Thread: Lying about Santa

Topics like this make me glad I am never having kids. I have such a low value of material goods that going through the effort of encouraging a child to be good for the sake of a omniscient immortal watching them so they can get a trinket is very unappealing.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

I have such a low value of material goods that going through the effort of encouraging a child to be good for the sake of a omniscient immortal watching them so they can get a trinket is very unappealing.

It seems to me that there are two things people dislike about the Santa Claus business:
1. Lying is wrong (especially during such a long period)
2. The values that surround Santa Claus are not valuable (they encourage the superficial desire for material goods)

I would argue against these two points but it would make me closed minded because these two arguments are, as a matter of fact, very reasonable.
There remains however, the arguments for Santa Claus"
1. Kids love it. It's a game that we can play as a society. That is what is fun with tradition, everyone does it. Our culture is getting more and more seculiar and this is causing us to put aside our traditions which is making us less colorful society. Yes, you might still be very creative but there is something valuable in a society that comes together at certain periods of the year to decorate the town and make the city special with ornaments and trees. This is not something that gets done without holidays such as Halloween, Christmas or the Chinese New Year. Tradition gives us this.

Now, is there a compromise we can make? I've thought about this briefly and I cannot think of anything satisfying. I mean, about the argument 2 against Santa, it's all about talking to your kids and telling them what morals they are suppose to take out of things such "It's not the material goods that are important but being together and doing good deeds". It's all about parenting. Besides, are you implying you will never ever get anything for your kids? My parents never bought me toys. There were only two days in the year I could expect to have toys and those days were my birthday and Christmas. If my parents had said "No, it's bad values", I would just of been a toyless kid. I don't see how this is so important, that a kid be toyless. I grew up to be very unconcerned with material good.

When I wrote this post, I thought I would come with something insightful but really... no. I have nothing else to give. My conclusion is: Christmas is fun and people are thinking too hard about the negative side of christmas. Everything has negative side. Christmas is when I learnt about mortality.

I think, I will personally put twists on the Santa Claus story. I want my kids to have to solve mysteries to find their toys. They'll have to earn it.
I think there's a way to change our traditions to match our evolving society in a way that keeps our society playful.

Originally Posted by Occipitalred

It seems to me that there are two things people dislike about the Santa Claus business:
1. Lying is wrong (especially during such a long period)
2. The values that surround Santa Claus are not valuable (they encourage the superficial desire for material goods)

I would argue against these two points but it would make me closed minded because these two arguments are, as a matter of fact, very reasonable.
There remains however, the arguments for Santa Claus"
1. Kids love it. It's a game that we can play as a society. That is what is fun with tradition, everyone does it. Our culture is getting more and more seculiar and this is causing us to put aside our traditions which is making us less colorful society. Yes, you might still be very creative but there is something valuable in a society that comes together at certain periods of the year to decorate the town and make the city special with ornaments and trees. This is not something that gets done without holidays such as Halloween, Christmas or the Chinese New Year. Tradition gives us this.

Now, is there a compromise we can make? I've thought about this briefly and I cannot think of anything satisfying. I mean, about the argument 2 against Santa, it's all about talking to your kids and telling them what morals they are suppose to take out of things such "It's not the material goods that are important but being together and doing good deeds". It's all about parenting. Besides, are you implying you will never ever get anything for your kids? My parents never bought me toys. There were only two days in the year I could expect to have toys and those days were my birthday and Christmas. If my parents had said "No, it's bad values", I would just of been a toyless kid. I don't see how this is so important, that a kid be toyless. I grew up to be very unconcerned with material good.

When I wrote this post, I thought I would come with something insightful but really... no. I have nothing else to give. My conclusion is: Christmas is fun and people are thinking too hard about the negative side of christmas. Everything has negative side. Christmas is when I learnt about mortality.

I think, I will personally put twists on the Santa Claus story. I want my kids to have to solve mysteries to find their toys. They'll have to earn it.
I think there's a way to change our traditions to match our evolving society in a way that keeps our society playful.

You didn't quote the more important part of my post: I'm not having children, so I was mostly giving my two cents on why this topic wouldn't have been fun for me to deal with.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

You didn't quote the more important part of my post: I'm not having children, so I was mostly giving my two cents on why this topic wouldn't have been fun for me to deal with.

I'm sorry, I just felt like the rest of your post somewhat summarized other people's lack of interest for Santa Claus. I wasn't directing my response to you, oops