Is dreaming a product of the brain or are we in in an alternate reality?

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 02:14 AM

Do you think dreams are just a creation of our brains or are we really entering a different reality? I will give you what I think is going on when we sleep. I believe that when we are dreaming our consciousness is entering a new world all to together I don't believe it is created by the brain. Before I start I want to say that what I am saying is just a possibility I am not claiming it is fact. Alright lets start. First you must understand that EVERYTHING is energy. Matter is just condensed energy. The world is 99.9% empty space. So the question is why do things appear solid? Well it is because energy has a specific frequency a "vibration" if you will. Our bodies and the physical world vibrate at the same level. This is why things appear solid to the physical body. Let me give you a quick example. Ice vibrates slower than water. Since they are not vibrating at the same level water and ice don't appear to be solid to each other. They are out of sync with each other but the vibration of the water isn't high enough that it isn't a part of physical reality anymore.

Now then as for dreaming. When doing a WILD or DEILD most people feel the vibrations. The truth is our bodies are vibrating right now but we don't feel it we are too used to it. But during a WILD/DEILD we do feel them. Think of the vibrations as a radio channel. Change the vibration you change the channel. We are beings of consciousness and have the ability to change our vibrations. When we feel these vibrations we are literally tuning into a different reality. In this case the dream world. The dream world its self has its own vibration and it is most likely vibrating MUCH higher than the physical world. The reason I think it is higher in vibration is because you can change it with just a thought. Reality in a dream is more fluid where in the physical world it is a lot denser. You see our thoughts do affect physical reality too but since it is so dense it is not noticeable and as evidence I present this! https://witnessthis.wordpress.com/20...ter-molecules/

As I said earlier when doing a WILD/DEILD the most common symptom is vibrations. We feel these vibrations because dreams are much higher in vibration and therefore is a much more noticeable change in vibration compared to the density of the physical world. I understand not everyone feels these vibrations BUT they do feel some sort of phase change one way or another. Now we don't feel these vibrations under some circumstances. If you DILD you slept through the vibrational change so of course you don't feel them. If you don't feel them during a WILD perhaps you fell asleep for a second and slept through them then you wake up then enter a dream. But what is important here is the fact that we feel a vibrational change and that this vibrational change isn't physical in nature. Your body isn't really vibrating but it does feel like it. Perhaps it is ANOTHER body of a non-physical nature that is vibrating. I don't know if it is just me but when I first managed a DEILD shortly after I entered my dream the vibrations stayed with me for a bit before settling down. The vibrations are caused by us tuning into the vibrational frequency of the dream world.

Another reason why I believe dreams are a alternate reality is because of the possibility of people sharing dreams. I brought this up on my "What makes you think dreams are fake and waking life is real" post but it was sorta off topic and I didn't make a point of that in my OP. But I will do it here. I know there isn't super concrete evidence of being able to share the dream but despite this I am positive it is possible. Keep in mind I am not saying shared dreaming is true but if it was tested and prove it can definitely be a good sign dreams occur in an alternate reality. When sharing a dream two beings of consciousness are able to interact with each other and assuming both of them have great recall they will be able to tell each other exactly what happened as well as what each other did. It is IMPOSSIBLE for this to be a coincidence. You see its one thing when you have a dream with a friend you know and your friend has a dream about you but the theme is different but it is another thing if two people knew exactly what the other one did and the environment is the exact same. There is no possible way both of their brains just conjures up this scenario for both of them interacting with each other in the same dream environment. The ONLY possible explanation is that these two people are interacting on a different plane of reality that isn't physical.

So to sum of my reasons for believing why dreams are an alternate non-physical reality is this.

#1 You feel a non-physical vibrational change if not a vibrational change you feel some sort of phase change when entering the dream state with no lapse in consciousness. Remember everything is energy and everything has a vibration to it. The dream world is non physical and is of higher vibration.

#2 Impossible for a brain to come up with the exact same dream scenario for two different people. Even if they tried to induce a shared dream if dreams were just brain simulations then at the most these two people dream about each other but they will not have the SAME dream. Unless of course the dream world is an alternate plane of reality that we all tap into when we sleep...

Remember this is just my take on it and I am not saying that what I said is fact. The only fact is that everything is energy and everything has a vibration to it. And reality is 99.9% empty space. Might as well just say it's 100% empty space in my opinion. Other than that it is just my speculation. Please post what you guys think about this and please post what YOU think dreams are.

**Empedocles** · 08-02-2012 02:22 AM

Originally Posted by Daredevilpwn

Another reason why I believe dreams are a alternate reality is because of the so many instances of people sharing dreams.

What makes you think there are many instances of people sharing dreams? I don't see any evidence of that.

http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/shared...debate-120211/

http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/passwo...riment-134237/

Surely, if shared dreaming exists, then it is possible that some types of dreams might be an alternate form of reality. But until shared dreaming is in any way documented in a controlled study, your theories won't be taken seriously.

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 02:31 AM

Thanks for the links. Personally I don't care if people don't take me seriously. I just want to get people to think about the nature of reality and consider the big possibility that dreams are not limited to just being a brain thing. Now what do YOU think dreams are?

**Empedocles** · 08-02-2012 02:37 AM

Originally Posted by Daredevilpwn

Thanks for the links. Personally I don't care if people don't take me seriously. I just want to get people to think about the nature of reality and consider the big possibility that dreams are not limited to just being a brain thing.

That's all swell, but when you talk about shared dreaming being a fact (as you did in the other thread), then most of what you say after that statement cannot be taken seriously.

Now what do YOU think dreams are?

I believe there is more than one type of dream. Nonetheless, I firmly believe that 95% of dreams are the product of your mind. A mish-mash of our subconscious, conscious, wishes, worries, problems, goals, and day-residue.

Most of my dreams form in a very interesting manner: http://www.dreamviews.com/f45/how-my...s-form-114411/

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 02:43 AM

Originally Posted by Gills

That's all swell, but when you talk about shared dreaming being a fact (as you did in the other thread), then most of what you say after that statement cannot be taken seriously.

Sorry for the misunderstanding you see I didn't want it to make it come across of me saying shared dreaming is a fact. My purpose for talking about shared dreaming is to give an example IF shared dreaming truly existed. I never meant to make it seem like I said shared dreaming IS real without it even being proven yet. Sorry about that. But other than that what do you think about my theory? I think I made pretty good points. I'll edit that shared dreaming bit.

**Whattheboy** · 08-06-2012 08:07 PM

Why do some people like me, once had the same exact dream at the same exact time?

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-06-2012 10:13 PM

Originally Posted by Whattheboy

Why do some people like me, once had the same exact dream at the same exact time?

You should make a topic about this.

**Whattheboy** · 09-03-2012 07:23 PM

I should.

**jblb2424** · 08-02-2012 02:33 AM

I am not going to deny the fact that shared dreaming exists, because the brain is so complex and advanced, and we have yet to scratch the surface of it's capabilities. Also, lucid dreaming was highly debated in the past, but now it is proven, so theres no reason why shared dreaming should be marked as untrue. It is such a hard concept to prove since its inside your own mind and only you can experience it...so until we have some sort of devise that lets us view other people's dreams, than shared dreaming can never be proven. I am trying to keep an open mind about shared dreaming while staying somewhat skeptical. I don't let anyone tell me shared dreaming is or isn't real because they know just as much as i do about the topic

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 02:38 AM

It's always good to be a somewhat skeptical. Whatever your theory is. It would have the same chance to be just as right as mine or everyone elses.

**Empedocles** · 08-02-2012 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by jblb2424

I am not going to deny the fact that shared dreaming exists, because the brain is so complex and advanced, and we have yet to scratch the surface of it's capabilities. Also, lucid dreaming was highly debated in the past, but now it is proven, so theres no reason why shared dreaming should be marked as untrue. It is such a hard concept to prove since its inside your own mind and only you can experience it...so until we have some sort of devise that lets us view other people's dreams, than shared dreaming can never be proven. I am trying to keep an open mind about shared dreaming while staying somewhat skeptical. I don't let anyone tell me shared dreaming is or isn't real because they know just as much as i do about the topic

This shows that you haven't read this: http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/shared...debate-120211/

Because if you'd read it, then you wouldn't use the lame excuses that shared dreaming can't be proven in a study. Of course it can be proven, by two experienced shared dreamers transfering a password through a dream in a controlled setting. Now I am not going to get into this for the millionth time.

So far there hasn't been any evidence for shared dreaming aside from claims on internet forums.

Deal with it.

**jblb2424** · 08-02-2012 02:53 AM

Originally Posted by Gills

This shows that you haven't read this: http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/shared...debate-120211/

Because if you'd read it, then you wouldn't use the lame excuses that shared dreaming can't be proven in a study. Of course it can be proven, by two experienced shared dreamers transfering a password through a dream in a controlled setting. Now I am not going to get into this for the millionth time.

So far there hasn't been any evidence for shared dreaming aside from claims on internet forums.

Deal with it.

I was not putting shared dreaming down or denying its existence...actually quite the opposite. I believe shared dreaming exists more than i think it doesn't. I think you got the wrong message from my post. And i wasn't making any lame exuses to deny the fact that shared dreaming exists. I was simply explaining how it can be rather difficult to prove its existence because its all in your head and shared dreaming is for the most part spontanious. But i will check out the links you gave me. I hope you don't hate me

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 02:55 AM

Nah. I doubt he hates you. It was just a misunderstanding thats all.

**snoop** · 08-02-2012 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by jblb2424

I was not putting shared dreaming down or denying its existence...actually quite the opposite. I believe shared dreaming exists more than i think it doesn't. I think you got the wrong message from my post. And i wasn't making any lame exuses to deny the fact that shared dreaming exists. I was simply explaining how it can be rather difficult to prove its existence because its all in your head and shared dreaming is for the most part spontanious. But i will check out the links you gave me. I hope you don't hate me

I think you've got it backwards. It sounds as if Gills does not believe in shared dreaming, and telling you that as far as anyone is concerned at the moment, it isn't possible.

**dutchraptor** · 08-02-2012 01:10 PM

Originally Posted by Gills

This shows that you haven't read this: http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/shared...debate-120211/

Because if you'd read it, then you wouldn't use the lame excuses that shared dreaming can't be proven in a study. Of course it can be proven, by two experienced shared dreamers transfering a password through a dream in a controlled setting. Now I am not going to get into this for the millionth time.

So far there hasn't been any evidence for shared dreaming aside from claims on internet forums.

Deal with it.

Will you just leave already, you have added absolutely no contribution to the discussion. Firstly like jblb2424 has already put it in an excellent manner, either you believe in it or you don't, there is no direct evidence to prove or disprove its existence so no need to clutter up threads about it. Secondly this is the beyond dreaming section, 90% of the time theories here are not based on hard science. Thirdly Daredevilpwn has been extremely kind and patient with you and you just keep rambling on, he even stated this at the begining

Before I start I want to say that what I am saying is just a possibility I am not claiming it is fact

.

Just because you don't believe does not mean you have to be disrespectful. I personally don't know if shared dreaming is real or not but that doesn't mean I can't put my mind into a state where I assume it would be possible so I can help discuss with other members and not just create rows.

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 06:40 PM

Originally Posted by dutchraptor

she even stated this at the begining

Thanks for sticking up for me but I am a dude lol.

**dutchraptor** · 08-02-2012 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by Daredevilpwn

Thanks for sticking up for me but I am a dude lol.

Oops sorry dude, morning typo

no offense meant.

**Empedocles** · 08-02-2012 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by dutchraptor

Will you just leave already, you have added absolutely no contribution to the discussion.

Why be disrespectful?

**dutchraptor** · 08-02-2012 11:24 PM

Originally Posted by Gills

Why be disrespectful?

I'm guessing you didn't get past the the first sentence, I'm being disrespectful because so are you and I'm not gonna stand and watch how you bash in people's theories with non-relevant links to threads and saying that their theories won't be taken seriously. Anyways this discussion is over, if you have anything worthyfull to add to the thread I'd like to hear it and I will take you seriously.

**Xcuz** · 08-02-2012 04:37 AM

Well, just another theory about it. We can't be 100% sure what dreaming REALLY is, but we can make educated guesses. I think I'll stick to believing your theory since it sounds awesome. Although, how do you explain early REM?

**Daredevilpwn** · 08-02-2012 06:23 AM

Originally Posted by Xcuz

Well, just another theory about it. We can't be 100% sure what dreaming REALLY is, but we can make educated guesses. I think I'll stick to believing your theory since it sounds awesome. Although, how do you explain early REM?

Early REM? If you mean experiencing dream like sensations such as feeling or hearing things that aren't there or as soon as you go to bed. Well. Assuming my theory is true then I guess the person with the early rem problem could be experiencing bi-location. Being in two places at once. Part of his consciousness is tuned into the dream world and the other is still awake in the physical body. Perhaps that is what happens to one with early REM but I am no doctor and can't say what causes it.

**8hrking** · 08-02-2012 04:45 AM

Thats a pretty interisting way of looking at dreaming, and personaly i look at dreaming in sumwhat the same regard. Im not sure if you know this already, but several relegions(budha, Hindu,ext...) Beleive in the 7 planes of existance, and basically each plane is made of a higher frequince of vibrational energy then the one that came before it. Take a look if you want.

Sorry but im always on this forum with my phone and it takes forever to try and provide lins so im not going to bother.

**8hrking** · 08-02-2012 04:47 AM

Provide "links"

**ccrinbama** · 08-02-2012 07:15 AM

I think that your theory - while a fun thought - has no evidence to support it.

I think that dreams are experiences taking place in a virtual reality fueled by sensory data that doesn't have to find its basis in external stimuli. It's a subjective experience, and I don't know why we do it.

**ccrinbama** · 08-03-2012 12:22 AM

Actually, everything that Gills posted was relevant. He was directed here from a different thread, in which the topic of shared dreaming was already being discussed. His link was to a thread on this forum that explored the idea of shared dreaming, which is one of the two basis for Daredevilpwns theory of what a dream is. He also presented a link to a method that could be used to prove shared dreaming had an actual scientific basis.

You said:

Firstly like jblb2424 has already put it in an excellent manner, either you believe in it or you don't, there is no direct evidence to prove or disprove its existence so no need to clutter up threads about it.

But I'm pretty sure that is exactly what Daredevilpwn asked for, isn't it:

Please post what you guys think about this and please post what YOU think dreams are.

So, Gill was telling him what he thought about his ideas. He also went on to post what he thought dreams were, per request.

You also said:

I personally don't know if shared dreaming is real or not but that doesn't mean I can't put my mind into a state where I assume it would be possible so I can help discuss with other members and not just create rows.

Daredevilpwn didn't ask him for a willful suspension of disbelief. He asked him for his thoughts on the matter.

And finally:

Secondly this is the beyond dreaming section, 90% of the time theories here are not based on hard science.

The description of the Beyond Dreaming subforum reads: "A place for the discussion of Out of Body Experiences (OBEs), Astral Projections (APs), Dream Sharing, Precognitive Dreams, and other dream related phenomena." So yes, while they may not be based on hard science, I don't seem to read anything about not attempting to approach the concepts from a scientific standpoint. Actually, I would hope that one of the goals of this subforum is to shed some light on these topics from a scientific vantage point. So why attack him for doing just that? If the intention of your thread is to have people approach the concept with certain assumptions being made beforehand, then that should be stated explicitly. Don't be upset when people give honest answers.

That being said, some of Gills posts had a bite to them. But so did some of yours.