but it is just a state to prevent dream movement, not true SP.

Now, if we look at Auron's post, the state he is calling REM atonia is one of the states that is often mislabled as SP. You can feel it begin, and it gets written up in guides, as 'when you feel yourself enter SP' Other states that occur in nREM are also mislabled as SP.

It is best for people learning to WILD to not think about SP at all! Do not try to move your body, because you are trying to stay asleep, and moving may wake your body. If you have the SP medical condition, you already know it. Then I guess you could ask someone like Gills to share his thoughts on how it could be useful. If you are like most people true SP will never be part of the WILD equation.