Thread: Impressionability

i don't think it's so much that each side hates one another, i think it's more of one side forgetting that it isn't real. whatever it is.

What you describe does become much less prominent outside of high school.

To some extent it still happens even to some older people, but most people who use their minds well will begin refraining from the behavior you describe pretty early on, sometime in their teenage years.

There is a certain 'group mentality', which I have, I am ashamed to admit, experienced, in which people of a group form collective opinions and that group itself becomes an entity. I find this phenomenon extremely interesting, when it becomes strong enough, a little like the Borg. This happened to me with a group at a center in Costa Rica outside of school, but I assume the same type of thing happens to most people in high school. I agree that anyone who finds themselves holding opinions solely because they want to fit in with others should definitely reconsider their values.

Yeah, this definitely improves outside of high school, as people discover who they are, what they believe, and what is important to them. People will always want to 'fit in' and join groups of like-minded people. I offer myself as an example. I hang out with parents who all have girls and we all like to hang out at the playground after school and talk while the kids play. We all tend to have similar thoughts on major subjects and we all tend to care about the same major issues.

The thing is, we gravitated towards each other because we like each other, because we respect each others' values and opinions. If we didn't respect each other we wouldn't fit together well and wouldn't associate any longer.

I find that respect for each other and a knowledge of self are the major contributing factors that lead most grownups to hang out with each other.

When I was younger, I saw a lot of what you describe, as I went to a high school that seemed to revolve around these groups, and rivalries with other schools even followed along the same lines. I was different. I didn't respect some of those people and chose not to hang out with them, because they simply had different values than I did. They cared more for image, popularity, and social standing, while I valued close friends I could count on, without regard to looks or intelligence. I still associated with many of the hive-minded people because many were in my classes, and some were very nice even, but their habits and activities led me not to seek them out for long-term company.

This impressionability began in junior high, 7th grade, and continued on through high school. It's funny though. I have run in to people I went to school with who now have kids and because their values and priorities have changed, they were a lot easier to get along with. I think that most people grow up, and move on, as they start living in a larger world. High school was only 2,500 students, and half of those people I never saw from year-to-year. In my grown up world, I see the same poeple for years as our kids grow up together, as we buy houses in the same area, as we attend the same functions. We still group together with like-minded people, but the motivations that dirve these groups together seems so much more...tangible...less trivial...than high school values did.

I just like making great friends.

I wholeheartedly disagree that this end outside of high school.
That's incredibly naive. It becomes even worse, on a much larger scale.
Government, military and rich people all think they are above others.
They get the good looking partners (and lots of them) and are portrayed as successful.
This causes a whole mass of people to also want to achieve that same success.
And then there are a whole other bunch who resent those "successful" people and form their "own" ideals and they group together.

It definitely does not go away. It may just be more difficult to notice in one's smaller social circle. But even there, it is still prominent.

Regarding impressionability and copying others being how we learn to function and do everything basically.... reminds me of something Alan Watts said. It was something which truly gave me a big hit to my ego.

We are not what we think of as "me", "I" or "you" etc. Think about the way you think about things. When you actually stop to look at how you are thinking about a problem it is almost always another persons voice in your head, or their style of talking when they told you something or you heard them say something. So basically, fundamentally, there is no you, an ego, we are simply a collection of experiences, a mish-mash of things we've heard and seen.

Originally Posted by tommo

I wholeheartedly disagree that this end outside of high school.
That's incredibly naive. It becomes even worse, on a much larger scale.
Government, military and rich people all think they are above others.
They get the good looking partners (and lots of them) and are portrayed as successful.
This causes a whole mass of people to also want to achieve that same success.
And then there are a whole other bunch who resent those "successful" people and form their "own" ideals and they group together.

It definitely does not go away. It may just be more difficult to notice in one's smaller social circle. But even there, it is still prominent.

Regarding impressionability and copying others being how we learn to function and do everything basically.... reminds me of something Alan Watts said. It was something which truly gave me a big hit to my ego.

We are not what we think of as "me", "I" or "you" etc. Think about the way you think about things. When you actually stop to look at how you are thinking about a problem it is almost always another persons voice in your head, or their style of talking when they told you something or you heard them say something. So basically, fundamentally, there is no you, an ego, we are simply a collection of experiences, a mish-mash of things we've heard and seen.

this has definitely been my experience. especially at a work environment. everyone seems to be trying to fit in whether by joining a club, family, friends, this website, etc. almost everyone i know looks at someone with a well paying job, nice home, nice car, in shape, married with kids as a successful person regardless of how miserable and stressed out that person may really be.

Don't know why you edited out "so they follow in their footsteps", coz that's what happens 90% of the time.

I think it does improve outside of high school if not only because the imitation is on a much larger scale. Since you are not constantly picked on/harangued or have significantly less of a chance of it, those with potential to develop real personalities and intellect but want to fit in with society finally get the chance (not to mention there are a lot more groups to fit in with). Yes, they still have to fit in to, well, fit in, but without a tight social group constantly in their face ready to pounce on any sort of odd behaviour, they're free to blossom as much as they want. Anyone that doesn't develop a real personality or learn to think on their own most likely wouldn't ever have anyway.

You're just as free to break away from the groups during school as you are out of school.

Your last line can be used to argue this too. If people don't have the capacity or the will to stop being manipulated in school, they will most likely continue doing so out of school as well.

I like the assessment that it doesnt so much get "better" outside of high school as much as there are more groups to fit in to, so it seems better. Even working in an office I can clearly see the cliques all around. We may become more independent and be more sure of ourselves, but we still want to fit in with like minded people, and that is easier in the larger world.

I do disagree with Watts though...I am still me even if my experiences have had influences on my personality. I say this because everyone experiences something differently and how you internalize these things tells you a lot about who you are.

Originally Posted by tkdyo

I do disagree with Watts though...I am still me even if my experiences have had influences on my personality. I say this because everyone experiences something differently and how you internalize these things tells you a lot about who you are.

Well, he didn't exactly say that, I was paraphrasing. But remember your personality is pretty much shaped by your experiences. Even before you have memories, things were influencing you, your parents, environment etc. which would make you react and process things differently later on.