Thread: The UFO Hoax!

Originally Posted by Xei

If they really have discovered this technology then they are just as bad as the US government because they haven't announced it to the world.

some of the men are claiming they are apart of these top secret projects. now before you walk into a top secret, you probably don't have any real understanding what it is and you have to take an oath. you break that oath, do you really think you can walk away? a system is also in place to make sure they do not break their oath. National security and all that jazz. in other words, they can not disclose this technology without someone in their group getting hurt, or murdered. They want protection from the White House.

also keep in mind, dr. greer is not apart of any of these top secret projects. he does not have access to any technology on his own. he's not lying when he says he's just a country doctor. rather, dr. greer has had UFO/ET related experiences that contradicted the UFO community at the time. So he formed his own group against the grain.

In his book, he tells the story of how it all happened. He met a military man at a UFO convention who had his own experience. One thing led to another, a friendship is formed, and the military man recommended Greer meet so and so. And so and so recommended Greer meet up with so and so. And a network slowly developed, and they were all insiders. Not civilians. Slowly because this was over many years. Over a decade.

Through this, "I know so and so" network, Greer eventually met leaders of different kinds. These leaders, whether white house or military, had asked to have access to certain top secret projects. And they would be denied. This made them angry, because they were as top as they could get and still denied access! For example, a certain President marches on into a top secret base and demands access. The base denies the President and threatens to open fire if he doesn't leave.

Greer claims that these leaders outside of the covert projects support him. But Greer explains in his book, how powerless they feel in the face of these top secret projects, and how cowardly they have been to do anything about these projects outside of government control. These men are afraid! Greer believes the last President to be in the loop was Kennedy. Kennedy wanted to disclose. . What happened to Kennedy?

anyways, thats the story. I'll leave it up to you for what you think.

Then why don't they just publish the technology anonymously?

Originally Posted by Xei

Then why don't they just publish the technology anonymously?

and how do you suppose they go about and secretly publish this technology, without the cabal knowing??

in greer's book, he actually talks about people who tried to speak out, secretly. and it doesn't work that way. because that only made them into an easy target.

here is why

lets imagine you were apart of a top secret project. obviously, not even your family members can know what you do. you want to squeal, for the good of all. but you go about it secretly. you don't tell any loved ones what you are planning to do. at most maybe you say "this is important, but I can't tell you yet!!" but your house is wired/being monitored to ensure the secrecy of this project. and those making sure you don't squeal notice some strange behavior. they conclude, you want to squeal.

they watch you, secretly, while you only think you are secretly going to disclose this secret. when in fact, it's no secret to your higher ups because they have been monitoring your behavior and actions. they wait, until they feel pretty confident you are going to squeal.

they hire some thug on the street to do the dirty work. and bam, you're dead.

thing is, to your family, to your peers, to the feds, you were murdered by a man because he was desperate for money. there is no evidence of any kind this has anything to do with the cabal. the truth is never known.

trying to act out secretly with the cabal is dangerous, because its in secrets that they act. if you come out into the open and start making noise, there is a considerable amount of less danger. because if the cabal does still murder you after coming out into the open, then your death only makes your case more real. and if people get suspicious over your death, believing you were murdered because you were going to say something important - then people start to think about men behind doors pulling strings.

the cabal doesn't want to be known. murdering someone who is already out in the open could potentially disclose their own existence. they don't want a thorough investigation to be held because of a suspicious murder. nothing to trace back to them.

greer claims he has met this cabal, he has seen their secrets. this of course raised questions of greer telling lies. how can this man be alive if he has gone into the belly of the dragon? why would they let him live when for so much of his life he is working for disclosure? greer says early on, when he was just a mere UFO enthusiast, he got the best advice of his life from someone in the military. "GO OPEN!!!" Greer believes the only reason why he's alive is because he held no secrets.

once he 'discovered' something he shared it with people. he shared it with his family, friends, peers, radio talk shows, and so on. of course, this made him look like a lunatic! but he said, he'd rather look like a lunatic than make the same mistake as so many others, and be dead.

greer is also against scientists working anonymously. feeling its the same issue. hold no secrets and go out in the open. let everyone know what you are doing, and its that much harder for anyone to hurt you.

and before you ask again about why hasn't greer disclosed the technology, its not in his hands. greer has said, once something is in his hands he will make it so public they will not hold exclusive rights on anything. so that the economy can quickly digest these things.

these projects outside of government oversight would make them ILLEGAL, would make them organized crimes. and it's very much like a mafia. you don't walk away from being a member in the mafia and think nothing will happen!

anyways, greer makes a lot of claims between this 2001 talk and between his books. its enough claims that if he is just telling stories, the story isn't going to add up! so I think either way, sooner or later, we'll know the truth.

That or this is fake so there is no need to go after him, or them.

So nobody says how the technology works because they're afraid they'd be killed?

But they do tell the disclosure project about the fact that there is a giant conspiracy and the technology exists, because this somehow won't get them killed?

Again you have completely failed at basic logic.

Originally Posted by Xei

So nobody says how the technology works because they're afraid they'd be killed?

But they do tell the disclosure project about the fact that there is a giant conspiracy and the technology exists, because this somehow won't get them killed?

Again you have completely failed at basic logic.

xei, your need to attack and judge others is getting old

what does this have to do with my logic? it is neither my project nor am I saying believe in disclosure project

all I asked was that you looked into it. and AFTER looking into it if something rubbed you the wrong way, post it here

I want to know what others think about the disclosure project. I however, do not care about the opinions if someone who hasn't actually taken the time to either browse their website or watch the video. because obviously, this person hasn't looked into the disclosure project, and decided ahead of time how they would feel about. in others words, the approached it from a close mind

what if the disclosure project is real? what if its fake? but how will you know if you come to a conclusion based on nothing?

I already asked in previous posts if anyone felt this was a hoax, POST IT

From the few i watched all they talk about is what happened while they were there, or their lifes story of ufo's while in the military. Not much to really believe in this story. The first guy who talks if i remember correctly talks about being an actor, and acts all weird. Greer himself says don't just agree to it but dont just dismiss it the first time he talks or else the 2nd time.

xei, your need to attack and judge others is getting old

It's called skepticism and it's the pinnacle of modern society.

what does this have to do with my logic? it is neither my project nor am I saying believe in disclosure project

Yes you are you've been defending it repeatedly throughout and treating my scepticism with incredulity throughout this whole thread, for example on this page. :/

You painted yourself into a corner and when I finally made a point which you couldn't dodge with even your increasingly convoluted theories theories the only option that was left to you was to say that you'd never believed it in the first place.

The disclosure project's claims make no logical sense, and 'free energy' technology is physically impossible. Keep dreaming...

The fusion reactor may soon give us practically limitless energy though, so I don't see why people get so excited about these baseless ideas.

Originally Posted by Xei

= 'free energy' technology is physically impossible. Keep dreaming...

The fusion reactor may soon give us practically limitless energy though, so I don't see why people get so excited about these baseless ideas.

Psst psst...but obviously energy can exist from nothing right?...which would mean that <somehow> energy can be created...though how I don't know...and it is probably not something reproduceable, and most likely impossible to do with anything that has matter...Oh well I'm just talking about of my butt though.

Originally Posted by Xei

It's called skepticism and it's the pinnacle of modern society.

Yes you are you've been defending it repeatedly throughout and treating my scepticism with incredulity throughout this whole thread, for example on this page. :/

You painted yourself into a corner and when I finally made a point which you couldn't dodge with even your increasingly convoluted theories theories the only option that was left to you was to say that you'd never believed it in the first place.

The disclosure project's claims make no logical sense, and 'free energy' technology is physically impossible. Keep dreaming...

The fusion reactor may soon give us practically limitless energy though, so I don't see why people get so excited about these baseless ideas.

you're reading too much into my posts. I never said I believe in it. I never said I don't believe in it. I never backed out of any argument. BECAUSE I AM NOT ARGUING FOR OR AGAINST ZPE. I said from the very beginning, and will continue to say, I am merely showcasing here what the Disclosure Project is saying. And that is a scientific breakthrough is being withhold. You are NOT going to learn about it at college, and nothing in college will prepare you for this scientific breakthrough. I don't have to give you the burden of proof that ZPE is real, because. YOU'RE NOT LISTENING. All I am saying is - these men are saying SOMETHING IS BEING WITHHELD FROM US. There is no evidence to give you, because its in THEIR hands.

my problem with you is, you are arguing against the disclosure without HAVING LOOKED INTO IT

what I mean is, a lot of people who have watched the two hour video - they don't know how to respond. they don't know how to approach it. because they see all of these BORING OLD MEN, give their long backgrounds on who they are. And a lot of viewers are thinking "wouldn't someone have said something, if they aren't who they say they are? Does this mean, they are who they say they are?"

I've tried to look up disclosure project as a hoax - and I've come up with little to nothing. No one has made any good evidence suggesting that these are in fact NOT military/government/ or nasa personnel. So if you know of any sources that has proven for a fact, they are actors - please let us know

why does it matter if they are not actors? why does it matter if they are really in the government/military/nasa? IT MATTERS A GREAT DEAL. What if a man came on tv and said "Aliens have visited earth". His office makes a difference. If its the PRESIDENT who says it, IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE.

If its not the truth, then we have another question. Why? Why lie to us.

Sure people have said MONEY. But let's be honest here. The Disclosure Project has many members, and has had many members for like ten years now. Do you really think they are pooling in so much money to satisfy them all? Do you really think Dr. Steven Greer can single handedly, with a greedy smile, walk away with all that money, and no one else in the Disclosure Project suspect something?

Is it realistic to say, this number of people are conning us? I mean, con men con each other. If you are saying all twenty speakers, and all the other members working behind scenes are conning us together - that's just not realistic.

Liars eventually lie to each other. Cheaters cheat each other. The Disclosure Project would have eaten itself, cheated itself if it was nothing but greedy people out for our money!! I'm not convinced Dr. Greer is making more money as head of the Disclosure Project as he did as a doctor. Especially when their number one product, the 2001 speech has remained on youtube for free.

The only argument I have been able to found, is concerning Greer himself. A lot of people think he's nuts. Not that he's a con man. Not that he's a liar. Just nuts.

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If we are going to assume, its all a joke. It's all a lie. Then we need to justif y it. You can't be negative just because, you're negative. You need a real reason to start accusing people of lying. And I personally find, any explanation to justify the negative view, IS EVEN CRAZIER THAN WHAT THE DISCLOSURE PROJECT IS SAYING.

what are we going to conclude? A single country doctor has managed to fool 400 military/government/and scientific minds to speak about their personal experiences just so he can sell books? And reap the profits for himself, by himself all alone?

Or that, 400 military/government/and others are using a country doctor to fool americans. For what end? For what malicious evil end? To tell us not to support space weapons. Because, heaven forbid, supporting global and spacial peace is now and evil malicious thing? WE NEED WEAPONS, AND BIG ONES THAT GO BOOM OR WERE NOT GOOD LITTLE CHRISTIANS!

CONVINCE ME, what is the malicious and dangerous lie that the Disclosure Project is perpetrating. Keeping in mind, THE NUMBER of people involved. This isn't like Blossom and her October 14 date. She is one person.

Especially when, Brazil, UK and others have already disclosed. Especially when Canada is pushing for disclosure. Are you saying, these nations are insane? That they are stupid for believing in UFOs, and America is smarter for saying its all weather balloons? Yeah, recent times clearly shows America is the smartest nation of all.

You're still so hung up on the notion that your text book science can be inaccurate, or rather in this case, OUT DATED, that you aren't looking at the whole picture here.

I am trying to keep an open mind here. But in all honesty, I am finding more evidence to conclude the men in the disclosure are being honest and real, then being hoaxing liars.

Originally Posted by Sandform

Psst psst...but obviously energy can exist from nothing right?...which would mean that <somehow> energy can be created...though how I don't know...and it is probably not something reproduceable, and most likely impossible to do with anything that has matter...Oh well I'm just talking about of my butt though.

Well, if we start talking about the 'origins' of energy, we should get specific. What most people don't know is that it was proven that conservation of energy is logically equivalent to the statement that the laws of physics are unchanging (Noether's Theorem). If we're talking about the Big Bang, the laws of physics obviously were changing and thus conservation of energy need not apply. So as far as I'm concerned, the bigger question is how the universe was created, not what energy it had, because that's meaningless.

OT: Drew, nice avatar, it looks moderately real and briefly had me fooled into thinking there was a flaw in the system. However it's clear you saved it as a .jpeg...and probably with your PC's basic paint program. Save it as a bitmap and then upload it to photobucket. Photobucket's system can convert bitmap's into jpeg's without the jpeg's losing any quality whatsoever. In essence, photobucket can keep it looking like your actual username.

Will do.

As I said, the disclosure project makes no logical sense. The guy says he has access to these amazing technologies but for some reason the disclosure project has not actually disclosed anything about how they work. It's so blatantly a load of BS that it's not worth thinking about.

It's most likely just another bunch of loonies like all the other American bunches of loonies. Just think of scientology; now a major religion. 500 people means nothing. A billion people believe in the Koran. That doesn't sway my knowledge that it's a load of bollocks.

Free energy is impossible, the first Law of Thermodynamics has never been observed to have been violated, there has been no mechanism published by the disclosure project or anybody else by which the Law could theoretically be broken, zero point energy extraction is impossible by its very definition, all of the above statements are incontrovertibly true, end of.

Originally Posted by Xei

As I said, the disclosure project makes no logical sense. The guy says he has access to these amazing technologies but for some reason the disclosure project has not actually disclosed anything about how they work. It's so blatantly a load of BS that it's not worth thinking about.

It's most likely just another bunch of loonies like all the other American bunches of loonies. Just think of scientology; now a major religion.

other people seem to be saying think of scientology. but I honestly don't know enough about it to compare it to anything else. I mean, from what I understand about scientology, it shares some eastern beliefs. and where it gets shady, is in its church structure.

people talk about scientology as something that is outwardly manipulative, and I'm not sure why

Originally Posted by juroara

people talk about scientology as something that is outwardly manipulative, and I'm not sure why

lawl.

http://video.google.ca/videosearch?q...ositions&emb=0

As an example,

Among these advanced teachings, one episode revealed to those who reach OT level III is the story of Xenu (sometimes Xemu), introduced as an alien ruler of the "Galactic Confederacy." According to this story, 75 million years ago Xenu brought billions of people to Earth in spacecraft resembling Douglas DC-8 airliners, stacked them around volcanoes and blew them up with hydrogen bombs. Their souls then clustered together, stuck to the bodies of the living and continue to do this today. Hubbard called these clustered spirits "Body Thetans," and advanced-level Scientologists place considerable emphasis on isolating these alien souls and neutralizing their ill effects.

It's just a huge pile of crazy which was created by science fiction writer Hubbard who actually once said "all the money is in religion". It's basically a crazy cult which has, and really only could have, become hugely popular in America.

well scientology has a bad rap, so I'm not going to argue with you there

but I think people jump to negative conclusions way too fast, just because, they are negative people. a lot of people sensed from Greer, some personal belief in his words. and some concluded "GASP HE'S A SCIENTOLOGIST"

why don't you just ask the man?

in his books, he tells you. and I remember it being the bahai faith. that would explain Greers views and why he feels that way about ETs. I can't speak for the rest of the speakers, no idea.

Originally Posted by juroara

well scientology has a bad rap, so I'm not going to argue with you there

but I think people jump to negative conclusions way too fast, just because, they are negative people. a lot of people sensed from Greer, some personal belief in his words. and some concluded "GASP HE'S A SCIENTOLOGIST"

why don't you just ask the man?

in his books, he tells you. and I remember it being the bahai faith. that would explain Greers views and why he feels that way about ETs. I can't speak for the rest of the speakers, no idea.

Look, scientology is pure evil. There's no way around it. They tell their members to suicide when they're no longer useful. They sue people for bashing their faith (something that religions constitutionally aren't allowed to do). They charge people MONEY for knowledge. LOTS of money. I'm talking millions here. They've murdered people. These are facts, whether you deny them or not.

There are very good alternatives to the energy that we use.

here is a working magnet motor.

That's interesting, ranma. I think that motor is a good example of something that might appear to have nearly perpetual motion, but that can't do real work. I would like to see what would happen if someone attached a drive shaft and wheels to it.

Originally Posted by drewmandan

That's interesting, ranma. I think that motor is a good example of something that might appear to have nearly perpetual motion, but that can't do real work. I would like to see what would happen if someone attached a drive shaft and wheels to it.

well it's just a prototype. If people got together and had an "open" project to build on the technology I'm sure something could be accomplished. I remember seeing a video that australian people were working on it or something.

So many grammar errors Ahhhh! Can't....finish..it!

One thing is for certain ranma. That video will never make international let alone national news.