Thread: Natural lucid dreamer - I want it to stop, can you help?

Hm, have you tried just not doing anything? What if you just "zoned out" during your dream as if you were daydreaming in real life (to let the dream take over)? Have you ever gone to sleep in a dream? Maybe it could confuse your brain enough to let you dream without lucidity for a while. Just spitballing here, I have no idea how those things might play out for someone in your situation or someone just more experienced than I am...

I recently read a similar thread and another member suggested to learn to be an observer of your dream rather than control it, with the idea being you will let the dream do all the work and your consciousness can rest.

I have tried zoning out. It works a bit. I have not tried going to sleep in a dream. That sounds like a great idea! I'm doing that tonight, for sure.

About the observer thing, even if I stay an observer, I'm still conscious, so still unrested the next day. I need to get to a place where I'm not at all involved in the dream, or that I don't even realize I'm dreaming.

I realize that this may seem, maybe, insulting, because you are a group of people who are striving to achieve what I can achieve naturally, but I came here because it's about CONTROL. I don't have control, and I'm exhausted. I need advice on how to be in control. You guys seem to know a lot about controlling this state. I just want it to work in the opposite direction for me.

I don't find it insulting at all, maybe a little odd since honestly some of the things you described sound great. But I understand where you're coming from and I've seen others express the same concerns before, so it does make sense to come here. I feel confident someone here will have a method that will help.

Maybe I didn't really explain the observer method right. I'm hoping the member who said that will pop up and explain it better because I can't remember who it was, I tried to find the thread but I'm not having any luck right now.

I'm also wondering if a (natural) sleep aid could help? If I remember correctly the lucid dreaming occurs during light sleep, so maybe the right tea or herb could put you in a slightly deeper sleep where it won't be an issue.

Hi, my initial reaction was also to suggest trying to go to sleep in your lucid dream.
Another thing that may be helpful is to try breathing through your right nostril, as that helps access the rational part of the brain as opposed to the creative (block the left nostril while breathing) [I think that's the nostril to use? if I got it mixed up someone please let me know]. Are you right or left handed?

Also, try doing a search on google scholar for scientific journal articles that have done research on this subject...if you don't have access to the journal, pm me the name of the article and I can get it for you.

I think you can train yourself to dissolve the dream imagery and rest in dreamless sleep, right ? You can close your dream eyes ( not necessarily go to bed ).

Then, if imagery arises again from this substrate consciousness, either close your eyes again or dissolve it otherwise if you can.

Now, you are still conscious, but now you are in dreamless sleep and not disturbed by imagery. I don´t know how to shut down consciousness -otherwise i would choose not to do it many times

Orenda, have you ruled out other causes for your tiredness, such as sleep apnea, inadequate nREM sleep, waking consistently in wrong part of sleep cycle? It could be that you are a natural lucid dreamer and are too exhausted and can't get enough rest from sleep, but there might not be a simple causal relationship there - there may be another cause for your exhaustion. Have you seen a doctor to look for sleep anomalies? Have you considered participating in a sleep study where you sleep in a lab while monitored? I am just saying that I would not assume that being lucid so frequently is what is what is causing your exhaustion. It might not be.

If this is affecting you in your waking life, one temporary solution is to take (non-prescription) drugs that will suppress your ability to experience REM sleep. No REM sleep = no vivid lucid dreaming (I think).

Thanks for all your input, it is really appreciated. I'm going to try your suggestions. Thanks so much!!

I really like the idea of going to sleep in your dream. Or even meditate. Sit under the tree in some tranquil place with eyes closed and rest. Go to space, find a quiet corner and sleep. Make your own "quit zone", build your house someplace, that will be your haven, where you can rest undisturbed.

Another idea mentioned here I liked, is to wipe away all dream imagery. Maybe keep a bed.

There is this supplement called 5htp. It inhibits REM in the first part of the sleep, only to give you REM rebound in the later part. It's not ideal for you, but perhaps at least first few hours of sleep would be restful. Btw, drinking a glass of vine would probably do the same thing.

I would not recommend anything that would take away your REM all together. That would be dangerous, as our body and mind needs both NREM and REM stages.

Good luck, I hope you find a solution to this.

The sheer amount of natural Lucid Dreamers saying this is sickening. You literally have the most freeing talent in the entire world and can use it more and to a fuller extent than 99% of the world, yet you decide that you hate it? The logic does not compute.

Try to meditate within a dream.

You will reach a higher plane of existence and your awareness will go to a place of nothingness, peace and bliss... it will not be exhausting because you will be in the here and now and you will be sitting in eternal silence and darkness... remain that way till you wake up.

I am also a natural lucid dreamer as well as an Astral Traveler It works.

I'm sorry guys, I'm with Yost on this; the OP simply does not make sense.

How can you be a natural LD'er for almost four decades and not achieve any control? Not just control, but powerful control ought to have developed by accident at this point. Anecdotally, when I was in my 20's I was having about 100 LD's per month, and could not help but begin controlling things after just a year or so -- not doing so over the course of decades simply seems unimaginable -- like a healthy person growing to adulthood without ever learning to walk, or perhaps to see. Like it or not you should be a god in your dreams by now, Orenda; that you claim the opposite is extremely puzzling.

Indeed, the OP's very wording doesn't seem to track with what a person who has been granted an entire second lifetime might say. I have spoken to many "naturals" over the years, and am very close to being one myself, by some measures (though my skills were all learned), and phrases like "so vivid and so conscious" are just not used by them in this context (naturals who spend all their REM-time self-aware have so much experience that vividness is not impressive, and there would be no need to mention a given like consciousness, much less "so conscious"). Very puzzling.

I am also pretty sure that LD'ing has little impact on getting rest. Your brain and body are still going about their rehabilitation process regardless of whether you are lucid or not; there is no reason to wake up exhausted, and consciousness is not a muscle that needs to be rested. In fact, one reason we have dreams at all is likely because our consciousness remains quite active even when we sleep, lucid or not. Sleep is for the body, not the mind.

Sorry, Orenda, it just doesn't all add up. If you truly are a "natural," then I suggest you take JoannaB's advice and look elsewhere for help, because your exhaustion likely has nothing to do with lucid dreaming.

Sorry also for all about the negativity this post; I guess I was a little bothered that all the good people here were wasting their time offering (very good) advice to a person who might not need it at all. Maybe I'm just a little tired of these sorts of claims. Maybe I'm wrong; I sincerely hope so.

I don't see any negativity; you are simply saying what needs to be said. These are extraordinary claims, so there is no harm in asking critical questions. That said, I have only been here at DV for a few months and have already seen two or three threads like this. It doesn't strike me as being very likely to say the least. If it's true, then it's true, but I see no reason to think so.

Sageous, it was my understanding he wasn't talking about dream control but control over the general sleep process. If that was the case he wouldn't be able to try half the things suggested here... I could be wrong though. I theoretically agree with you on LD not having anything to do with restfulness but I did experience feeling tired after LD before, and I haven't done it frequently enough to know for sure if it was related. I dunno. There could very well be a different cause, but my line of thought was that if Orenda thinks this is the reason, at least he could try having non-lucid dreams for a while and then know for sure whether it is or is not the cause. If not then no harm done and he moves on to another strategy. I do agree that JoannaB gave some good advice that should be looked into.

On that note Orenda I don't now how your sleep schedule is but mine is pretty whacky, I might sleep 4 hours one night and 12 the next and as a result I do often feel tired. I assumed you had ruled out causes like that but... Well, the importance of having a "regular" sleep schedule can't be overstated. Oversleeping can cause problems just as easily as not sleeping enough.

^^ I can see how you draw that conclusion, Duke396, and I suppose you could be right.

However, when someone writes a sentence like, "...I came here because it's about CONTROL. I don't have control, and I'm exhausted," with "control" in caps, I'm led to believe that he's suggesting a lack of control in dreams. I suppose it could certainly have been about controlling his general sleep process, and that my reading comprehension skills went on the fritz again. But on rereading his three posts, I still can see how he might be asking about control in the dreams -- or reverse control, as it were, because Orenda wants to not LD anymore. Funny thing is, that would involve control as well, because he would need to learn to cease paying attention in his dreams, which would be a form of control.

I do agree that it would be a good idea for Orenda to work on having non-lucids, though, if only to see if he gets rest that way.

Regarding consciousness making you tired: Though I too have felt tired (dazed is probably a better word) after particularly powerful LD'ing sessions, I have chalked it up not to being lucid in the dream, but to the intensity of the experience. I have far more often felt quite rested and invigorated after LD'ing sessions -- no matter how long. In my experience, just being self-aware in the dreams has little to no effect on my body's actual sleep. I'm also pretty sure that this has been held up as true by LaBerge & Co, though I don't have time to search for proof of that. All in all, I'm still pretty sure LD'ing has no effect on overall sleep health,

And again: everyone's consciousness is active all night, whether lucid or not during REM; just because you're naturally lucid doesn't mean your consciousness is "working" harder. I really think that if his complaint were sincere, Orenda would need to look elsewhere for a solution.

If you're tired from lucid dreaming. Then I suggest you try meditation while lucid. I too get tired when I have a lot of lucid dreams. However, when I meditate while lucid, I actually get better sleep than I ever have. It's not easy though. You have to find something to anchor yourself to otherwise you'll wake up. I usually anchor to falling and just fall endlessly through space. The sensation is strong enough that it keeps me anchored in the dream, but doesn't really interfere with anything. Give it a shot. It'll also make it to where dream control becomes increasingly effortless so you'll actually be more rested even when you don't meditate. It's a win win.

Originally Posted by Orenda

I've always been a lucid dreamer. I still remember dreams from when I was a little kid. I became aware of what it was in my teens. I'm in my late thirties now and I'm totally exhausted. I just want it to stop.

My dreams are so vivid and I'm so conscious during them that when I wake in the morning I feel like I've lived a whole other life overnight.

I have dreams that can go on for days. I start a dream, wake up, go about my day, go back to sleep and can just pick up from where I left it the previous day.

Sometimes it can be cool (flying!!!) but most of the time I just wake up mentally tired from everything I did while I was asleep.

I feel like my consciousness just doesn't get to rest, ever. If you have any suggestions on how to shut down my consciousness while asleep, I would be eternally grateful.

I am being lazy. I didn't read this thread or all its replies.

I just want to say, why in the ever-loving name of Dog would you want to STOP???!!!

Seriously, it's like being Superman and able to do pretty much whatever the heck you want to!

But your solution is very simple and I'll be nobody mentioned it. Meditate. Seriously. Just go to sleep, and when you find yourself dreaming, sit down, close your eyes and simply meditate. Focus on your breathing, or any natural movement of your dream body, or any natural exterior sounds like wind or rain.

As far as being exhausted by your dreaming activities that is impossible. If you are exhausted after sleeping, it is because you exercised too late, took something to put you to sleep, are not getting enough Vitamin D, at too late, are going to bed too late or too early, or are simply not dealing with the stresses of the day before your go to bed.

You have to have about 2 hours of relaxing downtime before you go to bed. No food, no sugar, no caffeine. No TV, no computer - don't check your Facebook account or email. READ! If you have someone you are in a relationship with, give him or her a massage and receive one. Heck, have sex then just lie there holding each other. But sexual activity, singular or with partner(s) is probably not the best either. Really you should just be meditating or reading. Something relaxing. You need to work out the stuff of the day - stress and otherwise.

Really, meditating both before you go to sleep, and during your dreams, is idea. In fact, if you have very vivid dreams, create a special, relaxing place for you. Where you can be massaged, sit in a hot tub, go swimming with or without dolphins, maybe do Qi Gong or Tai Chi or some other slow, meditative exercise with or without a teacher. A sacred place that you can look forward to when you go to sleep. Plant a Dream Tree, by moving water or something, and just sit there, eyes closed.