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    Thread: Information is not Knowledge so stop making assumptions

    1. #26
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Laughing Man View Post
      Well due to free will there is uncertainty in the world but that doesn't preclude us from judging what is likely.
      Who says we have free will?

    2. #27
      Member Laughing Man's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      Who says we have free will?
      I do....that's why I said "due to free will there is uncertainty in the world."
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

    3. #28
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Laughing Man View Post
      I do....that's why I said "due to free will there is uncertainty in the world."
      That's a pretty factual looking statement.

      Why do you think we have free will?

    4. #29
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      That's a pretty factual looking statement.

      Why do you think we have free will?
      You can't prove we don't have free will, therefore we do.

    5. #30
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Nice answer. You could have at least attempted.

    6. #31
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      Nice answer. You could have at least attempted.
      Why did you just respond to me? If I don't have free will, what do you hope to accomplish with this dialog?

    7. #32
      Rational Spiritualist DrunkenArse's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      You can't prove we don't have free will, therefore we do.
      What is the physical origin of free will? Or is it mystical? Any thoughts on a physical explanation?
      Last edited by PhilosopherStoned; 07-31-2011 at 12:33 AM.
      Previously PhilosopherStoned

    8. #33
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      Why did you just respond to me? If I don't have free will, what do you hope to accomplish with this dialog?
      To understand why you think we have free will.

    9. #34
      Member Laughing Man's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      That's a pretty factual looking statement.

      Why do you think we have free will?
      By our ability to choose the means in which we achieve our ends.
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

    10. #35
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Horrible.... just horrible....

    11. #36
      Member Laughing Man's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      Horrible.... just horrible....
      Was that response directed toward my comment? I can't tell because you didn't use the quote function.

      Let's suppose it is because you seem to have an affinity for making posts on my comments.

      What is horrible about what I said? Usually people would give their impression of their thoughts with more then just feelings. If you think that is a crappy reason for thinking we have free will, then example why you think it is wrong. Remember what your kindergarten teachers would probably say to you,

      "Use your words"
      Last edited by Laughing Man; 07-31-2011 at 08:03 AM.
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

    12. #37
      Raz
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      To understand why you think we have free will.
      free will is the balance to the "force of destiny".

    13. #38
      D.V. Editor-in-Chief Original Poster's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Laughing Man View Post
      Well due to free will there is uncertainty in the world but that doesn't preclude us from judging what is likely.
      Obviously some sort of action must be taken and we must act with certainty even if we do not have it 100%. If anything, this idea should enable people to act more confidently with less certainty. Certainty is non-existent. Furthermore, it can be quite depressing.

      But you use this word "judging." Judging is a natural human response. My problem is people get stuck on their judgments and fail to realize everything they see is different from what they're judging it to be, even if only slightly. When you judge, realize its a judgement and does not reflect the essence of what you are actually perceiving. In other words let go of this notion that you have it all figured out, or that you have anything figured out.

      This idea is as old as Socrates. He's probably been the most fundamentally ignored philosopher of all time considering how long his teachings have been around and how blatantly people have continued to think oppositely, clinging to certainty with such ferocity at times you wonder who they're trying to convince.

      Separate your beliefs from your actions. Realize your actions are a result of your judgments calls in the moment while your beliefs are based on non-existent hypothetical situations you will never actually experience. Just because things are similar does not make them the same. Allowing the world and your actions to exist independent of your mind's world-structure and belief system enables you to see things more clearly and vibrantly and liberates you from unnecessary weight.
      Raz likes this.

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


    14. #39
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      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      Obviously some sort of action must be taken and we must act with certainty even if we do not have it 100%.
      It's not certainty. It's prediction. Probability maybe. Certainty makes it sound to definitive.


      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      If anything, this idea should enable people to act more confidently with less certainty. Certainty is non-existent. Furthermore, it can be quite depressing.
      Eh, everyone's risk/reward system is different. I don't know, I kind of find uncertainty amusing. I should play the lotto more often.

      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      But you use this word "judging." Judging is a natural human response. My problem is people get stuck on their judgments and fail to realize everything they see is different from what they're judging it to be, even if only slightly. When you judge, realize its a judgement and does not reflect the essence of what you are actually perceiving. In other words let go of this notion that you have it all figured out, or that you have anything figured out.
      Well why can't one perceive the essence of what one is judging? Is a hot stove not actually hot?

      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      This idea is as old as Socrates. He's probably been the most fundamentally ignored philosopher of all time considering how long his teachings have been around and how blatantly people have continued to think oppositely, clinging to certainty with such ferocity at times you wonder who they're trying to convince.
      I like Aristotle better.

      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      Separate your beliefs from your actions. Realize your actions are a result of your judgments calls in the moment while your beliefs are based on non-existent hypothetical situations you will never actually experience. Just because things are similar does not make them the same. Allowing the world and your actions to exist independent of your mind's world-structure and belief system enables you to see things more clearly and vibrantly and liberates you from unnecessary weight.
      Your beliefs guide your actions because we all have an ultimate end (our belief in what is best) and all our actions aim at this end. It's called eudiamonia.
      Last edited by Laughing Man; 08-07-2011 at 10:12 AM.
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

    15. #40
      Failing in epic style. ItsMEE's Avatar
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      If it shows all the properties of a duck, show all the properties of reacting to a duck.

      Everyone has free will, just some things people do have consequences. So if you wanted, you could go and murder everyone in sight just no one does, because the law wouldn't be too happy and would bang you away in a cell for the rest of your life
      Are you asleep and imagining you're reading this or imagining you're asleep and actually reading this?
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      Life is like a shoe; useless without a soul.

    16. #41
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      Quote Originally Posted by ItsMEE View Post
      If it shows all the properties of a duck, show all the properties of reacting to a duck.

      Everyone has free will, just some things people do have consequences. So if you wanted, you could go and murder everyone in sight just no one does, because the law wouldn't be too happy and would bang you away in a cell for the rest of your life
      Well that is a consequencist point of view. The fact that you will receive prison time as a result of your actions makes you reluctant to do it. However, there are people who don't want to murder simply because they abhor murder.
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

    17. #42
      LD's this year: ~7 tommo's Avatar
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      Oh, so because some things we do have consequences (everything does btw) we therefore have free will !!!!
      Wait.... I have a feeling that makes NO SENSE WHAT-SO-FUCKING EVER.

    18. #43
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      Quote Originally Posted by tommo View Post
      Oh, so because some things we do have consequences (everything does btw) we therefore have free will !!!!
      Wait.... I have a feeling that makes NO SENSE WHAT-SO-FUCKING EVER.
      I don't think he is saying that because there are consequences, therefore there is free will. I think he said everyone has free will and some things have consequences.
      'What is war?...In a short sentence it may be summed up to be the combination and concentration of all the horrors, atrocities, crimes, and sufferings of which human nature on this globe is capable' - John Bright

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