Thread: How long did it take you to have your first LD?

about 3 days after starting to read laberges book...
and now? you feel better? dont compare yourself with other.
some need half a year some need just some days. FILD only is not enough in my opinion. do regular authentic RC´s and some daywork, write a DJ and have lucid dreaming in the back of your head all day long if possible. then you should see some success with WBTB´s and FILD if you like

I had my first lucid when I was 6 or 8 years old and had several more as a child, but in my early teens I seemed to lose the ability...
I first started practicing to get LDs again when I was 15 or 16, and it took about 1 month to get some random DILDs, but learning how to get the WILDs right (like FILD) took me much longer (not sure how long, maybe 3-4 months?)... Plus, most of my first LDs were just to notice that I'm dreaming and immedietly wake up, and even these were infrequent at first

Apart from journaling, intention setting (like with mantras) as well as some awareness training are integral in my practice routine (in the periods of my life when I take LDing seriously) - so I think that maybe it will be better to add some more of the basics to your practice, since WILDs like FILD are more advanced and harder to master (at least to me).

I've been reading on LD almost every day and recording my Dream Journal. With FILD, I was really close on my first attempt as I felt the sensation of slipping in and I saw flashing purple lights.

I think this time when I started up it was about a week and a half.

Fild is generally not recommended for beginners since you don't know what entering and leaving a dream aware feels like. I recommend doing DILD first.
http://www.dreamviews.com/attaining-...technique.html
Of course reading Laberge helps a lot. I got my first LD when reading his book as well, it took me 45 days to get my first LD that I had to try for. I had some random ones when I was a kid, but me actually inducing is 45 days of trying DILD. Wild took like 6 months I think, but it mattered less because I had DILD, and I had DEILDs after LDs to help me with the phase.

How often do you try for FILD? To put it in perspective, I have about 2 WILDs a week and I try about 42 times a week, so with all my experience it is still super low percentage. 2/42 or 4.7% chance.

So since you have never done it a DILD or a DEILD, I think the odds would be somewhere as 1/500 ish.

This is why we send people to DILD first, because it is simply more likely that you will succeed, and if you do succeed in DILD, you will have a higher percentage with WILD and it's variants. I always recommend trying for both always, because then you have all sorts of chances to LD.

When I wake, I check to see if I can just jump back into my dream for about 10-20 seconds (this would be when to try FILD or DEILD), then I tap up some dreams and then lay back down and try to WILD for a minute or two, and if I don't get that, then I give up and just go for a DILD. Always leaning towards sleep because sleep is most important when dreaming. Doing this 5+ times a night, my recall and percentages go up a lot compared to someone that only does 1 technique or doesn't WBTB!

Good luck, let me know if you have any questions.

I'm not a beginner btw, I've been trying to Ld since I was about 16 and I'm 18 now. I try FILD with wbtb each night. As I said, I really believe in FILD as it was the closest I've ever been to. My main Issue is trying to fall back asleep and be relaxed tbh.

I used to try MILD in the past but it didn't work out for me.

kamenriderbaron, falling back asleep should have priority over the WILD (whatever version you're doing, e.g. FILD) - so essentially if you see that the attempt doesn't lead anywhere, just relax and fall asleep. Any form of WILD is first and foremost about falling asleep successfully. About being relaxed - at what point of the FILD are you stressed? If from the beginning, try a relaxation technique and / or shorten the duration between waking up and the start of doing the FILD (I'm assuming you're doing FILD with previous sleep... If not, "well, here's your problem"). But if the hypnagogic sensations (imagery, hallucinations, etc) tense you up, then you should stop paying attention to them as much, or try to be more on the sleepy side and focus less on maintaining awareness and keeping track of the finger... In FILD and other wake inducing techs, you need to find the balance between awareness and sleepiness - so you might need to sacrifice some of the awareness to fall asleep.

About MILD - for how long did you try it, and what was your MILD routine exactly? As Sensei and RelaxAndDream (and I) already said, the quickest progress is by mostly focusing on "day work" (to induce DILDs) and WILDs are something more supplementary. For example, I do some kind of personalized combo of awareness/RCs/MILD as my day work apart from the journaling. Out of 12-7 LDs per month which is my current rate (after starting practicing in Dec 2015), at least 80% of them are DILDs.

A disclaimer - since I learned and "borrowed" so much from Sensei's method over my years of lurking around DV, I'm not sure if I can add anything to what he said Anyway, just read his reply... I also at first tried to speed things up by only using WILDs because it sounds like the easy way out. But as Sensei wrote, WILDs on their own don't yield much consistency and are harder to pull off, and even if you do get lucid using a WILD (e.g. FILD), I don't know how prolonged or vivid a lucid dream is going to be without practicing any "day work" (the basics).

I've never really tried FILD before but it looks like a promising technique. I should give it a try.

The approach I would take in learning how to FILD is to first figure out how to fall asleep before learning how to fall asleep in the same way, only while doing the technique.

How many times do you attempt FILD each night? The more times you attempt it each night, the more likely you are to succeed.

If you have trouble falling back asleep, don't get up from bed upon awakening. Doing so will make it harder to fall back asleep. Only do WBTB if you have trouble maintaining enough focus long enough to succeed.

My main issue is when I wake up, I focus too much on trying to fall asleep and getting in the relaxed state to try FILD.

and I try to do it each night

Don't worry about getting into a relaxed state. Stressing about getting into a relaxed state is counterintuitive. Let the relaxation come naturally rather than trying to force it.

From what I've read, all you need to focus on is moving your fingers while being aware enough to notice when you start dreaming.

Try to get to the point where you're attempting it about 4 times each night.

Originally Posted by dolphin

Try to get to the point where you're attempting it about 4 times each night.

This.

Trying once a night at a really low percentage as I said before is not gonna yield much, but if you are trying it 4 times at night, that means that you will be moving to your goal 4 times faster.

Also, in response to your response to me, how high was your recall when trying mild? How long did you keep a consistent sleep schedule without breaking. These things help MILD more than anything else. Consistency and recall go right in hand with your awareness. Without these things, even if you have a FILD, it has a pretty high chance of being unaware and then you might forget it. I think of MILD induction to be the fundamentals for what you need to LD, some people may skip over the fundamentals and learn a few tricks, but they will not be as consistent as someone that practices the fundamentals (I am thinking of basketball here, but this applies to everything).

Originally Posted by Sensei

...WILDs a week and I try about 42 times a week, so with all my experience it is still super low percentage. 2/42 or 4.7% chance.

I read this and was thinking holy cr...

Then I read on until this he he

Originally Posted by Sensei

...try to WILD for a minute or two, and if I don't get that, then I give up and just go for a DILD.

My first intentional DILD came after more than 2 months, but then one per month then one per week and since then 0-5 per week (mostly weekend)
(I also had some lucid when young)
As to wild I haven't tried a total of 42 times not even a big percentage of this number
but I might have tried that many times to DEILD, succeeded at least once maybe twice

I drink water, and set an intention to wake and even practice sleep disruption on Wednesday night and still I only wake about 35 times a week I'm not sure I could fall asleep 42 times in a week unless I quit my job

My dream recall while trying FILD is actually a lot better tbh. I am noticing how in my dreams everything appears to be darkened/shadowed as well. As well I will try all day awareness but I worry due to this, it might take too long and set my dreaming attempts back.

Originally Posted by kamenriderbaron

My dream recall while trying FILD is actually a lot better tbh. I am noticing how in my dreams everything appears to be darkened/shadowed as well. As well I will try all day awareness but I worry due to this, it might take too long and set my dreaming attempts back.

Yeah, all techs that involve waking up (and noticing it) only to then return to sleep are known to increase recall...
When I read Sensei's "42 times a week" I was like 'WOW' too, haha. I'm nowhere near that close... I try to wake up 3 times a night (with water drinking, intention setting, and sometimes alarm), and based on the amount of previous sleep and other factors I choose the length of the WBTB - after 3-4.5 hours I do a couple of minutes WILD, after 6 hours I do 5-10 minutes, after 7 hours I do 20 minutes at least (this number of awakenings excludes DEILDing, since these are more opportunistic for me). It also fits the amount of recall that I record - after 3 hours of sleep I usually don't have much to record, but at 7 - have plenty. Tonight, for example I had 3 awakenings and recalled 6 dreams, two of them had the same general theme.

Darkened dreams could be a bias - now that you remember so many more dreams and details, some of them are dark and make no sense (but with normal recall you wouldn't have remembered them at all). Either way, dreams, on average, become more detailed and life-like the more I practice awareness and other day work.

What relaxation techniques do you guys use? That is my biggest problem.

Originally Posted by kamenriderbaron

What relaxation techniques do you guys use? That is my biggest problem.

When I first started I was doing the one on the official WILD tutorial on DV - basically breath like you would while sleeping, and focus on each part of the body imagining it getting heavier or number or lighter. Start from each foot, moving up to the body, then the arms and hands, and finally the head.

Nowadays, I don't really do any relaxation technique... Sometimes I do some things like setting the intention to fall asleep (during the wbtb, before starting the WILD) - but that shouldn't apply to FILD, because in FILD you need to be extremely sleepy and can't have long / any wbtb. I also sometimes try to imitate the things that happen when I normally fall asleep - so essentially think about random thoughts then let them go and think about something random again, or play games of association with myself, or imitate Hypnagogic Imagery by imagining short and random dream sequences, or imitate Hypnagogic Hallucinations by imagining weird shapes or lights or vibrations or any kind of weird sensory input. You get the point - imitate normal falling asleep. This only speed the process up for me - some of these should start happening very quickly on their own even without starting them yourself.

I'm not sure how is that possible that after 3 months you're still not relaxed enough during your chosen method... Have to tried to modify the technique based on your own experiences? What is your FILD process, specifically?

I'm thinking, if it's a relaxation issue, maybe you do a WBTB that is too long, or maybe WBTB with FILD isn't for you if you do it... Many people can't FILD unless immediately from waking up or even while waking up (like it's done in DEILD). As I and others like Dolphin already said in this thread, FILD requires to be barely awake, only second to DEILD in this respect.

Ok I set an alarm to wake up me about 4 hrs after I sleep. I wake up to use the bathroom before. The thing is, my mind wanders a lot. Honestly, I really believe in FILD but I end up falling asleep before I even try it.

Originally Posted by dolphin

Don't worry about getting into a relaxed state. Stressing about getting into a relaxed state is counterintuitive. Let the relaxation come naturally rather than trying to force it.

From what I've read, all you need to focus on is moving your fingers while being aware enough to notice when you start dreaming.

Try to get to the point where you're attempting it about 4 times each night.

Also its kinda hard for me to do so, as weekdays are school nights and I go bed around 8/9 and have to wake up around 6

Noticing more awakenings is actually very simple. All you have to do is be more aware. Just pay more attention to what's happening while you're sleeping.

Last time I recorded the times of awakenings, I went to sleep at 8:00 and woke up at about 11:50, 1:15, 2:20, 2:35, 3:30, 3:55, 4:40, ect. I woke up more times but was too lazy to record them.

As far as relaxing, make a fist, a real tight one. Do you feel the tension? Good! Now, let go of that tension. Now that you know what tension feels like and how to let go of it, look for tension in other areas of your body and let go of it in the same way you let go of the tension in your fist. You don't have to increase the tension, though, before you let go of it.

Originally Posted by kamenriderbaron

Also its kinda hard for me to do so, as weekdays are school nights and I go bed around 8/9 and have to wake up around 6

Am I missing something significant here? 9 or 10 hours of sleep is a ton, I get between 6 and 8 and average 6 wakings, so you can easily accomplish that with at least 2 hours more than me a night.

Originally Posted by kamenriderbaron

What relaxation techniques do you guys use? That is my biggest problem.

I don't really use relaxation, but when I wake up on Wed every hour it is fairly easy to get back to sleep, since it leaves me a bit tired and it causes me to only enter light sleep after the 2nd awakening at midnight, often after that I just drift in and out of light sleep awakening in the middle of each hour and also just before each subsequent alarm like 1-2 minutes before they go off.

But on other days I can have trouble going to sleep.

But from much practice trying to fall asleep, i have noticed that when I am about to fall asleep I see a flashing in my foveae (part of eye with greatest vision), it seems to oscillate at about 1.5 seconds or so, brighter, dimer, brighter, dimer, so often I will first say some Mantra type stuff, then I actually try to induce this effect. Then I begin to see it flash and then often I am asleep, of course what is a while latter but seems instantaneous I am dreaming but unaware. Last night I awoke partially paralyzed thinking I was still falling asleep, but then as I try to lay still remembered many dream segments and so after failing to DEILD got up and recorded them.

Continuing to use this technique (to induce sleep) near normal wake time I was waking up more then every hour from a dream for instance I woke at 5:50 am and also at 6:10 am a mere 20 min latter but with at least 3-5 minutes of dream.

Originally Posted by Spock

I had my first lucid when I was 6 or 8 years old and had several more as a child, but in my early teens I seemed to lose the ability...
I first started practicing to get LDs again when I was 15 or 16, and it took about 1 month to get some random DILDs, but learning how to get the WILDs right (like FILD) took me much longer (not sure how long, maybe 3-4 months?)... Plus, most of my first LDs were just to notice that I'm dreaming and immedietly wake up, and even these were infrequent at first

Apart from journaling, intention setting (like with mantras) as well as some awareness training are integral in my practice routine (in the periods of my life when I take LDing seriously) - so I think that maybe it will be better to add some more of the basics to your practice, since WILDs like FILD are more advanced and harder to master (at least to me).

Just joined DV and am pretty new to lucid dreams and everything. Can you explain what intention settings and mantras are? and can you explain what awareness training you use? I've been trying really hard to go lucid and i think this message board can really help me. thanks!

Originally Posted by jfriday11

Can you explain what intention settings and mantras are?

A mantra is something you say over and over, and is used in intention setting they are pretty much the same and differ from prospective memory which is remembering to do something in the future.

So suppose I realize that I dream about a certain dead relative a lot, I might have a mantra like "When I see so-and-so I'll know that I am dreaming" , or they could be more general like just before you fall asleep say "The next place I am will be a dream" or "I'll recognize when I'm dreaming" etc.

Suppose that you fall asleep very fast normally and so aren't sure you can say these things in your mind like 10-20 times at least because you will fall asleep to fast (maybe not at bed time put possibly through out the night on each awakening). In that case do something to make yourself a bit uncomfortable like cross your legs funny, then when you have done enough times uncross and fall back asleep.

Be careful how you choose your mantra, never choose things like "I will not have nightmares" as your subconscious could leave a word or two out and end up with an intention of "I will have nightmares" or "I have nightmares" or just "nightmares" so consider this when planning your mantra.

Prospective memory is different from intention setting. You throughout the day say to your self as you reality check "I will remember to stabilize" "I will remain clam" "I will attempt to do a jump test" "I will remember to check my pockets for stuff"


Having set the intention to become lucid especially on a wake back to bed (where you have plenty of sleep and will have longer sharper dreams, and that will begin sooner after you fall asleep) (and staying awake long enough to set it well) will increase your chances of becoming lucid. Associating the things you need (like stabilize and be calm) and want (like fly, or find candy or your super phone in your pocket) with your RC will help you remember to do these once you reality check in the dream on becoming lucid.

Now along with trying FILD, sometimes during the day I will look around and notice my surroundings and pay attention to details to create awareness. As well, I take intervals to practice saying a mantra and visualize myself becoming lucid from past dreams and then doing what I want.