Thread: ABORTION: Where do you stand?

Originally Posted by BLUELINE976

Don't shift the burden of proof. You're the one making the claims. Substantiate them or reveal your insincerity.

Philosophic burden of proof - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia According to that, I think I have lived up to the "burden of proof". Your turn. You have made a claim that you find nothing wrong with aborting a 20 week old fetus. Now prove to me that that fetus has no soul, and therefore you are aborting nothing but a mass of cells

Originally Posted by COLnop

So far looking at this thread, though, it seems a lot of the pro-choicers are ok with abortion way longer into the pregnancy than I would draw the line (I'd draw it at when the first signs of consciousness appear; I don't think there's a definite answer of when exactly that is, so at the moment I'd have the line at the end of the first trimester until we get a better idea of when that point is). I'd also support considering abortion after that point as murder, legally. I think (I could be wrong) a lot of pro-choicers would have a problem with that, so I dont generally refer to myself as pro-choice even though I am to some extent.

@buriedmonsters: Bringing religion into it only hurts your argument, not everyone is religious, and appealing to the concept of "souls" which they (and I) don't believe in, is not going to do anything to convince them. There actually ARE secular pro-life arguments (I used to be 100% pro-life even as an agnostic atheist), and using them would work better (even though it's still very very difficult to change anyone's mind on this matter).

I can see how bringing religion in can definitely hurt my argument, but in my mind it's all tied together, so that's the way I'm going to present it. I would love to hear a secular Pro-Life argument, no one here has showed that and it would be great to hear from someone with that viewpoint.