Thread: God Created the Stars in How Many Days?

Originally Posted by The Sandman

1. Perhaps? That's good. That's fine. It tells me something completely different. It tells me that the bible is not clear, or at a minimum can not be taken literally. Since it can not be taken literally, I have little use for it. People have interpreted the bible in different directions because they don't feel it can be taken literally. This has led to endless killing. I don't like killing religions, hence, I don't like Christianity.

It's an interesting thought that the book on how to avoid burning forever is not to be taken literally.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

It's an interesting thought that the book on how to avoid burning forever is not to be taken literally.

I'm glad you said that Universal Mind. It's like I've been trying to say that my whole life, but couldn't nail it down.

Originally Posted by SnowyCat

Hold up, guys. I just dusted off my old bible, and this is what I found;

"[On the fourth day] God made two great lights-- the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars."

Huh.

How was there a day before the sun was made?

well what i think is that earth is not the center of the galaxy,
there are other planets with life in it, humans animals etc.
the creation was made in six days, the earth was made in four days and in two days the 7 heavens were made with the lower heaven adorned with lights.
so the earth was made before he made the sky and decorated the seven heavens.
there would actually be like an big bang that begon with the sky (stars etc)

The bible explains the creation of the great light, Earth, and the stars, but it does little to describe them. It also doesn't go into any details about black holes, magnatrons, supernovas, neutron stars, quasars, etc...etc....

I wonder why?

Originally Posted by The Sandman

The bible explains the creation of the great light, Earth, and the stars, but it does little to describe them. It also doesn't go into any details about black holes, magnatrons, supernovas, neutron stars, quasars, etc...etc....

I wonder why?

Originally Posted by Marvo

This is it guys, finally we've found the one core piece of the Bible that is inconsistent with what we observe in our world, and thus disproven Christianity as a whole. Let's all take a moment to thank The Sandman for his efforts.

I didn't think it would be practical to enumerate each point in the bible that I find suspect in one post. Does that make sense?

Originally Posted by sloth

How was there a day before the sun was made?

For that matter, how was there light before the sun and stars were made?

But then, it's just too easy to poke holes in the Bible's (nonexistent) logical consistency and explanations for natural processes nobody understood at the time. I'm often tempted to do it (this thread has had me salivating to post a few times, finally gave in today) but it's really true - people who require evidence aren't moved by faith, and those who place great value in faith don't care about evidence. This is why this argument will go on forever as it always has (since long before the bible was created, and especially since we first stumbled upon that little bullshit detector called the scientific method). It can be fun to kick it around, but what you find after a while is that you're not going to change anybody's beliefs and might end up making some bitter enemies or ending some friendships over it. So you have to ask yourself - once you're really secure in your belief sustem, do you want to be a crusader or leave people to their own beliefs?

Peronally I don't have the energy to be a crusader and I have better things to do with my time - but it is vitally important for these discussions to go on because many people are borderline and might never have heard some of the valid arguments. I say let them hear both sides of the issue and decide for themselves (isn't that what the Creationists are always wanting?)

Originally Posted by The Sandman

I didn't think it would be practical to enumerate each point in the bible that I find suspect in one post. Does that make sense?

Nothing in the Bible makes sense. Discussing each minute sample of fairy tale is where it gets impractical.

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

...people who require evidence aren't moved by faith, and those who place great value in faith don't care about evidence....since we first stumbled upon that little bullshit detector called the scientific method)....you're not going to change anybody's beliefs...

I say let them hear both sides of the issue and decide for themselves (isn't that what the Creationists are always wanting?)

Very well said, but I don't think Creationists want to hear both sides of anything. I don't really want to hear both sides except to facilitate the presentation of whatever is the point of interest de jour.

People who believe in God don't even know that faith requires them to not know for certain. You are right though. It is so pointless that I should let it go.

Originally Posted by Marvo

Nothing in the Bible makes sense. Discussing each minute sample of fairy tale is where it gets impractical.

@Marvo, I concede it is impractical to have the argument, but I figure I could make one point that wakes up a thumper. For instance, if the bible is not to be taken literally, and you don't know Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, then you really don't know how to interpret the bible.

Even that argument could be taken further, but it doesn't matter--does it? (.)

Originally Posted by The Sandman

Very well said, but I don't think Creationists want to hear both sides of anything.

No, seriously - that's their motto when it comes to teaching creationism in the classroom - they say that it has equal weight with science and should be taught alongside evolution and geology etc as a valid alternative. "Teach both sides and let the kids decide for themselves" - as if the fireside stories of ignorant bronze age shepards in the middle east is somehow just as likely as the scientific discoveries. Look - you don't see scientists going into churches and petitioning to get evolution and the age of the earth as revealed by geology given equal time in the preachings - keep religion in churches and science taught in schools. That's all I'm sayin.

@DarkMatters,

I literally laughed out loud when I read that. I see what you mean now. Yes, they want both sides taught.

Sandman, I support this.

The part that I personally cannot understand is:
Do the religious expect that I can CHOOSE what to believe in? Like, I could simply decide to believe that I am Thor, and then become COMPLETELY confused when my magical lightning powers don't work.
What is faith?
Does faith mean that you ACTUALLY believe what you spout, because I am completely INCAPABLE of doing that. This forces me to wonder if they are just bullshitting THEMSELVES. To doubt the faith is a sin against God, so I must believe this. How?
Why is this the determining factor for whether or not you deserve to be punished? Shouldn't a reasonable deity reward those who are SEARCHING for knowledge, rather than picking something and just accepting it as proof?
Regardless, my question is: How does one choose what to believe?
I was raised as a Christian. I went to Christian schools. I was always bothered during bible class because every time the teacher stated a fact from the bible, something in the back of my mind said "Or not." And I often wondered, "Are all of the people around me REALLY convinced of these things that they are being taught? Or are they pretending to believe it? How can one possibly not have doubt about such fantastical claims.

They claim that the same thing can be done with sexuality. They state that homosexuality is a choice.
Are you able to become sexually attracted to a sponge? Just for the sake of experimentation, can you do it? Can you choose not to be attracted to whatever you are attracted to now? I cannot. When I look at an attractive woman, I get excited. I could try to dispel this feeling, ignore it, or discourage it, but that's not even honest, is it. I'd STILL be attracted to her, no matter how hard I told myself otherwise.

But if that is true, if we cannot choose who we are attracted to, what does that say about pedophilia?

Originally Posted by sloth

Shouldn't a reasonable deity reward those who are SEARCHING for knowledge, rather than picking something and just accepting it as proof?

You would think so - however nothing in the bible indicates that God is in any way reasonable.

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

You would think so - however nothing in the bible indicates that God is in any way reasonable.

You are wrong.

Numbers 31:17-18 New International Version
Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

See? He was completely reasonable in letting the soldiers rape the women for their efforts. He rewarded them for their loyalty and the work they did.

(I'm sorry. I'm awful.)

@sloth,

The choice thing always got me too. When did the preach choose not to be gay? Just before doing so, he sure was close!

Originally Posted by The Sandman

I have heard God created the stars on the "third" day. Science tells us that stars are still being born. What gives?

Also, it seems as though Satan could be running the show rather than God. I can't believe God would create a world with people, especially people he loves, and then turn the show over to Satan. That doesn't make sense.

Just my thoughts.

I can't believe you still believe in what is being told to you, especially in media.
News say this and that about stupid useless studies, and you believe them? How do you know a real scientist said this? Who said it exactly? and is there proof behind it?
When it comes to media and jibber jabber i question before i believe. Many people question also if a man was actually put/walked on the moon, and why do we only send robots into space now? Who knows if no one can land on Mars, we are only led to believe that, but don't know the truth.

Originally Posted by hathor28

I can't believe you still believe in what is being told to you, especially in media.
News say this and that about stupid useless studies, and you believe them? How do you know a real scientist said this? Who said it exactly? and is there proof behind it?
When it comes to media and jibber jabber i question before i believe. Many people question also if a man was actually put/walked on the moon, and why do we only send robots into space now? Who knows if no one can land on Mars, we are only led to believe that, but don't know the truth.

I found a couple videos last night on creationism. What's interesting is that both people featured arrive at the exact same conclusion based on different datum. Based on scientific evidence, if what appears to be true is not true, then God has purposely mislead us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jkGoqO0sZg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AmoNovE7_A

Originally Posted by The Sandman

I found a couple videos last night on creationism. What's interesting is that both people featured arrive at the exact same conclusion based on different datum. Based on scientific evidence, if what appears to be true is not true, then God has purposely mislead us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jkGoqO0sZg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AmoNovE7_A

WTF is this???
My question had nothing to do with this, just a simple question about if it's true about the stars, and a man on the moon. Not about creation, more about answers about what media has been telling us.

It does no good to point to sources that do not prove my point in an effort to disprove my point, so I redirected you.
You didn't seem to know where to look for sound reasoning, so I pointed you in that direction as a favor.

I guess it didn't help eh? lol

What about my last post did not resonate with you?

You know what's weird? Whenever people write these bible stories god always has the same kind of understanding of the universe as the person that is physically writing the story. Like before in ancient roman times god was forced to live on the top of mount olympus, because the romans couldn't get to the top of the mountain. Now we can go to space so god can live comfortably outside all of existence. Or to put it in other words we can just say he doesn't exist

Originally Posted by The Sandman

What about my last post did not resonate with you?

No. But give me the link that gave you the information about more stars being created/born.
I want to know this man who has a name, if he has none and it is hidden?....then i won't believe it. That's all.