Thread: FBI Teaches Agents: "Mainstream" Muslims are 'Violent, Radical' (Wired.com)

I take it you have never lived in a muslim majority area then. I dont see anything untrue in the article.

I found something untrue before they even finished the first paragraph. Muslim terrorists are being funded by the heroin market, not american muslim mosques.

On the whole the article is well written, especially the ways it points out how dangerous this kind of prejudiced thinking is for our country. Like they said, the FBIs playing right in Al-Qaeda's hands.

Religion is inherently absurd and so will often lead to stuff like this. There probably are passages in the Koran promoting violence, just as there are passages in the Bible. Naturally the FBI will see things through a skewed lens and not see the contradiction, ignoring the fact that they too are either 'not Christians' insofar as a Christian is somebody who takes everything in the Bible literally (which is basically everybody), or else they are just as morally warped as the caricature that they demonise.

But of course, the vast majority of Muslims are peaceful, regardless of their performing some silly doublethink. I'm really quite concerned about modern the attitude towards Muslims. It's funny how virtually everybody is so quick to point out the absurdities and the evils of the propaganda and mass paranoia that allowed the holocaust to occur, yet so many of them have exactly the same attitude towards Muslims. If economic circumstances become really dire, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this suspicion became full fledged hatred, with some horrible consequences.

Mob psychology is an extremely potent force. That's why we always have to try our utmost to be totally objective, rational, sceptical, and principled.

Originally Posted by Thatperson

I take it you have never lived in a muslim majority area then.

Not at all, but I have - and have had - plenty of Muslim friends, who definitely do not fit the description. Also, what if I had? By that logic, living in a majority black neighborhood - and having problems with the more violent ones - would be justification for the FBI to demonize blacks, in general. There are countless Muslims who do not accept the Qu'ran as a literal call to arms (just like there are many who don't take the Bible's more savage passages - and there are plenty - literally). So, to spit polarizing rhetoric about how Muslims, in general, are violent and radical, based on the texts of their religion, is both inaccurate and hypocritical.

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

On the whole the article is well written, especially the ways it points out how dangerous this kind of prejudiced thinking is for our country. Like they said, the FBIs playing right in Al-Qaeda's hands.

Agreed. All it does is take an already-widening chasm of misunderstanding, from one culture to another, and widen it even further. It's simultaneously festering distrust and prejudice toward Muslims and giving the potential radicals even more incentive to switch over to the 'dark side,' so to speak.

[Edit]
Xei, it's been a long time, since I've agreed with one of your posts, so completely.

Originally Posted by Xei

There are passages in the Koran promoting violence, just as there are passages in the Bible.

fixed

yeah the Koran is on the internet, you can read it yourself

Not my cup of tea but it's definitely a very potent book. It doesn't call muslims to arms but it basically states anyone who isn't practicing the koran is practicing a corrupt and twisted version of god's word.

Overall though it reminds me of Hinduism. If you read hindu scripture, there's nothing about a caste system, there's not really anything about patriarchy either but many rural hindu wives still throw themselves on their man's funeral pyre in hopes it'll increase their chances of being reborn as a man. The caste system developed through the misuse of philosophical study for the purpose of control. This is not the core purpose of religion, this is just the point where religion and state meet. This is why separation of church and state is so key for the protection of religion, not just to stop religious laws from becoming state laws but to stop state laws from becoming religious laws (such as the whole concept of patriarchy).

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

it basically states anyone who isn't practicing the koran is practicing a corrupt and twisted version of god's word.

Oh yes I think I've read that part- No wait it was just a quote from the bible I saw posted in the RS board.

Originally Posted by Scatterbrain

Oh yes I think I've read that part- No wait it was just a quote from the bible I saw posted in the RS board.

Perhaps it's because it was released later and it learned this was a good technique, but the Koran stresses the issue a little more.

Christians and Muslims have a lot in common, in that both of their holy books have disgusting and violent passages in them. Though if Christians are able to ignore the "word of god" when it is convenient, I am sure Muslims can also ignore the world of god when it is convenient.

Originally Posted by Alric

Christians and Muslims have a lot in common, in that both of their holy books have disgusting and violent passages in them. Though if Christians are able to ignore the "word of god" when it is convenient, I am sure Muslims can also ignore the world of god when it is convenient.

Yes but the bible was written by "holy" figures and everyone knows that, muslims must believe that the Quran is the literal word of God and will never be wrong, no matter what.

My Muslim friends are just like my Mormon friends... absolutely nothing like mainstream society says they are... they are really nice, fun, great company, and not at all "looney" as people seem to believe. I also have a friend who is a Jehovah's Witness... but his family was never a "door-to-door" type, they simply believe what they believe and are perfectly normal (and extremely intelligent) people. He is starting medical school early.

I feel like I live in opposite world here... the people who are the most aggravating out here are the non-religious, because often they like to make a point about how much "better" they are than the rest of us. It's really quite strange, but maybe I live in Sesame Street, where everyone is welcome, regardless of religion!

Originally Posted by Xei

But of course, the vast majority of Muslims are peaceful, regardless of their performing some silly doublethink. I'm really quite concerned about modern the attitude towards Muslims. It's funny how virtually everybody is so quick to point out the absurdities and the evils of the propaganda and mass paranoia that allowed the holocaust to occur, yet so many of them have exactly the same attitude towards Muslims. If economic circumstances become really dire, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this suspicion became full fledged hatred, with some horrible consequences.

The Jews didn't have groups who committed atrocities against "infidels", as far as I recall, and do peaceful Muslims also all force their women to cover up and be escorted everywhere? I'm not condoning violence against Muslims, or claiming that all Muslims are terrorists, I just think that the criticisms of their culture are justified and not untouchable.

Of course. Also I think we should do something about the Christian culture that led to the crimes of Anders Breivik. And we should give credence to the criticisms of atheist culture that led to the Gulag.

There is a group of Jews who have committed atrocities against "infidels", its called Israel. Even though they are the worst terrorist country in the middle east, the US still generally supports them though. People don't blame all Jews for the radicals in Israel, and we shouldn't blame all Muslims for the radicals in a few of the bad Muslims countries.

Originally Posted by Xei

Of course. Also I think we should do something about the Christian culture that led to the crimes of Anders Breivik. And we should give credence to the criticisms of atheist culture that led to the Gulag.

Yes, I agree. I never implied that we shouldn't.

Sarcasm. Christians had nothing to do with Anders Brevik and atheists are not responsible for the Gulag.

Originally Posted by Xei

Sarcasm. Christians had nothing to do with Anders Brevik and atheists are not responsible for the Gulag.

It could be argued that people like Hitler and Stalin hijacked the already hyper-religious cultures they ruled over to enhance their own cultish powers over the populace. So, far from atheism being the cause of these atrocities, it seems like religiosity was the cause.

As for muslims, they're fine in isolation. The "one muslim friend" isn't ever a problem. But a group of muslims is another story entirely. Islam is just as dangerous as Christianity was before the enlightenment.

Apparently the graph below was really, actually, sincerely used during recent FBI training.

FBI Islam graph

As a commentator on another site noted, this graphic could have easily come from www.theonion.com and it would have made far more sense...

Yeah that's kind of sad. I think this is a better explanation of muslim violence

Sam Richards: A radical experiment in empathy | Video on TED.com

Is that what qualifies you for being smart within sociological circles? That wasn't a 'radical experiment', that was just obvious. First TED talk I've seen with zero novel content.

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

Yeah that's kind of sad. I think this is a better explanation of muslim violence

Sam Richards: A radical experiment in empathy | Video on TED.com

good video tho

Originally Posted by Xei

Is that what qualifies you for being smart within sociological circles? That wasn't a 'radical experiment', that was just obvious. First TED talk I've seen with zero novel content.

Can you go there? Can you do that?

Go where and do what? Go to a conference and explain why people who get bombed and pillaged might feel righteously pissed off about it? Yes, I hope that wouldn't be beyond my intellectual capacities.

And how do you feel about that?