Exploration of methods to lower processing power of dreams.

[AtomskThePirate]

In my experience and others more vivid and intense dreams cause people to lose lucidness or wake up altogether. I hypothesize that the cause of this in some cases is due to the processing power that an individuals dream is using exceeds the limit that the mind is capable or willing to give. For this reason I would like to begin devolving test to explore this hypothesis and methods to reduce the processing power required of our dreams. I myself am still a novice at best at LD and cant maintain an LD for more than a minute or two. For this reason it would be great if any experienced LDrs could perform these test. In my opinion reducing the amount of visual data we have to interpret in a dream would be a good place to start. I think the reason it is hard to change light levels in dream is because just like in a video game this requires an intense amount of processing power to render all of the shadows. So maybe we could develop a test around dreaming in black and white or some how removing the presence of shadows. This is just a place to start. It would be awesome to see what ideas you guys can come up with and I think we may be able to find some ways to really improve what we can do in our dreams.

[Mzzkc]

Before this gets out of hand, I think you need to do a little research on brain functionality. Touching up on low level computer architecture might help you see where your idea has some flaws as well. Long story short: processing power isn't an issue. To piggy-back off the video game analogy (which is silly and inaccurate, but it'll get the point across), take the most graphically stunning game you've ever seen running smoothly on one of today's high-end gaming rigs. Impressive as those visuals may be, the software itself often uses thousands of processing shortcuts to make everything run smoothly (think 2-D backdrops, un-rendered environments, non-functioning objects, and the like). Our brains tend to do much the same thing, but the "shortcuts" it uses are already built in. I don't know how familiar you are with the concept of loading large amounts of 'unused' information in memory while retaining access to that information via pointers, but our brains use much the same approach as dreams progress. Everything the brain might need is already stored in memory (which is a huge space, by the way), and it only takes a simple reference to pull out that information and use it. Now, take that to the next extreme. In 2007 the sum of world's computational processing power was equivalent to that of a single human brain.* So not only are we dealing with a system that makes excellent use of its own hardware, but puts the gaming rigs the world over the shame. Now. With that all out of the way, maybe you should start looking into other ways of prolonging your lucid experience that doesn't involve making the environment visually worse.

[johoiada]

Damn Mzzkc that was harsh! You having a bad day? I know the thread was a bit nonsensical but, i don't think it deserved such a reaction. I mean, the guy did only join last month. Atom, I suggest you do a bit of research before presenting ideas in the future so as to avoid reactions similar to this. That being said, I still think that reaction was completely uncalled for and doesn't reflect the way we usually welcome newbies here at DV. I think an apology is in order Mzzkc. Go on.......

[Mzzkc]

Not harsh. Informative. I will not apologize for presenting information in an attempt to dissuade misinformation. I understood the guy is new, so I figured I'd help impart some useful knowledge before other newbies started chiming in with support for this idea (not a huge fan of the whole "blind leading the blind" thing). To be fair, the idea showed creative thinking and originality, but its premises were flawed. I wouldn't have bothered posting anything if I didn't see some value in the guy. XP Hopefully he'll be able to use that sort of thinking to great effect down the road when his foundations are solidly developed.

[johoiada]

I'll have to agree with you that it is informative, but i'm pretty sure i saw a bit of sarcasm in there. That is the part that i found to be unnecessary. But then again, maybe that's just the way you usually speak. I would have handled it a bit differently is all I'm saying. Though i do understand you reasoning. HA! it's my hundredth post! Yay!

[Mzzkc]

Sarcasm? Me? In all seriousness, that's just how my prose develops when I don't have time to edit or write carefully. I packed a lot of information in there and, yes, some of it can only be inferred, but none of it was sarcasm.

[johoiada]

Well then it's all good. People who speak in a candid manner as you do sometimes come off as rude. As long as it isn't taken as a rude reply then I'm alright.

[Sivason]

In my experience and others more vivid and intense dreams cause people to lose lucidness or wake up altogether. I hypothesize that the cause of this in some cases is due to the processing power that an individuals dream is using exceeds the limit that the mind is capable or willing to give. For this reason I would like to begin devolving test to explore this hypothesis and methods to reduce the processing power required of our dreams. I myself am still a novice at best at LD and cant maintain an LD for more than a minute or two. For this reason it would be great if any experienced LDrs could perform these test. In my opinion reducing the amount of visual data we have to interpret in a dream would be a good place to start. I think the reason it is hard to change light levels in dream is because just like in a video game this requires an intense amount of processing power to render all of the shadows. So maybe we could develop a test around dreaming in black and white or some how removing the presence of shadows. This is just a place to start. It would be awesome to see what ideas you guys can come up with and I think we may be able to find some ways to really improve what we can do in our dreams. Hmmm, misbehaving,,, I will be friendly. The idea may not work just as you say, but lets see if we can still fit the idea in somewhere that works. The other dreamers got unnerved because they work so hard to turn up there vividness and contrast. If they have had a few real good LDs they saw first hand that there is no need to turn down anything. You are wired to go! So maybe we could turn down the processingg power by hosting our LD in about the second phase of nREM. If you tagged along a WILD attemmpt and found the right type of nREM you are free to dream there. Bingo! This is the land of low resolution. I start my LDs early this way so I don't get bored and am stablized before REM hits. The LD can involve anything you can picture, but you may have to create everything. nREM dreams are not full of cool DCs or unexpected action. Everything about nREM dreams screams "lower processing power" OK, so if we accept that students could be taught to enter nREM dreams instead, what would we benifit? It is easy to see one huge benifit. In nREM dreams the plot is almost not there. The story really only evolves if you take part in it. Here a person can train basic skills like creating a fire ball, learn to use there body or transform. The experiences are still cool, but just in very low res. So here we have turned down the res and provide a place where animals dont jump out at you aand your ex-wife never burst in. That has to be a benifit for some people. Sorry you got harshed. Keep playing, it is a good group here. I hope you don't mind me trying to validate your whole premis.

[AtomskThePirate]

Ok, lot of responses here. Well to start off, It was just a hypothesis. I did jump the gun with proposing a whole research project. I should have just proposed the question. Mzzkc rights I shouldn't have questioned the brains power to dream. I know full well the brain has the power to dream amazing things, I was foolish to phrase my words that way. Now I will try to restate my hypothesis. I believe that some people who are losing stability of their dreams are experiencing this because there dream is requires more processing power than they can use and optimization of processing power would lead to more stable dreams. Now to sivason. I would like to say if optimization of processing power is possible to developed in dreams i think it would mean a dreamer could use that freed processing power to focus on increasing the quality of other aspects of the dream. It happens to be late and I have some dreaming to do. I hope this response has clarified things and maybe some of you will have less to be upset about.