Thread: Practicing Wild with a lot of success looking for tips.

I could use some too. I've decided to drop the bullshit and practice WILD until I die, until I get it right.

Here are my tips for you:

#1. Never stop practicing. WILD is hard but it is not impossible.
#2. Learn to cope with boredom. The amount of time it takes for a WILD to take place is a real turn off, learning to cope with time can make the experience a whole lot better.

Thanks skullgunner,
So far WILD had given me the best experience. So I agree with you about contributing practice. Other methods do work, but they're kind of random. WILD seems to deliver more consistent results.

The biggest issue is to time it right. I have the best luck after about 7 hours of sleep. Be sure you sleep for about five or more hours then wake yourself up enough and try your WILD attempt. The reason this matters Is you ideally want to get into REM while still aware. That is important if you want to get vivid dreams with DCs and good graphics. You will be able to experience cool dream stuff like you did regardless, but nREM lucids are more tactile (feeling stuff) then visual, and less action and randomness happens. So figure out your own timing, after at least 4.5 hours of sleep.


Another thing is that you mention "I could not maintain it" and that may mean you are giving up to soon. A successful WILD can take an hour. The process may involve accidently waking a couple times, weird feelings coming and going, but you need to stick it out as long as you can. I have had amazing LDs that only hit REM and took off after an hour and a half.

Thanks sivason,

A lot of good advice. I have one question for you. How long do you stay awake before you WILD? I know results vary from person to person but I hear some people say a half hour works and others say stay up at least an hour.

Originally Posted by Chung

Thanks sivason,

A lot of good advice. I have one question for you. How long do you stay awake before you WILD? I know results vary from person to person but I hear some people say a half hour works and others say stay up at least an hour.

The issue is 'wil lyou fall back into normal sleep write away.?" You just get up make sure you are not giong to be all groggy, So, if after five minutes and a slap in the face with tap water, you are not worried about being too tired, then go for it. I often only spend about 10 minutes up, but each person will be different.

I'll be posting results here.

Last night was a distaster. I was having a nice dream when the 6 hour alarm clock rang. That's fine, but it was turned to mexican music and was blasted full sound. After that, I tried a WILD, but I was way too OCD about where my fingers went on the bed, so I rolled over and just tried to fall asleep and catch myself to WILD. It was going VERY good until my nose started dripping -_-.

Yeah I had some success this morning. I woke up around 6 then went back to sleep about 30 minutes later. I got to the stage where I was seeing HI but then fell asleep and had a nonlucid. It was a pretty vivid nonlucid though. Not sure if the WILD attempt had anything to do with that.

Originally Posted by sivason

The issue is 'wil lyou fall back into normal sleep write away.?" You just get up make sure you are not giong to be all groggy, So, if after five minutes and a slap in the face with tap water, you are not worried about being too tired, then go for it. I often only spend about 10 minutes up, but each person will be different.

I have to strongly disagree here. Maybe you're a heavy sleeper, but as a very light sleeper myself, I MUST be groggy to WILD.

It's ok to make generalizations, but only if you're correct...

Originally Posted by cmind

I have to strongly disagree here. Maybe you're a heavy sleeper, but as a very light sleeper myself, I MUST be groggy to WILD.

It's ok to make generalizations, but only if you're correct...

wow i am a light sleeper myself. i didnt know that was the case.

cmind, i would love to see you make your own tutorial. i and many others disagree with some of your views, but i really think it would help a vast amount of people, because you really seem to know what you're talking about.
just like the point you made there, i would never have known that. ive always been told to wake up.

anyways not my thread...
chung the above posters have covered all i could have thought of. good luck

Originally Posted by cmind

I have to strongly disagree here. Maybe you're a heavy sleeper, but as a very light sleeper myself, I MUST be groggy to WILD.

It's ok to make generalizations, but only if you're correct...

Hmmm, that is certainly a different take on it. With me, if I am very groggy, I usually drift off into true normal sleep and loose awareness. I don't have a problem getting my body to fall back to sleep, as I sleep pretty easily and will have only had say 6 hours sleep. If you are all groggy when you try to WILD, how do you prevent a quick loss of awareness? I normally would not generalize if I thought it was a point that had two sides, but in this case I did not realize anyone intentionally stayed groggy before the attempt. Interesting.

I never try to wake myself fully, but I need to make sure I am not half asleep. I just reach a point where going back to sleep would not be hard, but will not happen so fast that i loose awareness. I would not take a cold shower for instance.

Originally Posted by cmind

I have to strongly disagree here. Maybe you're a heavy sleeper, but as a very light sleeper myself, I MUST be groggy to WILD.

It's ok to make generalizations, but only if you're correct...

this was my thought exactly. As a light sleeper, I find it very hard to sleep again after I wake up, specially if I take a lot of time after waking up to take a piss and everything.

Also I have a huge question about this:

All my wild attempts stopped at the phase where I feel very numb, specially on my limbs but it doesn't escalate any more than that. Now comes my question: Am I supposed to regularly fall asleep at this stage ?? Or I am supposed to stay very alert at all times, and somehow I'll end up in a dream out of the blue? I really can't grasp the concept.

I need help on this topic because I just stand there for like an hour and nothing happens then I'm not sure what I should do.

Originally Posted by sivason

Hmmm, that is certainly a different take on it. With me, if I am very groggy, I usually drift off into true normal sleep and loose awareness. I don't have a problem getting my body to fall back to sleep, as I sleep pretty easily and will have only had say 6 hours sleep. If you are all groggy when you try to WILD, how do you prevent a quick loss of awareness?

Yes, well not everyone is one of those 'go into a coma' sleepers. I know people like that, and frankly they scare me.

How do I prevent loss of awareness? The whole idea of WILD is that you have to sacrifice some awareness temporarily to make the transition. All you really need is a thin stream of consciousness, which we call an "anchor", to carry you through to the dream. It's all in the guide in my sig.

Originally Posted by gndiego

this was my thought exactly. As a light sleeper, I find it very hard to sleep again after I wake up, specially if I take a lot of time after waking up to take a piss and everything.

Also I have a huge question about this:

All my wild attempts stopped at the phase where I feel very numb, specially on my limbs but it doesn't escalate any more than that. Now comes my question: Am I supposed to regularly fall asleep at this stage ?? Or I am supposed to stay very alert at all times, and somehow I'll end up in a dream out of the blue? I really can't grasp the concept.

I need help on this topic because I just stand there for like an hour and nothing happens then I'm not sure what I should do.

You need to be much, much closer to falling asleep when you try it, and you need to let your mind wander a lot more. Like I said above, the whole idea is to allow yourself to lose some consciousness but keep enough to stay aware.

As for feeling numb, that's nothing. Anytime you lie still long enough you feel numb due to lack of stimulus. Not related to sleep or dreaming at all.

I'm a groggy WILDer myself. My WBTB's consist of waking up, rolling over, and returning to sleep with my anchor in mind. That way success or failure always occurs within a few minutes and I lose no sleep. So I'm able to attempt upwards of 6 WILDs in one night with very little loss of sleep.

If I try to stay awake first it takes me 20-30 minutes to return to a state of mind where WILD is possible. Which to me is just returning to that groggy state of mind I was in immediately upon waking. For me a WILD attempt is pointless unless it's done at a time when I feel I can fall asleep at any moment.

Yeah i'll try the "groggy style" tonight. I think I was trying it while I was too far away from a sleeping stage and since I don't sleep easily I never could reach it. Also, I'm very used to always fall asleep while watching TV or something. It's crazy but it's hard as hell for me to just close my eyes and sleep, unless I'm very tired or (lol) drunk. Any tips on this?

If this doesn't work for me I'll give up WILD and try DIELD instead.

Interesting discussion. I've tried both methods since I've seen the different opinions posted. Going to sleep groggy almost worked. I got up, went to the bathroom and stayed up for about 10 minutes. When I went back to bed, it was hard to remain aware. I've been using a mantra that I find works for me: "Mind awake; body asleep". While doing this, I envision my veins full of white light. When I inhale, I say "mind awake", and imagine the light moving to a point on my forehead. When I exhale, I say "body asleep", and release the light out of my forehead and into the air. This visual came to me by accident during meditation one morning, and it seems to work for me. Anyway, when I went to bed groggy, my body was relaxed and it started to feel like I was floating out of my body, then my awareness faded and I fell asleep. This morning would have been successful if my dog had not woke me up. I stayed up for about 1.5 hours after 6 hours of sleep. When I went back to bed, I used my mantra and visuals. I felt the buzzing and vibrations and could see the HI (My HI always seems to look like I'm speeding through a tunnel) within probably 20 minutes. Then instead of floating out of my body, it felt like I wiggled out of my body. I wiggled until I was in a dream. I was with two friends and we were looking for something in some drawers. I found a clear grenade filled with jelly. I realized I was dreaming. A few seconds later, my dog jumped on me in my bed.

Something I noticed is that since I have been practicing WBTB WILD, one of two things will happen: I either go into the dream still conscious, or I go into the dream like its a normal dream, but I am more aware and notice things that are odd triggering lucidity.

One last thing. I know now why some people describe lucid dreaming as an OBE. Lately, before I go into a dream, if feels like I am literally moving out of my body.

As for as I am concerned we seem to be talking about two different types of WILD.

I think of the type were you stay groggy as DEILD, which certainly is a type of WILD. Cmind does not make it clear if he actually gets all the way out of bed or if like DMS111 he just barely wakes up.

The other type often talked about is WBTB. In WBTB I encourage you to actually wake yourself up.

The difference between the two, in my humble opinion, is a matter of how you intend on doing your WILD. With WBTB, where you get up and actually wake yourself, the intent is to preform a self induced trance state. In this meditation induced dream trance, a very high level of awareness can exist. It takes time to work, because you may not enter a dream quickly, but it allows for a high rate of success when you get it down. It also allows for stunning levels of concious awareness in the dreams. It has the problems of taking time, interupting sleep, and requiring a lot of practice and skill.


In DEILD, which is in my opinion, more the type of WILD cmind and DMS111, are talking about, there is again, pros and cons. The obvious pro side of it is that you do not interupt your sleep, and it is quick. It either works or it does not. The con side of it is that you are much more likely to just fall back into an unaware traditional sleep state. Also, as you never really gain fully awware waking conciousness, you can not bring it fully intact into the dream. If DEILD is done when you have woken from a dream, it is the best method. If you did not wake from a dream, it has a very high fail rate.

(Cmind, please cut me some slack, as I am trying to state "in my opinion" often.) In conclusion there are at least two very different types of WILD. WBTB is done fully aware after getting out of bed and clearing your head of the sleep/ groggy state. It can have a high success rate and brings fuller awareness into the dream. It takess more skill and is not an easy method to learn, but is great once you master it. DEILD is done without waking up at all. It is best to barely move and try as quick as possable to return to sleep, bringing a hint of awareness with you. It has a high fail rate, unless you woke from a dream, thenit is the best method around. It brings less awareness into the dream then WBTB.

Both WBTB and DEILD are considered WILD techniques and each has value.

Originally Posted by sivason

As for as I am concerned we seem to be talking about two different types of WILD.

I think of the type were you stay groggy as DEILD, which certainly is a type of WILD. Cmind does not make it clear if he actually gets all the way out of bed or if like DMS111 he just barely wakes up.

You don't know what you're talking about. I've done both WILD and DEILD many, many times and your condescension is not welcome. The assertions that you go on to make about the "limitations" of DEILD vs. WILD are laughable and wrong.

Just face it, sivason. You made a totally incorrect statement, I called you out on it, several other posters continued to call you out on it, and now you're throwing a tantrum because you don't have the self worth necessary to admit you were wrong.

I agree with ThAtaInTm I would love to see a guide or tips by cmind, maybe for once he could contribute to the community instead of being rude and disrespectful. As far as I'm concerned I didn't agree with sivasons post but that does not give me the right to say "you don't know what you're talking about". Cmind, in the end this forum is about learning and sharing so the next time someone's post is "laughable and wrong" how about you explain why that is and not just act like child.

Originally Posted by dutchraptor

I agree with ThAtaInTm I would love to see a guide or tips by cmind, maybe for once he could contribute to the community instead of being rude and disrespectful. As far as I'm concerned I didn't agree with sivasons post but that does not give me the right to say "you don't know what you're talking about". Cmind, in the end this forum is about learning and sharing so the next time someone's post is "laughable and wrong" how about you explain why that is and not just act like child.

Did you miss the guide in my sig? See, part of humility is knowing that there are others that know more than yourself. Mzzkc has written a guide that I can never top, so I refer to it. Now, if this forum is about learning and sharing, which I think it could be if certain toxic members didn't go around berating those they disagree with every chance they get, then all opinions should be welcome. Perhaps you should consider why you have resorted to name calling instead of explaining why I am wrong?

Originally Posted by cmind

Perhaps you should consider why you have resorted to name calling instead of explaining why I am wrong?

How about you re-read my post, I explained exactly why you were wrong. You made the assumption that sivason didn't know what he was talking about without justifying yourself. Your attitude towards other members prevents any kind of debate/conversation happening, neither you or the member you are replying to can progress because you are unwilling to explain your reasoning.
I would have been perfectly content if you had explained to us why sivason was wrong and what is right, but you didn't and you still haven't.
Anyways I do not wish to participate in any more useless discussion, I just hope you can become more polite towards other members, no one enjoys these threads.

Originally Posted by dutchraptor

How about you re-read my post, I explained exactly why you were wrong. You made the assumption that sivason didn't know what he was talking about without justifying yourself. Your attitude towards other members prevents any kind of debate/conversation happening, neither you or the member you are replying to can progress because you are unwilling to explain your reasoning.
I would have been perfectly content if you had explained to us why sivason was wrong and what is right, but you didn't and you still haven't.
Anyways I do not wish to participate in any more useless discussion, I just hope you can become more polite towards other members, no one enjoys these threads.

i do, it helps clear up alot of misinformation on these boards

For the record I wasn't calling out Sivason and I don't disagree with anything he said.

What I do is mostly DEILD, but sometimes I get up to use the bathroom first. That much movement I think negates the DEILD label.

When I WILD I first set my intention. Then I lay there and allow my mind to wander like I normally would when going to sleep. When the wandering becomes very noticeable I start using my anchor to refocus me. Usually simple counting. I'll lose count a few times as my mind wanders away from my anchor. At this point I can either focus on my anchor, or allow my thoughts to wander. Never both. But after a while my anchor will merge with my wandering thoughts. I'll be able to hold a steady count while my mind is bouncing around with random thoughts and some mild HI. At this point I don't really do anything else. My anchor is locked in and I just surrender myself while relying on my subconscious to take me where I want to go. At the moment sleep takes hold of me I feel a strong sense of awareness come over my previously groggy mind. I am reminded completely of what I am trying to do. Sometimes this shock of awareness is so strong that it fully wakes me up, so I have to remain as calm and passive as possible when it happens and just ride the HH into the dream.

Mine sounds quite a bit different from Sivason's method that seems to involve acute awareness throughout the whole process. I have to admit that his methods sound more elegant and might induce clearer lucid dreams at the start, but I have no complaints whatsoever about the clarity of mine. When my WILD begins I feel a few seconds of grogginess but after that I feel like I'm awake, except I know I'm in a dream. I can't imagine being any more aware. But of course I can't know whether a higher awareness is possible until after I've already experienced that higher awareness. If it's there.

*deleted-old news*

On-topic
DMS111, can you explain how you are defining DEILD? From my humble knowledge, you seem to be trying DEILD six times a night.

Thanks! You answered this before I even typed it!!!

Anyone who stays grogy, please explain the process, as it sound very different from what I am doing. WILD WBTB for me, is a formal meditation state in which I retain awareness and observe the proccess of my body going to bed. I try to bring full waking awareness with me. I do not engage my mind in though, but keep the full waking awareness.

Also, does anyone have a different experience about DEILD vs WBTB WILD pros and cons. Feel free to disect my post and tell me what you did not agree with.

Good bye, pretty thread, for now.