Thread: Subconscious Limitations

Originally Posted by milans

6. This one is a more personal question. If you had the knowledge that everyone and everything around you was a projection of yourself and you were in a lucid state, able to do anything you want, would you be able to cope with it for all eternity? Knowing that in 'reality' you're really the only person there. Forever. Alone. Unable to escape. Or would you be happy? You have your own little 'dimension' to play in for eternity. Assuming my 4th question is possible, you'd be happy forever... and if you're happy, who cares, right?

I don't have much to add to what you've said, but I just wanted to thank you for such an insightful post. Also, point #6 is something always on my mind. It bothers me, too. How can we really know? :/

Originally Posted by MoonageDaydream

I don't have much to add to what you've said, but I just wanted to thank you for such an insightful post. Also, point #6 is something always on my mind. It bothers me, too. How can we really know? :/

Well, to put it bluntly, we can't know. And never will. Even if we were introduced to a new sort of sense which defines for us a new reality and a different perspective on how we perceive things, some would believe that this new sense is an illusion or the creation of our mind. Same goes with anything else that is new and unfamiliar. If we are given unlimited power to do anything, then limitations don't apply and anything goes. "But what if someone goes to your dream and changes everything, shows you things you could never have imagined before and proves to you, undoubtedly, that he/she is in fact, not of your creation?" - This is exactly what I mean. We have no boundaries, that is the flaw. Who is to say that person is NOT your creation? Your subconscious mind is capable of many great things, more greater than anything you can come up with. What if your mind created this person that is MEANT to say the things they say, that is MEANT to prove the things they prove? It's an endless cycle of questions, and who can break this cycle? Only you. Choosing how you perceive things is something you can change entirely. In fact, it might be best to perceive all dream characters as real. Which makes me question whether when they are created, they are given a conscious mind just like we have (perhaps we gave them a little of ourselves). I've read about bizarre dream characters, doing bizarre things and talking as if they are real people. And then there are the dream guides. Some takes the bizarre dream characters as extremely realistic creations of the mind, and some take them, same as the dream guide, as real people who are real beings or are also dreaming as we are. It is the same as before, perception plays a key role here and it still changes nothing no matter how we choose to perceive.

It's funny isn't it? But there's no need to worry about this now. As far as I know, lucid dreams in the waking life aren't as powerful as they could be. We know when we are dreaming, sometimes we feel no pain, sometimes logic just doesn't apply and we instantly recognise we are in a dream. But it's the potential for what it could be that gives it the drive. If we couldn't wake up from a lucid dream and were 'trapped' (or freed) there for all eternity, then I believe we would only get stronger and stronger, trained like a muscle, when it comes to control, logic and reason. Eventually coming to where we could simulate reality to the point where it becomes unquestionably real. But then that might never happen.

Anyway, this is just what I believe. And since we are here, now, I have an understanding that we chose to be here. And that if the presumed "eternal lucid dream" was truly eternal, we'd still be there now and reality wouldn't exist. Unless we are still there now.

Oh and no need to thank me. Well, to best honest, I just wish I didn't have to think about these things. The more you dwell in it, the more questions begin to arise. And the worst part is; there are no real answers. But whichever the case, however we perceive it, I believe all roads lead to a positive conclusion.

1.would it be possible to achieve such stability and realism in a lucid dream to the point where you would never EVER be able to recognise the difference? Every single individual acts as expected (and sometimes unexpected of course, but not to the point of breaking realism). The only difference being is that you have this knowledge.

It would no longer be considered a dream then. In a rudimentary formula:

D= [(P-Sut)/(AMe)] or translated Dreaming= (Perception minus Sensory Input under threshold) dividing by Autobiographical Memory expression

(Yes I made that up ^^); (And yes, I do wonder if you can dream without autobiographical memory....I think you can....and patients that can't form new memories can still dream with new content...)

Altering the formula would fundamentally change the experience: In order to eliminate any change of volatile sensory input (don't even think it's possible), you'd change to control the dream entirely, and that just wouldn't work. That's the big difference between it and waking life: in the later one your perceptual processes are restrained by sensory input being conveyed by matter.
That also brings us another issue that is explored in the movie Inception: if such realism was achieved, how could you tell you had woken up for real? Many people would actually end up in the same existential trap as Mal did.

2. But what if we were to CHANGE ourselves? Change the way we think, change our memories so we forget specific things, choose to become smarter, basically change our entire identity. I understand these things are probably not carried into waking life, but my question remains within the lucid dream itself, and I'm talking permanent change - not temporary.

The short answer is yes, it is indeed possible: theoretically exposure therapy can be applied in lucid dreams, and many other forms of medical care could be applied as well. There's even a study by Sidarta Ribeiro which explores physical coordination through the practice of lucid dreaming. and we're only scratching the surface. The big obstacle here towards the validity of these methods is somewhat obvious: we don't possess a reliable and quick way to induce lucidity on individuals, and most of these methods require consistency over time. If you skip this step, then sure, we know for a fact that just the act of thinking can impact cells to some degree. Hell, even some people use lucid dreams to practice skills (many of us are practicing for the day they invent anti-gravitational devices that will make us be able to fly like super-man )

3.Asking your subconscious to 'design' or 'choose' the BEST answer. Let's say you wanted to think up, or create, a certain individual using your personal preferences. Using the example of attractiveness, if you were to tell your subconscious mind to think up the most attractive individual you could EVER possibly think up of, would it work as expected?

Your subconscious is already "hearing you" all the time. Besides, it's not an entity but a bunch of processes that escape your normal awareness. It would be like telling your brain stem to breathe in the most appropriate way possible: he'd be like "Dude, I already know what I'm doing, I'm going to keep functioning the way I think I should!". In your specific case, all your brain is doing is attempting to retrieve the most significant memories, it's not choosing what image to put in front of you (this is actually a good dream control trick: going with stronger/more realistic memories tends to help than screaming "Subconscious, turn the sun into a 1km ball of ice with 3 layers of my favorite icecream topping!".

4. I was wondering if you could 'permanently' change your emotion. So let's say you want to always be happy or even depressed forever, would that be possible? I believe so, though I haven't tried.

No. First of all, emotions aren't long-lasting (for the most cases). Second of all, even if you did (let's say you managed to find a way to stay in a dream for 20 years), chances are the behavioral response to stimulus would be reverted. Besides, "happiness" is a very controversial thing to define.

5. Have you tried asking the subconscious mind about reality and the way things work? Asking things such as certain chemical elements or the way a chemical ingredient would react with one another. I'd expect things to act the way you'd expect it to act. But try some of these things in waking life and see if it is true. Almost as if 'borrowing' information from life itself.

Same situation as 3. Besides, even if you could get information from your dreams, it's not a falsifiable theory: how could you prove it was your subconscious giving you information and not a mixture of memories being replayed in scenario with less logical constraints?

6. Meh, personal question I'll pass xD Hope this helped

Originally Posted by Zoth

It would no longer be considered a dream then. In a rudimentary formula:

D= [(P-Sut)/(AMe)] or translated Dreaming= (Perception minus Sensory Input under threshold) dividing by Autobiographical Memory expression

(Yes I made that up ^^); (And yes, I do wonder if you can dream without autobiographical memory....I think you can....and patients that can't form new memories can still dream with new content...)

Altering the formula would fundamentally change the experience: In order to eliminate any change of volatile sensory input (don't even think it's possible), you'd change to control the dream entirely, and that just wouldn't work. That's the big difference between it and waking life: in the later one your perceptual processes are restrained by sensory input being conveyed by matter.
That also brings us another issue that is explored in the movie Inception: if such realism was achieved, how could you tell you had woken up for real? Many people would actually end up in the same existential trap as Mal did.

That's a quite interesting way of putting it. I'm no expert on the matter or anything, so I can't really say anything much against it. But it makes sense, if I understand correctly.

Originally Posted by Zoth

The short answer is yes, it is indeed possible: theoretically exposure therapy can be applied in lucid dreams, and many other forms of medical care could be applied as well. There's even a study by Sidarta Ribeiro which explores physical coordination through the practice of lucid dreaming. and we're only scratching the surface. The big obstacle here towards the validity of these methods is somewhat obvious: we don't possess a reliable and quick way to induce lucidity on individuals, and most of these methods require consistency over time. If you skip this step, then sure, we know for a fact that just the act of thinking can impact cells to some degree. Hell, even some people use lucid dreams to practice skills (many of us are practicing for the day they invent anti-gravitational devices that will make us be able to fly like super-man )

Reassuring. Though I didn't mean to translate our abilities or skills that we learnt in a dream over to the waking life. I was just curious as to whether, when we are fully ourselves (I know sometimes in some of my dreams, I'm not even me, and I rather feel like I'm viewing and experiencing things through others' viewpoint), if we could change the way we think, our personality and traits, or even our memories and make it stay that way permanently, in a dream. It won't translate to reality (probably), and I'm aware of that, but that's no issue. I read somewhere a certain individual was training for a test they were going to have tomorrow, and when they woke up, everything they learned during training within the lucid dream stayed with them in the waking world. So I'm fully aware that lucid dreaming is a great tool used for learning and practicing.

Originally Posted by Zoth

Your subconscious is already "hearing you" all the time. Besides, it's not an entity but a bunch of processes that escape your normal awareness. It would be like telling your brain stem to breathe in the most appropriate way possible: he'd be like "Dude, I already know what I'm doing, I'm going to keep functioning the way I think I should!". In your specific case, all your brain is doing is attempting to retrieve the most significant memories, it's not choosing what image to put in front of you (this is actually a good dream control trick: going with stronger/more realistic memories tends to help than screaming "Subconscious, turn the sun into a 1km ball of ice with 3 layers of my favorite icecream topping!".

I'm not entirely sure you understood what I meant with the question, or I misunderstood your answer. I don't believe 'asking', and I mean metaphorically, not actually screaming or anything unless you want to, has anything to do with your memory. But what I meant is making it happen. Let's say you want to taste the most delicious ice cream that could ever possibly 'exist', just simply ask for it and your subconscious would, by all its experience, design the most perfect, flawless ice cream it could come up with. I was just wondering if that would work as expected, if anyone has tried it. I'm thinking some may have complications especially when it comes to taste.

Originally Posted by Zoth

No. First of all, emotions aren't long-lasting (for the most cases). Second of all, even if you did (let's say you managed to find a way to stay in a dream for 20 years), chances are the behavioral response to stimulus would be reverted. Besides, "happiness" is a very controversial thing to define.

That's a little upsetting, though I see where you're coming from. I'm sure there are other ways of doing things at least. With "happiness", of course I meant whatever makes one happy by what they perceive as happiness. Others may have a different definition of things, but we all recognise the words and its meanings, and it all goes back to the root and the experiences felt.

Originally Posted by Zoth

Same situation as 3. Besides, even if you could get information from your dreams, it's not a falsifiable theory: how could you prove it was your subconscious giving you information and not a mixture of memories being replayed in scenario with less logical constraints?

6. Meh, personal question I'll pass xD Hope this helped

Yeah but that's what I meant, that's why you borrow this information that you know completely nothing about, not even seen with a glimpse, just to prove the experiment. And if your subconscious has never even seen it before, then you'd know it's not a memory.

And yep, it helps a lot. I always appreciate knowledge from others, so thank you.

if we could change the way we think, our personality and traits, or even our memories and make it stay that way permanently, in a dream

If you got stuck in a dream for several years, maybe...but you can't change your personality/trait/memories (temporarily or permanently) in the span of a dream: neuronal connections take longer to change to that extent.

I was just wondering if that would work as expected, if anyone has tried it. I'm thinking some may have complications especially when it comes to taste.

Oh I see. Can't comment then: I never tried it, I simply seek the food I feel like tasting But remember that you're never asking your subconscious anything: think of it like your thoughts were materializing in front of you, that's a much closer metaphor. The thing is, you never know what made you think that way ^^

And if your subconscious has never even seen it before, then you'd know it's not a memory.

That's exactly my point: you can't never prove you have never seen that. Besides, for it to be a legitimate experiment, you'd have to run multiple cases, and I can almost assure you dream content would give you different results: recreating the same visual response especially with detailed stimulus is almost impossible, especially because you alter your memories every time you interact with them.

Once again, don't forget you're alone in your dream Variance within dream content expression (especially when compared to waking life) is probably just the result of differentiated brain activity.

Originally Posted by milans

4. This question goes well with the 2nd question. I was wondering if you could 'permanently' change your emotion. So let's say you want to always be happy or even depressed forever, would that be possible? I believe so, though I haven't tried.

I think it's very possible. You cannot change all outside circumstances (in this waking reality, anyways), but you can change how you perceive them - your outlook. I think the key is a lot of humility, detachment, and wisdom/enlightenment. Have no expectations, no mindset, and almost anything can be seen as positive.

Budhhas are often described as being love. I imagine they are always feeling the emotion love, because they see through the world, and, because they want to!

Originally Posted by milans

2. Changing yourself. I haven't seen much topics of this but it's quite important to me. All we ever do in lucid dreams is explore, play around, or become at peace with oneself - occasionally experiment, I guess it's up to the individual. But what if we were to CHANGE ourselves? Change the way we think, change our memories so we forget specific things, choose to become smarter, basically change our entire identity. I understand these things are probably not carried into waking life, but my question remains within the lucid dream itself, and I'm talking permanent change - not temporary.

This is one of the foundations of Tibetan dream yoga; engaging the dream in positive ways, and slowly breaking down mental conditioning to allow one to realize that our emotions, and all of the phenomena one experiences in waking life are just as ephemeral as a dream. Dreams are perhaps more noticeably subject to mutability; people's faces often morph and change during a dream conversation, for example. On the other hand, when you are prepared to die, your life will seem as though it passed very quickly, and in a sense, it was all simply a dream. What does walking through walls over and over again teach us but that walls are often solid and impermeable, but not always? Quantum physics in action!

But more "scientifically," any time you continuously perform an action, it builds a habit. So let us say that in your lucid dreams, you quit your job 27 times in different dramatic and momentarily satisfying ways. It will change your outlook on quitting your waking life job, bit at a time. Will you necessarily quit your job? No, but I would argue that it becomes easier to perform such an action in waking life. You start to loosen up a bit and feel the insubstantial quality of things.

The same goes for being an a-hole to people in dreams. If you're an a-hole enough times, it becomes easier to be an a-hole in real life. Which is why Buddhist practice suggests being kind; build the habits that are helpful in waking life. I have learned that hostile people (in waking life) often respond to kindness in similar ways to hostile DCs: they stop what they are doing (at least momentarily) because they are not expecting kindness from you. Kindness is disarming. You are not only changing yourself--you might catalyze change in someone else as well. So try treating your dream boss with kindness and compassion!

I think your idea is great, though. I wish more people would approach lucid dreaming in terms of improving interaction with waking life. You start getting into the discussion of dreams of "wholeness," or seeking deep insight from dreams in order to improve the quality of daily life. Great post!

Originally Posted by Zoth

That's exactly my point: you can't never prove you have never seen that. Besides, for it to be a legitimate experiment, you'd have to run multiple cases, and I can almost assure you dream content would give you different results: recreating the same visual response especially with detailed stimulus is almost impossible, especially because you alter your memories every time you interact with them.

That's the point though. Let's say you and a couple of scientists are on the verge of a new discovery, but believe that something is missing. Now the thing that is missing, you never heard of it before, you've never seen it before, and yet you somehow managed to figure it out in a dream one night. You go to the scientists and tell them about your dream - they take it very serious and attempt to 'piece the missing puzzle together' using what you dreamt. And what do you know? What you just had a dream about turned out to be the answer to the thing that was missing. The subconscious had never heard or seen it before either. Now that would mean since we are part of the universe (or rather the universe is a part of us), that we have this connection to information from reality as if we are all connected as one. And the gateway is via our subconscious mind. Though I am doubtful this would work, I think it's a worthy experiment. I believe that this wouldn't exactly work as expected if it was a minor expectation asked by another person to guess what number he/she is think of or what they've written down in their notebook and the such. But rather I am open-minded to believe that we store vital information within ourselves from the moment we are born, and it is hidden deep within us - things like the secrets to the universe, how life works exactly, elements of reality, etc.

Originally Posted by MoonageDaydream

I think it's very possible. You cannot change all outside circumstances (in this waking reality, anyways), but you can change how you perceive them - your outlook. I think the key is a lot of humility, detachment, and wisdom/enlightenment. Have no expectations, no mindset, and almost anything can be seen as positive.

Budhhas are often described as being love. I imagine they are always feeling the emotion love, because they see through the world, and, because they want to!

Without directly forcing our emotions onto ourselves, I also think it's very possible too. And probably permanently. But one small adjustment and everything changes, to me it just seems kind of unstable (though I wouldn't know), as if you're indirectly forcing your emotions rather than just letting them come naturally. It just seems that way to me, but I don't think it is.

I'll try to be a bit more creative with it and probably mess up the wording; with all the gates being closed except one. The only gate that is left open is the happiness/love gate whilst the other ones are being denied and pushed away. To deny your other emotions, to me it's like denying a part of yourself... forcefully. But then, that might only be the beginning stages, and once you become an expert at it, your entire mindset and who you are changes. And rather than denying them or pushing them away, the negative emotions simply avoid.

Originally Posted by ThreeCat

The same goes for being an a-hole to people in dreams. If you're an a-hole enough times, it becomes easier to be an a-hole in real life. Which is why Buddhist practice suggests being kind; build the habits that are helpful in waking life. I have learned that hostile people (in waking life) often respond to kindness in similar ways to hostile DCs: they stop what they are doing (at least momentarily) because they are not expecting kindness from you. Kindness is disarming. You are not only changing yourself--you might catalyze change in someone else as well. So try treating your dream boss with kindness and compassion!

I think your idea is great, though. I wish more people would approach lucid dreaming in terms of improving interaction with waking life. You start getting into the discussion of dreams of "wholeness," or seeking deep insight from dreams in order to improve the quality of daily life. Great post!

Thanks. I agree with you entirely, which is why in one of my previous posts I talked about perspective and treating everyone as if they are real. Not forcefully believing it so, but rather changing your entire outlook. Hopefully by treating them real, you treat them with respect, dignity and kindness (like one should in waking life, right?).

Hm. I definitely agree you don't want to deny your emotions and that would be denying a part of yourself. I would consider more of a not feeling the emotion in the first place approach. For example, if I was insulted by someone I know about having a big nose in front of everyone at a party - I might normally feel shame. Maybe anger too. But, if I know the only reason they said it in the first place came from their own insecurity/jealousy, I might feel like it's a compliment in disguise, or feel nothing at all. Because I see through it. And because I know having a big nose doesn't define me as a person.

Or, if someone gives negative criticism that might normally evoke a negative emotion, but this time let's say it's got merit. You don't necessarily feel much negative emotion, because your pride/ego has collapsed, so you can pretty much take criticism from an objective viewpoint. No need to punish yourself if you were being your true self, and not trying to hurt anyone.

At least, this may be a good way to counter the emotion shame. I imagine it's probably similar with the other negative emotions.

Originally Posted by milans

6. This one is a more personal question. If you had the knowledge that everyone and everything around you was a projection of yourself and you were in a lucid state, able to do anything you want, would you be able to cope with it for all eternity? Knowing that in 'reality' you're really the only person there. Forever. Alone. Unable to escape. Or would you be happy? You have your own little 'dimension' to play in for eternity. Assuming my 4th question is possible, you'd be happy forever... and if you're happy, who cares, right?

Just had to say, personally I find this funny 'cause it's true, lol. But I don't really talk about it in public, wayyy too controversial for most people.

^^ I don't know, Mimi. I think if you started a thread basically announcing that #6 is true, and that the rest of us are all just projections of your dreaming mind, you might be surprised by the positive responses you get... regardless, it would be an interesting thread!

Originally Posted by milans

6. This one is a more personal question. If you had the knowledge that everyone and everything around you was a projection of yourself and you were in a lucid state, able to do anything you want, would you be able to cope with it for all eternity? Knowing that in 'reality' you're really the only person there. Forever. Alone. Unable to escape. Or would you be happy? You have your own little 'dimension' to play in for eternity. Assuming my 4th question is possible, you'd be happy forever... and if you're happy, who cares, right?

Would that really change anything? The people around you would still be the people around you. Even if they came from the depths of your subconscious they´re still different from you, say things you don´t know and would still seem like other people. Being secretly a part of you doesn´t devalue their company. If you guys would all turn out to be DCs that wouldn´t be a reason to treat you differently.

Things would get problematic if you would start to control this dream of life. The complete control over everything would be enjoyable at first, but you could quickly grow tired of it or even become addicted to it. A life without limits could become really empty.

Haha! I have some experience with these all.

For 1.- that is the only raeson I pursued LDing. Apart from my nightmares which were of monsters (And my first dream) EVERY dream I had was a perfect copy of waking life. So for several years while I was trying to learn how to become lucid (Would try in dreams too... mind you) I didn't know how to differentiate between the waking and the dreaming state. Kinda freaky and scary, so it made me obssessed with dream control for a very long time until I succeded with gravity RC.

For 2.- I made a command for my dreaming self when I created rules for DW. Basically, after I die in any dream it will constitute as a "real death". Where I lose every power I had until that point, the memories of the dream self that just died, the "ID" and well, everything that generally maintains itself between dreams. Upon my first dream death, it seems like the change was a bit extreme and made my dreams no longer be perfect FAs anymore. Also had some waking-life changes due to the memory loss, nothing major but it was there.

3.- Tried it and failed, but mostly because of the rules. I can't use passive control where I ask for something and it appears, need to conciously create everything I want.

4.- Haha! I know one other person apart from myself who have done this. Whereas I did it to feel more "negative" the other person worked on the other spectrum. It worked for me and gave me really bad weeks, so took the effect off. The other person had also trouble, being always happy/positive can be very disturbing and builds up far faster than negativeness. Imagine if your best friend were to suffer a big accident and all you do is laugh and feel like its the most awesome thing evur! Can you imagine the mental damage that would cause to others who watch you, let alone yourself? yep, not something people would want to experiment with.

5.- This one I do the other way around, mimic stuff I learn from waking in dreams in order to study, but I suppose it can be done easily. The problem being whether the data you get is accurate or not. I will lean towards not.

Eh, your personal question... you are the only creature there yes but you have infinite everything to work with. Creating more creatures won't be impossible some time in the future so if you feel like its lonely solve it.

I don't really know what I could say or hypothesize that would add to this except for one thing.

In response to changing personality and changing ourselves. I think that everything that you do changes who you are and how you react. If you don't like the way that you "react" to things, you can start "acting" on everything and change your personality (not like "acting like an actor", but don't let what happens around you make you do something, choose everything that you do). It takes effort at first, but after a long time of "acting" it will become your "reaction".

Basically, you are who you choose to be, if you don't feel like you have chosen who you are now and just let your surroundings shape you, then that was your choice as well.

You mention "changing to smart". This makes no sense to me. If you want to be smart in a certain area, then you learn that area. You cannot be smart in all areas in the world, leastways if you mean this in a "knowledgeable" type of smart. If you mean this in a "wise" (making good decisions) kind of smart, then I would recommend finding someone you think makes wise decisions and ask them. If you follow someone, you will end up in the same place they do. Mentally and physically. I do not think that I am wise (as mastermind pointed out, would make me a fool), but I think that if I do not choose things that I think are wise choices, then I am a fool of the worst variety. I try to make wise decisions based on decisions that others have made after seeing their results. Don't think that you can do something that someone else does and have different results, that is crazy.

2. Yes, you can change yourself. Can't really become smarter though, that doesn't really work.

I have altered unpleasant memories, but not to the extent that I want.
By that I mean;

I have this memory with the correct version of what happened, and the version I made up.
To this day, I still don't know which one is correct. I have no way of finding out either.
It's very stressful when I think about it, cause I know one of them is correct. That would make the other one false, but I do not know which to believe.

The moral of this story is don't fuck with your memories unless you know what the hell you are doing.


Another thing I forgot to mention;

I have this thing that I like to call Subconscious Motivation

I don't know how effective it is because there is no real way to really measure it.

Basically, I use it for school work. In my lucid dreams I tell myself who I want to be and what I want to make habit.

I used to be a B/C student, and now I have straight A's.

Not sure if it was due to the subconscious motivation, or just my... Well, conscious motivation.

See what I am saying?

Thanks everyone, these are great answers. Not much I can add anymore, I'm a little drained of the whole thing, and my curiosity is more than satisfied.

I agree to the whole idea of being 'smart' making no sense, but I used a poor example and explanation.

Originally Posted by SinisterDezz

I have this thing that I like to call Subconscious Motivation

I don't know how effective it is because there is no real way to really measure it.

Basically, I use it for school work. In my lucid dreams I tell myself who I want to be and what I want to make habit.

I used to be a B/C student, and now I have straight A's.

Not sure if it was due to the subconscious motivation, or just my... Well, conscious motivation.

See what I am saying?

Honestly, that's actually impressive.

Originally Posted by milans

Thanks everyone, these are great answers. Not much I can add anymore, I'm a little drained of the whole thing, and my curiosity is more than satisfied.

I agree to the whole idea of being 'smart' making no sense, but I used a poor example and explanation.



Honestly, that's actually impressive.

It's either me just becoming a better person, or me subconsciously making myself a better person.
Either way, I am content with the results.

Originally Posted by SinisterDezz

It's either me just becoming a better person, or me subconsciously making myself a better person.
Either way, I am content with the results.

You are who you choose to be, I think that LDing might be able to give us more choices than other people.