What Would You Do....

[DeeryTheDeer]

If a complete stranger got in an elevator with you at 4 in the morning and asked you to come to their hotel room and chat and have coffee? Would you accept? Would you feel uncomfortable, especially not knowing that person at all? To be alone with them in a hotel room? Well, apparently the entire internet thinks that this feminist atheist who admits to feeling uncomfortable and pressured in a situation like that is an overreacting, man hating retard. Honestly, I was waiting for the moment where she'd make an extremely stupid statement that was worthy of such epic ridicule, even from TheAmazingAtheist, but I don't see it. She seems rather calm and intelligent, and everyone else has got their hair on fire screaming obscenities at the top of their lungs over this. Am I a man-hating radical extremist for agreeing with her? I'm not offended at all if someone compliments me, in fact I wish someone would, and I wouldn't mind if someone asked me out at a reasonable hour in a public place, but nobody seems to get it through their thick skulls that this situation is different and calls for a sense of caution and inappropriateness. Maybe he really did just want to "chat" with her in his hotel room, but I find that extremely unusual, and I've never heard of people doing that without sex being involved, or even as a warning sign of rape. This stuff does happen, and if she thought nothing of it and he did end up raping her, she'd be called out as a stupid bitch who should have known better than to go in a hotel room alone with a stranger. Thoughts?

[Seroquel]

I would go with him if he was handsome.

[Alric]

It probably was harmless, but I think 99% of people with common sense are not going to follow strangers into private locations late at night. That is basically how you get kidnapped or raped and stuff. And even if you thought it was common to invite people to your hotel room, a person is allowed to turn down anyone they want, for any reason they want.

[Savy]

This is sickening. Everything she said was completely rational, and yet look at the reaction she's getting. People are calling her man-hating and a prude just because she wouldn't go into some stranger's hotel room at 4 in the morning. I just don't understand. Our society must be more sexist than I believed it to be...

[Darkmatters]

This is sickening. I just don't understand. Our society most be more sexist than I believed it to be... I don't think it's that so much as that people on YouTube are a bunch of narcissistic freaks who love to get riled up and start screaming obscenities.

[Zhaylin]

WOW! A lot of those comments were really out of line! I think some people may have had issue with the way she presented the story. She just assumed (seemingly as fact) that this man had the worst of intentions. But we weren't there. He might have been trying to get under her skin more than in her pants because she said: '... don't do that *especially* after I just talked about how uncomfortable such situations make me.' As an aside.. what's her nationality? It seemed she had a slight accent but I couldn't quite place it.

[SergSG]

well honestly what did you expect, It's youtube...

[Xei]

Heard about it but hadn't seen what she said till now. I don't think what she said was worthy of a shit storm, but I do think it was pretty silly. The man expressed interest in her and asked if she'd like to come over for coffee. The subtext, we assume, is, 'I find you attractive, are you interested in me'? There's nothing wrong with this at all in my eyes. Her complaint seems to be that the man noticed she was a woman. Well... you are. And he was asking if you were the kind of woman who'd enjoy his company. He wasn't asserting that you were, he was asking. 'Sexualisation', seriously... what does that word even mean? It means nothing. It means 'sometimes men are attracted to women and sometimes women are attracted to men'. It's a truism, not a sin. If a woman approached me in the elevator, would I feel 'sexualised'? Well, whatever the fuck that means, I suppose so? She's not persecuting me, is she!? I'm a male and she's expressing interest. I would understand, be flattered, and decline. Would I feel uncomfortable? Maybe, but you like it or you lump it. I have no right to not be told I'm sexually appealing to somebody, and no basis to complain about it.

[khh]

I find nothing wrong with asking a girl if they'd be interested in having a chat over a cup of coffee, and I find nothing wrong with declining. The way she reacts, though, is as if someone's has committed an offence towards her.

[Jeff777]

This is sickening. Everything she said was completely rational, and yet look at the reaction she's getting. People are calling her man-hating and a prude just because she wouldn't go into some stranger's hotel room at 4 in the morning. I just don't understand. Our society must be more sexist than I believed it to be... Those comments are being made by the many alts of the same elevator guy she rejected. Heard about it but hadn't seen what she said till now. I don't think what she said was worthy of a shit storm, but I do think it was pretty silly. The man expressed interest in her and asked if she'd like to come over for coffee. The subtext, we assume, is, 'I find you attractive, are you interested in me'? There's nothing wrong with this at all in my eyes. Her complaint seems to be that the man noticed she was a woman. Well... you are. And he was asking if you were the kind of woman who'd enjoy his company. He wasn't asserting that you were, he was asking. 'Sexualisation', seriously... what does that word even mean? It means nothing. It means 'sometimes men are attracted to women and sometimes women are attracted to men'. It's a truism, not a sin. If a woman approached me in the elevator, would I feel 'sexualised'? Well, whatever the fuck that means, I suppose so? She's not persecuting me, is she!? I'm a male and she's expressing interest. I would understand, be flattered, and decline. Would I feel uncomfortable? Maybe, but you like it or you lump it. I have no right to not be told I'm sexually appealing to somebody, and no basis to complain about it. I.. I find nothing wrong with asking a girl if they'd be interested in having a chat over a cup of coffee, and I find nothing wrong with declining. The way she reacts, though, is as if someone's has committed an offence towards her. ..agree.

[Descensus]

Dawkins got in a heap of trouble over this for drawing a comparison to the treatment of Muslim women as an attempt to downplay what happened. Didn't go over well. Anyway, I agree with her. She was in a hotel elevator with a stranger at 4 AM. She's fully justified in feeling creeped out.

[Xei]

Savy: the mistake you're making is thinking that people find her comments silly on the basis that 'she wouldn't go into some stranger's room'. To be honest I'm not sure how you could logically come to that conclusion. That is not the issue. She is at total liberty to decline an invite, of course she is! You are seriously suggesting people took issue because they think women are obliged to have sex when asked? The issue is that she thinks she has the right not to be invited (in a polite manner), and that such an invitation indicates moral decadence; that 'guys' in general should feel ashamed about such invitations. This really amounts to a denial of reality. Sexual attraction exists and romantic intentions are ubiquitous. I doubt most women would agree with her indignant stance that guys shouldn't let their intentions be known; I'm sure most of them would encourage it. The same goes for men being hit on by women, or indeed any pairing. Or... grouping. Blueline: she is at liberty to feel creeped out. She does not have the right, however, to not feel creeped out; she is not at liberty to speak for the entire female gender and say 'guys, don't ever ask women if they'd like to hook up, it's abhorrent', based on her personal rejection.

[Descensus]

I didn't say she has the right to speak for every woman.

[tommo]

Honestly, I was waiting for the moment where she'd make an extremely stupid statement that was worthy of such epic ridicule, even from TheAmazingAtheist, but I don't see it. If you watched his reply to it, you would see the stupid statement she makes. It's kinda long, but he pretty much just owns the fuck out of her. That basic point is that she made a huge deal out of it by telling her entire fan base what happened. And also the fact that she told guys "don't do that". She's a stupid bitch basically.

[stormcrow]

Assuming the man only wanted sex is just as sexist as saying women only belong in the kitchen.

[Wayfaerer]

Yeah, I mean maybe he genuinely had an earnest interest in coffee and just wanted to show her his extensive coffee ground collection and have in depth discussions about their favored tastes and various species of newly discovered coffee plants! Cynical bastards.

[tommo]

Maybe he just wanted to talk over coffee wayfaerer? It doesn't matter. The point is, you shouldn't make guys feel like shit in front of thousands of people (sort of) for asking if you want to have sex. It doesn't matter if he really wanted coffe and a chat or not.

[juroara]

Let's change the situation. It's 4am and she's in the elevator with co-worker that she's known for years and she trusts him. He's like "hey let's have a drink at my place and chat" and she's like "no." I say, she has a right to say "no" to who ever she wants to say "no" to, stranger or not. Also: I think were clashing personalities here. I know there are a lot of people who look forward to a total stranger showing interest in them and inviting them to hang out on a whim. I call these people extroverts. But an introvert would be offended, I repeat offended, if a stranger randomly showed interest in them based on nothing but their outer appearance.

[Wayfaerer]

It really depends on how he did it and what he said, which I don't know.

[tommo]

Let's change the situation. It's 4am and she's in the elevator with co-worker that she's known for years and she trusts him. He's like "hey let's have a drink at my place and chat" and she's like "no." I say, she has a right to say "no" to who ever she wants to say "no" to, stranger or not. Nobody is saying she HAS to say yes lol She definitely does not have to tell the world though. And DEFINITELY should not be telling guys not to ask girls that. As if it's not hard enough already to ask girls out. Plenty of girls I'm not attracted to have asked me similar things, I don't go tell all my friends "OH MY GOD, that chick just asked me for sex! I FELT SO AWKWARD! OMGZ!"

[stormcrow]

I say, she has a right to say "no" to who ever she wants to say "no" to, stranger or not. Did I miss something? Im fairly positive no one in this thread is arguing that she is obligated to say yes. What did the strawmen do to you? Lets change the situation. Lets say a woman asks a man to join her for coffee at 4 in the morning... oh wait Xei already brought this up. Funny how the controversy dissolves when the roles are reversed. I am an introvert and you do not speak for me. I would be positively delighted if a random stranger showed interest me based on my physical appearance.

[juroara]

Im fairly positive no one in this thread is arguing Then I'm not arguing with anyone in this thread

[GuyCecil]

If you watched his reply to it, you would see the stupid statement she makes. It's kinda long, but he pretty much just owns the fuck out of her. That basic point is that she made a huge deal out of it by telling her entire fan base what happened. And also the fact that she told guys "don't do that". She's a stupid bitch basically. I love how the Amazing Atheist complains about her making a mountain out of a molehill and wasting everyone's time with that casual one-minute mention, as he records this 14-minute insane rant. I don't blame her for being uncomfortable and declining. It's just common sense to avoid drunkenly following people you met five seconds ago into their hotel room at four in the morning, whatever combination of men and women are involved. She WAS out of line to say that the guy just saw her as a piece of meat though. Maybe he DID just want to talk and was oblivious to the fact that a public place would be far more appropriate. Or maybe he wanted some action... but what does that have to do with sexism? There's no connection here between casual sex and sexism.

[tommo]

The reason he did that is because, well.... probably mostly because he wants money from views and had nothing better to talk about, but also because stupid things need to be counteracted. Even if it is a stupid thing which is blown out of proportion.

[Xei]

Why do both Savy and Juroara want to portray the issue as being, 'women shouldn't be forced to have sex with men'? Seriously that's quite the fucking strawman, insinuating that men think rape should be legalised. How about you try an honest argument?