Thread: Why Terrorism Exists

Originally Posted by R.D.735

Have you heard about the IAE? The Intelligence Agency Estimate released just days ago indicates that Iran halted its nuclear program in 2003 because of economic and political pressure. It appears that your opinion needs to be updated.

R.D., what else happened in 2003? Update your consideration of that.

Originally Posted by R.D.735

It's a good thing they didn't view our actions in support of the insurgency as an act of war and attack us, isn't it?

They knew better than that. It's a good thing we deterred the Soviet Union from further expansion and used the arms race to make their socialist system hurry up and collapse.

Originally Posted by R.D.735

On the plus side, it hastened Soviet Russia's inevitable demise, right? Well, except for the fact that Russia's financial troubles made maintaining and guarding its stockpiles of nuclear weapons very difficult, and it wasn't as if the US was picking up their slack. We were very lucky that nuclear weapons didn't end up in bad hands.

Yes, we were, but the entire world was even luckier that the Soviet Union did not end up taking over the world, which they would have done if it had not been for the United States.

Originally Posted by R.D.735

War is a gamble in many cases. Sometimes you win, and it's 'worth it,' and sometimes you lose everything. Afghanistan lost everything. Russia lost everything. The US won. It was a strategic victory, sure, but the escalation of the cold war put the entire world at greater risk. It was 'worth it' because we were lucky. Luck doesn't make for good policy. It tends to run out when it's needed most.

We could not afford to not take on the Soviets like we did. The world could not afford it.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

It's not what I think about the relative merits of the two systems, it's the way the methods used and how it is perceived by the people on whom they are being "spread". That's what matters.

The vast differences between the two systems make the spreading of one far more justifiable than the other. It is the difference between rescuing hostages and taking hostages.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

I think the government spins things, and while not actually covering the truth up completely, obscures the issue to make it more palatable to the public.

No matter how the government might have spun anything, the Soviets had to be taken on every time they tried to take over a country.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

But you said that you did support our alliance with the Taliban. I guess you mean after the Soviets were out of there.

I am talking about the Afghan fighters that later evolved into the Taliban and while they were at war with the Soviets. I don't agree with any support they were given in this decade.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Because that is what a lot of the fighting and killing that is going on in Iraq is about. Each sect wants to make sure it comes out on top, and it's religious rules enforced. What are the odds of religion not being a major part of their legal system? Will you still consider that to be a success of democracy?

I think they will become civilized enough to understand that religious compromise is going to be necessary. If not, they are still much better off than they would be with no democracy at all. So is the rest of the world.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Well, I imagine it's because they want to make sure that their own religious candidate comes out on top, so they can immediately enforce their religious rules and oppress any minorities.

In every case? Even if that is the case for pretty much all of them, which I don't think it is, look at how much they value the democratic means of voicing their opinions and decisions. They could not do that before we got them to that point.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

UM, I doubt that! Nothing else you have said offended me at all; we are just having a discussion; this is for fun, why else would I do it? But when you said that I was "trashing our government", I admit I did get offended. I couldn't believe that you would be suggesting that I was out of line by for saying what I thought. I won't bring it up again, I promise, you've explained that you didn't really mean it the way I took it.

Trashing the government is fine when it is called for. Like I said, I do it too.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Hopefully you see now why I was offended over that. To be having a conversation like this and be told that my viewpoint is insulting to the government--well, it's kind of strange to be arguing over how freedom is being spread and then have it be implied I should keep my opinions to myself concerning the government. I don't think I am saying the worse things imaginable about it. I am not in favor of armed revolution, I don't think we should start killing the Republicrats responsible for this--that would be worse, no? I just think people should be aware of what's going on, that's all.

I didn't think whether or not you were insulting the government was even in dispute. I thought you were boldly knowing damn well you were doing it. You were not saying the worst things imaginable about what should be done to the government, but you were saying the worst things imaginable about what they have supposedly done. By saying they have killed masses of people purely for financial gain, you are saying the worst that can be said of them, except for saying they have done the same thing to an even greater extent. But again, if that is what you think, then say it. You know what I have to say about the war on drugs.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

But we lost in Vietnam, and look at them now. We "won" in Afghanistan, and look at what happened. When will we learn our lesson?

I don't think we lost in Vietnam. The score was like 3 million to 58 thousand. That score played an important role in slowing and finally stopping Soviet expansionism. That was the idea. Vietnman is called a war, but it was really just a Cold War battle. The North Vietnamese never surrendered, but we tore them to shreds and ended up winning the Cold War.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

You.

I know you are, but what am I?

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

It's just that it's economically beneficial only to a few, and detrimental to the country as a whole. The are screwing the young people of this country. You don't buy things without paying for them; that is just common sense, and it is not how they are running the country.

I think it was beneficial to the entire world.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

OK, I don't mean to be insulting, and I know it's hard to talk about either religion or politics without doing it. Foreign policy is based on a lot of things, and it helps to know something about it, which I admit I am certainly not an expert on.

Peace and flowers.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Our government totally knew what was going on over there. They are not that stupid.

So there was a six government and U.N. conspiracy going on? That has not been proven to me.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

So what? Not our business, except we did give him permission. Kuwait was not exactly a lovely free country, it was originally a part of Iraq, and had control of the ports, and broke a treaty that it had signed with Iraq.

I consider the whole world my country.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Yuk. I hope you're right, I really do. Don't you think I think it would be better if the middle east was democratic? I just don't think it will happen.

Remember to meet me here in 30 years so we can talk about what ended up happening.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Well you are making me late for work again! Gotta go.

That's the object.