Actually I'm pretty disappointed so far!

[LouaiB]

So as most of you know, I've been training for a year a like 4 months. I've had 50 LDs so far, which is pretty good, but I'm VERY worried. They weren't life like. I'll explain a few points. _Some where more real that others. _They all seem to lack proper vision. _I actually made a few 'experiments' where I set a goal to decide if the LD is realistic or not. In almost all of these experiments, the results where that the dream was VERY unbelievably life like, and I remember saying those clearly in the LDs, but I wake up recalling poorly the richness of it, to the extent that most of them barely are anything close to a vivid daydream! So, it could be that LDs are already life like , but beginners have weak recall, so the richness disappears quickly. So maybe the more recall training I do, the more lifelike my LDs will be, till the extent that they'll be as life like as WL. God I'm so worried. Will my LDs become life like after more training? I can't even say if the quality of my LDs improved at all from the time ai started! I actually suspect it might be the flacebo effect. You know, bad LDs bcz I expect my LD quality to suck. Anyways, what will be the future of my LDs? Do WILDs provide very realistic LDs when mastered? Does training recall make LDs more life like? I'm talking about a long period of time of training. Will my LDs be more life like after 10 years of practice? I mean all of this without the aid of supplements. You can see my frustration.

[FryingMan]

I've not felt your pain, since I've had really mind-bogglingly vivid non-lucids and lucids both. My pain is duration and frequency (almost all my LDs are under 5 minutes, and I can go for weeks in between LDs). That said, dreams are not *exactly* like waking. But I think they don't need to be to be enjoyable, they can be "close enough." Even if you don't remember the amazing detail perfectly in waking, you can remember the experience of it while in the dream, and enough of the detail to fill in the cracks. But probably the biggest thing that changed my practice was embracing mindfulness. I think it can help you, too. Learn to really embrace each moment, each "now" moment of your day, in the waking state, and eventually in the dream state you will, too. Part of this is noticing all the detail around you (not in an "ADA" way, but rather just really being present in the moment and appreciating the beauty of everyday things: objects, nature, etc.) And work on recall, really really diligently, every single time you find yourself awake. If you put the bulk of your effort into recall then I think your vividness issue will fade. I'm continually amazed at the dream experience (mostly non-lucid since I have the a lot more of course), and it just gets better and better over time. And take comfort in the fact that it does keep getting better and better. If you quit, it will slow and eventually stop. That's the beauty of a mindfulness approach: I started for the dreams, but I keep it up for the living! And it benefits both. edit: another really important benefit of working on dream recall is that you can see and measure the results more frequently than lucidity occurs.

[LouaiB]

I've not felt your pain, since I've had really mind-bogglingly vivid non-lucids and lucids both. My pain is duration and frequency (almost all my LDs are under 5 minutes, and I can go for weeks in between LDs). That said, dreams are not *exactly* like waking. But I think they don't need to be to be enjoyable, they can be "close enough." Even if you don't remember the amazing detail perfectly in waking, you can remember the experience of it while in the dream, and enough of the detail to fill in the cracks. But probably the biggest thing that changed my practice was embracing mindfulness. I think it can help you, too. Learn to really embrace each moment, each "now" moment of your day, in the waking state, and eventually in the dream state you will, too. Part of this is noticing all the detail around you (not in an "ADA" way, but rather just really being present in the moment and appreciating the beauty of everyday things: objects, nature, etc.) And work on recall, really really diligently, every single time you find yourself awake. If you put the bulk of your effort into recall then I think your vividness issue will fade. I'm continually amazed at the dream experience (mostly non-lucid since I have the a lot more of course), and it just gets better and better over time. And take comfort in the fact that it does keep getting better and better. If you quit, it will slow and eventually stop. That's the beauty of a mindfulness approach: I started for the dreams, but I keep it up for the living! And it benefits both. edit: another really important benefit of working on dream recall is that you can see and measure the results more frequently than lucidity occurs. Yes, I see your point. Good thing to hear an approval for recall as a main key for this. Also, mindfulness. I kinda get what you mean, but I also know about mindful meditation that trains your mindfulness. They particularly talk about the same mindfulness you are, "living the now". I usually do the meditation (barely thou, lazy me). I'll start doing both meditation and living the daily moments from now on, for serious. Also recall of course. Thnx a lot!

[Zoth]

Bit sleepy to organize these ideas into a coherent reply, but: - Remember that lucid dreams are still dreams: up to some degree, dream vividness is regulated to factors that completely escape your sphere of control...it's not by random chance that some medication actually increases dream vividness, you have to take into account that a significant (but not overly deterministic) part of your experience will be dictated by aspects that you can't regulate, but only influence. What can you do about it? The best you can with what you're given ^^ - Dream control: this is a more advanced topic (aka, I wouldn't advise wasting your time with it if you're still getting used to dream control), but with your amount of lucids you should be comfortable molding the dream in a multitude of ways. That said, how far have you played with it? The most powerful forms of dream control are not the one that allow you to alter sensory input, but the ones that can literally modify the ways you can experience the dream. In a very metaphorical way (I'll go into a more practical line in a bit so bear with me), the same way magicians can play with your perception using certain tricks, you too can also apply some psychology to your experience. While I can't expose you to a set of guidelines (it's something I didn't explore intensively yet), I'm talking about something like this: - Dream Recall: so, in a basic way, you could perceive the 3 memory stages as this: stangor-fig08_005.jpg Regardless of the current theories, you can easily see this process - while being similar to the waking life for the most part - is impaired in dreams, both regarding storage and retrieval. Developing certain aspects can help your recall, but if you notice, attention can also greatly influence what you remember, and like Frying Man mentioned, what better way to extend your attention to the overall dream than to practice awareness. Try spending some lucid dreams feeling the dream, gathering information as an experience, instead of evaluating things like dream vividness. Regarding recall, you'll also retrieve way more information which only adds to the "remembering self" experience, leaving you more "satisfied" with the lucid dream. I hope this makes sense, once again, watch the video to understand it a bit better PS: the placebo effect has most likely nothing to do with your lack of vividness in the majority of your DILDs: unless you see a chance on the quality of dream vividness after you turn lucid, you're simply experience the uncontrollable degree of the dream still present in the (lucid) dream. PPS: try reading this post, Sageous points a lot of things that people (even dreamers with experience) sometimes tend to forget which can make them frustrated.

[FryingMan]

Yes, I see your point. Good thing to hear an approval for recall as a main key for this. Also, mindfulness. I kinda get what you mean, but I also know about mindful meditation that trains your mindfulness. They particularly talk about the same mindfulness you are, "living the now". I usually do the meditation (barely thou, lazy me). I'll start doing both meditation and living the daily moments from now on, for serious. Also recall of course. Thnx a lot! The meditation is basically just a time set aside for focused, concentrated practice. The rest of the day (and night) is the "real" practice -- living it! And yep I'm lazy too. Set yourself a resolucid (new year's lucid resolution) to do it daily. That's what I'm going to do. The times I do it I love it. Went on a walk in the snow this afternoon, and it was full of "wow!" moments, little thing like the frozen condensation falling around like tiny snowflakes. Tune in to your breath to center your awareness, I'm doing this more and more, it's awesome. The best thing about mindful/lucid living is that you're NEVER bored

[LouaiB]

Thnx guys for the support. Zoth: That video seems very very helpful! I'll watch it immidiatly, thnx! It's a great tip to absorb the experience, pay more 'indulgence' to it. Mixes well with the mindfulness training. God I love it when things fit together like a puzzle! Actually I notice that the moments I remember best in my dreams are the intense ones experience wise; things that excite me and grab me, like the last one was me....wait for it......wait for it..... making out with a cute anime girl under the night sky in my bedroom balcony! It was so warm feeling, intimate, exciting, wonderful! I'm just obsessed with those! (I also love how my LDs are always so, how can I put it, nostalgic-deep-epic especially environment wise! WILD does provide more awareness to the dream, right? It's a way to influence dream factors, providing more wakefulness and awareness.. I want to master WILD just for this purpose. That's why I'll start concentrations meditation too! Fryingman: I know what you mean! I've been working with this for years, even long before I started LDing! I read back then a self help book and started being an optimist , see the positives, and experience the beauty and wonder in every moment (every moment I can anyways v-v). It actually works! You say a walk, but to recall a recent special one of mine, I was gaizing at the night sky a few nights ago from my balcony (the same night I had the kissing LD) listening to krewella's lights and thunder night core. I felt ecstasy! Usually I would be even happier than that particular time, but it was still amazing!

[Zoth]

Ahahah, indeed those type of lucids are great for getting up in a good mood WILD does provide more awareness to the dream, right? It's a way to influence dream factors, providing more wakefulness and awareness.. I want to master WILD just for this purpose. That's why I'll start concentrations meditation too! In short yes, WILD seems to provide more awareness (probably because of the closer proximity between your waking state which renders you with better cognitive processing), so it should be a pretty good help to your current issues ^^ And ofc, keep practicing the other stuff in order to induce lucidity sooner and sooner into the dream.

[Sageous]

I think FryingMan and Zoth have already addressed your OP just fine Louai (except, though, that I would argue that WILD's are no more likely than DILD's to promise realism or self-awareness, that it's what you do when you are lucid that matters, and not how you got there), but I thought I'd add one other thought: Why does this matter? Do your dreams really need to be just as real as reality? I never got that. Aside from the fact (oft repeated by me, I know) that lucidity does not equal vividness, I've never had a problem with dreams that lack vividness or realism. I get enough vividness and reality in reality; I'd rather explore the unreal in dreams, to create things that never existed in my waking life, and maybe relax in a bit of blurry nothingness now and then. Crisp realism can occasionally be a pleasant bonus, sure, but it is not a requirement for lucidity. In other words, if you are fully lucid in your dreams, you are enjoying the condition, and you are using it to learn, grow, and expand your mind, then LD'ing is going well for you. You really do not need to include realism in your formula to be truly lucid. I would consider making realistic dreams a dream control goal, and a fun thing to develop (and learn about), sure, but don't worry about not achieving that goal. Nothing is missing if your dreams are not realistic, except a bit of resolution.

[OneUp]

My pain is duration and frequency (almost all my LDs are under 5 minutes, and I can go for weeks in between LDs) FryingMan, I used to be the exact same as you. I'd get inside of an LD, figure out what I wanted to do, and as I was on my way going to what I wanted to do, I would wake up. For example heres how it would go: "Hey, I think I'm going to go to a strip club and get it on with some hot babes! What a great Idea!" I would think to myself. I would then start flying or running or walking or whatever, and halfway in my journey to the strip club, I wake up. I didn't even get there. It was killing me how short lived all my LD's were, and like Louai, it was really disappointing me. However, I discovered something. One day, in an LD, I gave the dream my undivided attention, with full awareness, and I also payed attention to every one of my senses in the dream. Constantly I was looking around, touching things, smelling things, even tasting things. I would engage all of my 5 senses in the dream and keep constant full awareness with no distractions. What did I find by this? I found that as long as I did this, I stayed in the Lucid Dream. Now, the only time my lucid dreams end, is because random crap happens. All the time this is why I will wake up. For example, here's a snippet from my last LD: I walked around the corner and right there as I had expected laid a gorgeous brunette, basically asking to be dominated. I got on top of her and we started banging furiously. Suddenly, from some distance behind me I hear a guy yell, "Oh shit, watch out!!!". "What?" I thought to myself, "What's going on?" I stand up and get off of the girl for a moment, and then out of no where something explodes right in front of me, and its a huge explosion. Suddenly a lot of people start running frantically everywhere, people that hadn't been there before. My vision went hazy and I started seeing all sorts of colors. I was totally shocked and lost in the moment. ^^^That crap is exactly what makes me wake up now a days. All the time Ill encounter all types or random stuff, and usually theres always someone in the background that yells the same thing everytime, "Oh shit, watch out!!" and then all chaos is set loose. So in the end, my own personal technique works, but I just need to get used to those spur of the moment events that leave me in shock. Try it out FryingMan, I think it will work great for you and even Louai.

[LouaiB]

I think FryingMan and Zoth have already addressed your OP just fine Louai (except, though, that I would argue that WILD's are no more likely than DILD's to promise realism or self-awareness, that it's what you do when you are lucid that matters, and not how you got there), but I thought I'd add one other thought: Why does this matter? Do your dreams really need to be just as real as reality? I never got that. Aside from the fact (oft repeated by me, I know) that lucidity does not equal vividness, I've never had a problem with dreams that lack vividness or realism. I get enough vividness and reality in reality; I'd rather explore the unreal in dreams, to create things that never existed in my waking life, and maybe relax in a bit of blurry nothingness now and then. Crisp realism can occasionally be a pleasant bonus, sure, but it is not a requirement for lucidity. In other words, if you are fully lucid in your dreams, you are enjoying the condition, and you are using it to learn, grow, and expand your mind, then LD'ing is going well for you. You really do not need to include realism in your formula to be truly lucid. I would consider making realistic dreams a dream control goal, and a fun thing to develop (and learn about), sure, but don't worry about not achieving that goal. Nothing is missing if your dreams are not realistic, except a bit of resolution. Well it's still very disappointing if my senses in the LD aren't crisp. It feels like barely a daydream most of the time. It's like buying a video game that's supposed to be great but turns out to be an 8 bit 2D world complete waste of money. My goal isn't much about being lucid for the sake of profoundness as it is about living a high senses story(I kinda write stories that I want to do in my LDs), and it's disappointing when I do an episode of these stories then wake up barely 'feeling' it. Don't get me wrong, being highly lucid is great, but, well, I do it for the virtual reality. I may have not emphasized enough.. It's VERY bad! From all these months of training, a can barely count a couple minutes as being crisp good senses experiences. That kills me deep inside! I don't really need it to be as real as reality, though I've noticed often that it is but my recall melts it afterwards, but it's not even like half of that most of the time. Dream control does help a lot, like stabilization and stuff, it increases the senses instantly. Dream recall is a major factor too. Training my mindfulness would help too. I need these to specifically advance the HDness and awareness and recall of the 'richness'(richness as in the senses and visuals and emotions and everything pretty much which make the experience). I didn't mean realistic as in follows real life physical laws and stuff. I actually like having the drastically impossible possible, like playing music while making the whole sky flash with colors that go with the music! Epic! Just to clarrify: By lucidity you mean awareness of what's going on? You know, like tholey's list of conditions to call a dream a LD? Your help is much appreciated!

[Sageous]

^^Well said, and I think I understand what you're saying. But you did mention something that does (purely as an aside) illustrate my point, or at least my perspective: Well it's still very disappointing if my senses in the LD aren't crisp. It feels like barely a daydream most of the time. It's like buying a video game that's supposed to be great but turns out to be an 8 bit 2D world complete waste of money. From my perspective, some of the best video games ever came from the era of limited computer power, where you had to make due with 8 bits & 2D; creativity ran high in those days, where today it seems that great graphics rule, with actual play secondary. But I am an old guy, I guess.

[LouaiB]

^^Well said, and I think I understand what you're saying. But you did mention something that does (purely as an aside) illustrate my point, or at least my perspective: From my perspective, some of the best video games ever came from the era of limited computer power, where you had to make due with 8 bits & 2D; creativity ran high in those days, where today it seems that great graphics rule, with actual play secondary. But I am an old guy, I guess. Oh yes, now I see your point. I didn't notice this. I can still have a great experience. HD is only one factor, it's not everything. Yes this is a very important point. Come to think about it, it relieves me so much. I need to know just one thing too. Here we go: This senses problem. Will it ever be solved? Those tactics, will they really work? I don't care if I'd have to work hard and wait for 10 years for it. Will I improve. Is it something that you train for? Are your LDs for example commonly vivid and with crisp strong senses and awareness? I'm really not worried about time and effort, I'm just worried that I might be stuck like this forever! That it's not a skill you train! Wow I'd give the world for LDing, it's my life's main 'hobby' *cough life goal cough* to say the least!

[FryingMan]

FryingMan, I used to be the exact same as you. I'd get inside of an LD, figure out what I wanted to do, and as I was on my way going to what I wanted to do, I would wake up. For example heres how it would go: "Hey, I think I'm going to go to a strip club and get it on with some hot babes! What a great Idea!" I would think to myself. I would then start flying or running or walking or whatever, and halfway in my journey to the strip club, I wake up. I didn't even get there. It was killing me how short lived all my LD's were, and like Louai, it was really disappointing me. However, I discovered something. One day, in an LD, I gave the dream my undivided attention, with full awareness, and I also payed attention to every one of my senses in the dream. Constantly I was looking around, touching things, smelling things, even tasting things. I would engage all of my 5 senses in the dream and keep constant full awareness with no distractions. What did I find by this? I found that as long as I did this, I stayed in the Lucid Dream. Now, the only time my lucid dreams end, is because random crap happens. All the time this is why I will wake up. For example, here's a snippet from my last LD: I walked around the corner and right there as I had expected laid a gorgeous brunette, basically asking to be dominated. I got on top of her and we started banging furiously. Suddenly, from some distance behind me I hear a guy yell, "Oh shit, watch out!!!". "What?" I thought to myself, "What's going on?" I stand up and get off of the girl for a moment, and then out of no where something explodes right in front of me, and its a huge explosion. Suddenly a lot of people start running frantically everywhere, people that hadn't been there before. My vision went hazy and I started seeing all sorts of colors. I was totally shocked and lost in the moment. ^^^That crap is exactly what makes me wake up now a days. All the time Ill encounter all types or random stuff, and usually theres always someone in the background that yells the same thing everytime, "Oh shit, watch out!!" and then all chaos is set loose. So in the end, my own personal technique works, but I just need to get used to those spur of the moment events that leave me in shock. Try it out FryingMan, I think it will work great for you and even Louai. You made my day, OneUp...hahaha I'm practically in tears! "Oh shit, watch out!" haha ah great. Fabulous suggestion. It is something I have in fact been working on: to remember to fully engage the dream, all senses + awareness. I'm not terribly successful with remembering to do this so far, though. I just need more lucids so I can perfect the practice! I'll get there....

[LouaiB]

FryingMan, I used to be the exact same as you. I'd get inside of an LD, figure out what I wanted to do, and as I was on my way going to what I wanted to do, I would wake up. For example heres how it would go: "Hey, I think I'm going to go to a strip club and get it on with some hot babes! What a great Idea!" I would think to myself. I would then start flying or running or walking or whatever, and halfway in my journey to the strip club, I wake up. I didn't even get there. It was killing me how short lived all my LD's were, and like Louai, it was really disappointing me. However, I discovered something. One day, in an LD, I gave the dream my undivided attention, with full awareness, and I also payed attention to every one of my senses in the dream. Constantly I was looking around, touching things, smelling things, even tasting things. I would engage all of my 5 senses in the dream and keep constant full awareness with no distractions. What did I find by this? I found that as long as I did this, I stayed in the Lucid Dream. Now, the only time my lucid dreams end, is because random crap happens. All the time this is why I will wake up. For example, here's a snippet from my last LD: I walked around the corner and right there as I had expected laid a gorgeous brunette, basically asking to be dominated. I got on top of her and we started banging furiously. Suddenly, from some distance behind me I hear a guy yell, "Oh shit, watch out!!!". "What?" I thought to myself, "What's going on?" I stand up and get off of the girl for a moment, and then out of no where something explodes right in front of me, and its a huge explosion. Suddenly a lot of people start running frantically everywhere, people that hadn't been there before. My vision went hazy and I started seeing all sorts of colors. I was totally shocked and lost in the moment. ^^^That crap is exactly what makes me wake up now a days. All the time Ill encounter all types or random stuff, and usually theres always someone in the background that yells the same thing everytime, "Oh shit, watch out!!" and then all chaos is set loose. So in the end, my own personal technique works, but I just need to get used to those spur of the moment events that leave me in shock. Try it out FryingMan, I think it will work great for you and even Louai. Dis is gold! Engage my senses eyyy?! Good thing I started this thread! Apparently senses can be strengthened in a dream, whether directly, indirectly (manipulating dream factors), or basic dream recall. I'm still kind of worried though (how can't I?! It is my LDs after all, the one reality where you get to do anything you want. F*** YOU OCULUS RIFT!!!!!! You can't beat the power that is LDing!! Poor majority of the world who don't know how great this is

[FryingMan]

Ahahah, indeed those type of lucids are great for getting up in a good mood In short yes, WILD seems to provide more awareness (probably because of the closer proximity between your waking state which renders you with better cognitive processing), so it should be a pretty good help to your current issues ^^ And ofc, keep practicing the other stuff in order to induce lucidity sooner and sooner into the dream. Well perhaps this is a personal point, or one where reasonable LDers can disagree. I don't find my WILDs (few as the real ones are) any more aware than DILDs. I have to give up so much awareness during a WILD in order for my body to fall asleep that I just barely squeak in to the dream with any leftover. I've had DILDs which are WAY more aware than my one or two WILDs. But since my real WILDs are so few, maybe I don't have a statistically significant sample set.

[LouaiB]

Well perhaps this is a personal point, or one where reasonable LDers can disagree. I don't find my WILDs (few as the real ones are) any more aware than DILDs. I have to give up so much awareness during a WILD in order for my body to fall asleep that I just barely squeak in to the dream with any leftover. I've had DILDs which are WAY more aware than my one or two WILDs. But since my real WILDs are so few, maybe I don't have a statistically significant sample set. That's a good point. Happens with me too. But with concentration training and overall WILD experience, you'll be able to enter with more and more awareness. That's what makes me love WILD so much; The better you get at it, the more awareness you'll get into a LD, until an extent where it's full awareness most of the times! DILDs tend to be more drugged up with sleep hormones cuz you'd be sunk in them, while WILD has less since it's a half falling asleep (is my reasoning correct? Or am I just being dumb lol) Well, I wish I'm wrong cuz it'll mean DILDs can be fully awareful LDs most of the times with enough training! Thnx guys, what would I do without you?! Happy Christmas! Love you all LDing family! UwU

[LDman]

It has been a while since I've been here and did any lucid things, and this thread seems like a good sart. So last night I decided to put some effort in it again and do a DEILD, although succesfull the dream itself was blurry and I have trouble remembering most of it, I will try this night again but some early conclusions I made are that vividness is directly linked to recall.

[OneUp]

some early conclusions I made are that vividness is directly linked to recall. I don't think so LDman, because if that were the case, then why would we remember such vivid dreams when REM rebound kicks in after a night of insomnia, even when our recall is horrible? I think you're good man, but one thing I do know, is that for each person, their dreams seemed to be personalized. I've talked to a few of my friends about it, and one of them is a natural lucid dreamer but when I asked him about the vividness of his dreams he said they were always blurry, and thats how he became lucid. My other friends have perfectly vivid, crystal clear, real life-looking dreams, as do I. I think vividness is personalized and we may have the ability to affect it and increase it in some ways, but I don't think recall has much to do with it. To me, all recall does is help me remember the dream itself, it doesn't increase vividness.

[LouaiB]

I don't think so LDman, because if that were the case, then why would we remember such vivid dreams when REM rebound kicks in after a night of insomnia, even when our recall is horrible? I think you're good man, but one thing I do know, is that for each person, their dreams seemed to be personalized. I've talked to a few of my friends about it, and one of them is a natural lucid dreamer but when I asked him about the vividness of his dreams he said they were always blurry, and thats how he became lucid. My other friends have perfectly vivid, crystal clear, real life-looking dreams, as do I. I think vividness is personalized and we may have the ability to affect it and increase it in some ways, but I don't think recall has much to do with it. To me, all recall does is help me remember the dream itself, it doesn't increase vividness. What? Wow I'm gonna go kill myself! Kidding, but are you saying that LDers like me won't become Cristal clear vivid LDers with training?

[OneUp]

What? Wow I'm gonna go kill myself! Kidding, but are you saying that LDers like me won't become Cristal clear vivid LDers with training? No, not entirely. I'm just saying that some people have to really work for it. My natural LDer friend could still get extremely vivid Lucid Dreams, but only when he wanted to and when he was lucid and in control. SO, you can still get vivid LDs by just taking control of the dream, but my point was that recall is directly related to vividness. What I was also saying, was that some people have their own set degree of that vividness when they are just normally dreaming, but like I said that can be changed when they become lucid.

[LouaiB]

No, not entirely. I'm just saying that some people have to really work for it. My natural LDer friend could still get extremely vivid Lucid Dreams, but only when he wanted to and when he was lucid and in control. SO, you can still get vivid LDs by just taking control of the dream, but my point was that recall is directly related to vividness. What I was also saying, was that some people have their own set degree of that vividness when they are just normally dreaming, but like I said that can be changed when they become lucid. So I can train and become highly aware and with vivid senses in my LDs. I thought you meant it was a like a luck thing; either you have it or just forget about it, no training will get you to life like senses and awareness. You blew the crap out of me lol

[FryingMan]

^^ My experience, LouaiB, is that dream recall work + daytime awareness absolutely work synergistically and combine to indeed increase average dream vividness. And by vividness, I generally mean the experience of "being there." I think visual quality of dreams depends in part on how much attention one pays to vision input during your waking day. edit: the only way to know is to do it! Watching some motivational speakers can help, here's one recently posted to DV that I found really inspiring: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWMSwI5VsCg Take away points: you have to want it like you want to breathe pain is temporary, but if you quit, pain is forever Now of course ignore what he says about sleep . Replace it with "staying up late" for instance. Bruce Lee is full of great nuggets of wisdom: If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. Bruce Lee

[Forg]

You could consider taking supplements when you really want a vivid dream?

[LDman]

Have you also considered "deepening" your dreams, it basicly means that before you go do weird things you take a moment in your dream and just sit down, relax and look around. Feel the ground or whatever material you're sitting on and focus, that Always helped me back when nearly all of my dreams (both LD and non-LD) were blurry. It doesn't directly help with making the dream more clear but something I also learned is that vividness is not just how sharp or life-like a dream is, it's being there in the moment itself. It's hard to explain it and I don't know if you actually feel like it but when my vividness is very low I only see my LDs as something that happened in the past. Yes, I remember having fun and being excited but I wasn't really there, it's just a fun memory that I'm left with.

[LouaiB]

@fryingman I've started the mindfulness-during-the-day training 2 days ago. I'll try to have more awareness too. Thnx for the video! Dat Bruce Lee was one hell of a guy @Forg I read a full book about LD supplements. I'm now just waiting to get some money and hopefully find these supplements. @LDman yeah I've already planned to do just that in my next LD. I'm sure that what you were referring to is mindfulness. I'm sticking with that too Thnx again guys!