In my (probably evil) opinion, humans don't become people until at least birth, if not later. So I don't have a problem with embryonic stem cells, or fetal stem cells (not that there would be any advantage to waiting for a fetus). |
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Hey guys, |
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Goals
- Think of some more goals[]
In my (probably evil) opinion, humans don't become people until at least birth, if not later. So I don't have a problem with embryonic stem cells, or fetal stem cells (not that there would be any advantage to waiting for a fetus). |
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It's not like people are being treated with any sort of default dignity or respect anyways. I find it a little hypocritical to work so hard at protecting unborn children then treating them with total apathy after they're born. |
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Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.
That's interesting. |
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Goals
- Think of some more goals[]
Thankfully, there have been many technological advances on being able to induce stem cells using a patient's existing cells (several of which occurred this year actually), rather than using those derived from embryos. I don't have any problem with the use of embryonic/fetal cells myself, but I am glad to see that the way things are headed, it'll be an ethical issue consigned to history. |
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My daughter has Type 1 Diabetes, so naturally I am 100% in support of stem cell research. I've donated stem cells through umbilical cord blood collection before. The people who get the heebeejeebees over STR seem to forget that embryos arent the only source of stem cells. For that matter they are available in adults - the lining of the inside of your mouth for exaample? Swab a q-tip on the cheek, non-evasive collection there too. It's just an excuse for politicians to hold back cures, keep feeding the pharmaceutical companies - to even create a debate. And to do that, you have to withhold information from the public, because if everyone knew how non-evasive and harmless it was to collect stem cells without destroying human life, no one would even think twice about throwing money into the research. |
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That's just the problem with things like this. That's the effect that politics has. Once an issue is taken sufficient notice of, it becomes a big political buzz-point, and suddenly every politician has to have an opinion on it. Needless to say, politicians and the public usually don't interface in any means that supports detailed factually-driven discussions; it's all word games. The general public, for the most part, isn't going to go and seek out the facts. So they go on whatever tidbits they pick up along the way which, due to the way politics is presented through mainstream media, are usually factually incomplete or flawed. Beyond this point, politicians end up having to speak to these party-platform ideas that have been put out there to drum up support. This is how we end up with senseless dead-stop party-lines bickering instead of actual discussion on how to best approach problems and better our society, with no desire to find a solution that works for everyone.. Now perhaps you will understand when I tell you that American politics is a three ring circus. |
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I guess I also have a pretty evil mind when it comes to science, but stem cell research is something we need if we want to continue making medical advances. The medical knowledge that we have right now is good, and we might all get by on it for a while. But we really should try to get as far as we can so that we can continue to learn. I think that stem cell research will have application WAY beyond fixing diseases and saving lives, and that will be awesome for everyone. Some doctors think that through stem cell (and neuron) research, we can get parts like wings or cat ears (I like animé okay? xD) added to our bodies almost like tattoos. And amputees can get real limbs back! How awesome! But of course, it could be very far in the future. Of course saving people's lives is very cool too, but some people don't realize the scope of this. |
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My tasks:
Basic Summon []Super Speed []Fly []
I don't know much about stem cell research, why is it considered taboo? |
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The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended. - Frédéric Bastiat
I try to deny myself any illusions or delusions, and I think that this perhaps entitles me to try and deny the same to others, at least as long as they refuse to keep their fantasies to themselves. - Christopher Hitchens
Formerly known as BLUELINE976
The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended. - Frédéric Bastiat
I try to deny myself any illusions or delusions, and I think that this perhaps entitles me to try and deny the same to others, at least as long as they refuse to keep their fantasies to themselves. - Christopher Hitchens
Formerly known as BLUELINE976
Once something has a working central nervous system, I don't think we have the right to kill it. Certainly I think it's pretty obviously wrong to kill fully developed infants. But I don't think there's anything wrong with destroying embryos. I don't see how it's any different from killing a skin cell. And if you think otherwise, that kinda makes it a moral imperative for every woman to become impregnated as often as is humanly possible... which is silly. |
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Let's suppose for a moment that there is such thing as a soul. If there is, then... |
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How do you know you are not dreaming right now?
In psychology, very little can be said about what consciousness is other than a self monitoring and regulating function. There is no distinction exactly on the location of consciousness in the body or how exactly it functions. Therefore 'neurological capacity' in this context is rather mute. These functions currently are for the most part unknown to science. The will continue to be unknown until the subjective side of study is attempted. |
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Last edited by gab; 02-18-2013 at 07:37 PM.
The neurons involved in conscious experience have been identified. They are in the postcentral gyrus of the temporal lobe. They are formed very close to the beginning of the third trimester. |
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How do you know you are not dreaming right now?
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Neurons transmit sensory messages throughout the body to an from the brain not just from a specific part of the brain. It's misleading to suggest it's just from the temporal lobe part. As I said there is no specific part of the brain that psychologist can say that's where consciousness exists. That is made very clear in psychology and it's clearly going into the area of pseudo science when you suggest that you can locate consciousness or that it is within a specific organ or part of the brain because there is no research that verifies that and it's nonsense. Although such a thing would fit neatly into your atheism to identify a specific part it just doesn't exist because the brain and body is to complex for that. There are parts of the brain (Rectangular formation) that are very important for maintaining conscious functioning, but that's different to saying where consciousness exists from. The brain rather works parallel together with many specific functions that are inter-related at once. In addition to that you need a clear picture of quantum physics to understand the holographic model where you can reason how consciousness does not manifest out of matter but that matter manifests out of consciousness. |
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Last edited by knight31; 02-19-2013 at 12:44 PM.
Look here, neuroscientist skeleton posting dude. I learned the fact when I was in my senior year of college as a psychology major in my behavioral neuroscience class. It was in my textbook and the professor's lectures. My professor was the head of the psychology department. I didn't pull this out of my ass, like you pulled most of your post out of your ass. The neurons of the postcentral gyrus are responsible for the functions determined to be at the root of conscious experience, but of course they are dependent on other parts of the brain to function fully. The neurons of the region's sensory homonculus are necessary for the brain's mapping of sensory space. That is how the perception and therefore conceptualization of self is manifested. |
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Last edited by Universal Mind; 02-19-2013 at 09:35 PM.
How do you know you are not dreaming right now?
Psychology 19 years ago was much more in it's infancy than it is today. I hope you have been keeping up with the times. The root of "conscious experience' could really be defined as anything significant in the brain, including the rectangular formation couldn't it? Including the heart that beats the blood around the body. That's also essential to 'conscious experience' lol. That's not the same thing as talking about the location of consciousness, obviously. First you would have to define consciousnesses and little more can be said other than a self monitoring and regulating function. |
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No, not everything in the brain is at the root of conscious experience. A lot in the brain is involved, but the postcentral gyrus has been determined to be where the neurons at the seat of consciousness are located. Did you look at my sources? I also gave at least the framework for a definition of consciousness. The functions of the postcentral gyrus are the functions that create sense of self. And like I said, they cannot work alone. |
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How do you know you are not dreaming right now?
You realize that "sense of self" is not entirely what consciousness involves. Many animals have very little sense of self but are still evidently conscious. There is no "seat" of consciousness in any specific neurons in the brain and that's misleading. It's not in your source you provided. There is the varies nervous systems throughout the body from which neurotransmitters facilitate firing of specific signals to-from the brain which helps put together perceptions from which the brain decodes the environment and stimulus. But the intelligence and complex reasoning and thinking which the sense of self emerges from comes from the varies functions of the body and brain functioning together. The postcentral gyrus would no doubt be part of that process. But so would the other parts of the brain. It would be impossible to speculate on a specific spot from which that complex thinking resides. You are really grasping at straws with that one and I challenge you to give me any quote or anything specific relating to that that is precise. |
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