Thread: 501's Workbook

Interesting - valerian to go to sleep was twice associated with you having an LD?
Drinking peppermint tea at the moment - more because I like it and thought of it reading here.
Happy dreaming!

501 as in the game??

Hey congrats on the ld! It sounded like a super cool experience, flying with the car, then taking it underground and all that gold. Awesome improvisation, totally love it!

About melatonin - yes it surpresses REM but then you have a REM rebound which might explain the early ld. With melatonin, I usually have my first natural wake 3 hours after going to sleep. I sometimes have midnight lds, but most of the time forget them because they are too unstructured. Combining melatonin and htp might have resulted in bigger than usual rebound. I'm quite an insomniac myself but am not sure it's a good idea to take that many sleep aids in combination and quantity. Maybe try some relaxation exercises or follow your breath in internal silence in as side aid. I've also noticed that spending the last couple of hours in front of a screen makes matters worse for sleep.

Take care!

Thanks!

Originally Posted by NyxCC

Combining melatonin and htp might have resulted in bigger than usual rebound.

I was actually thinking the same thing, this is one reason I decided to take them together hoping for a larger rebound. I have also read about this combo a couple other places as well.

Originally Posted by NyxCC

I'm quite an insomniac myself but am not sure it's a good idea to take that many sleep aids in combination and quantity.

I usually would never take more after the initial. I read that melatonin does its work in the first 3o minutes or so after taking it. I did try some ambient noise music, usually at home we have a fan running in the background, so I think the quiet was a big part of it. Being in a different bed with different pillows, I hate travelling. I also tried to just lay still for awhile and listen to my breath, rhythmic breathing. At home I usually don't need to take anything, I am anything but an insomniac. It actually might been the 5htp that keeps me up a bit.

Originally Posted by StephL

Interesting - valerian to go to sleep was twice associated with you having an LD?

StephL not sure if it was the valerian alone or the combo of the three for relaxation and REM rebound. Valerian seems to mellow me out a bit. It does seem like the three together have given me unintentional lucids a few times. I could have also just WILDED last night or DEILDED, I really am not sure. It is weird I don't remember anything before I rammed the other car. Hopefully I don't go around and start doing that in waking life and then doing a RC to verify that it is a dream. lol.

Originally Posted by StephL

501 as in the game??

501 as in the blues.

Just to keep journaling.

No lucids since the last. I have been trying a combination of things from supplements to WILDS with no success. I have been getting better at getting into the deeper stages of WILD. When I have taken the supplements mostly G and C I have a heck of a time getting back to sleep usually. This may be due to excitement but I just think I am fairly sensitive.

I have been able to attempt WILDS in the afternoon for about an hour when I get home from work after the nights of insomnia.

I want to talk about my last WILD attempt a bit since I think it was pretty close and felt really close to where I needed to be. I laid on my back with my arms over my head for awhile and got relaxed, just fleeting thoughts and tried not to think about anything too hard. When I felt relaxed and I felt myself starting to get numb I dropped my hands to my side and after a few more minutes of relaxation I rolled to my side. I have been concentrating on my breathing much more and it really seems to help me relax. So anyways after awhile I usually feel my feet start to do weird things, they will cramp, then come out and then cramp harder, then I feel tingling starting to creep up my legs. At this point my body is pretty numb. I am still aware of it but try to pay no attention. So after my feet do this several times I feel my whole body start to go even number and floaty/ghost-like and about the same time my whole body feels like it is tensing up. I almost start shivering and am tense, this is very un-comfortable but I maintain my breathing and try not to think about it. It is very hard not to focus on it since it is so intense. So I bear through it. It suppresses a bit but then I feel like it is very hard to breathe, I try to push through this but I just cant breath. I flip over and really am struggling to breathe, it feels like I just got done running a mile. It took me a good minute to catch my breath. I don't know if this was subconscious or not but this is going to be a hard point to push through.

After I relax from this I roll back over and decide to try a FILD. I have never tried this before so this is new to me. I started on my side and got a little ways in and then rolled to my back. I kept the finger going and after awhile of tapping on the blanket I couldn't feel the blanket anymore. A couple waves of relaxation passed over me and I am just seeing faint HI like usual, I might have almost seen a dream seen but it seems like my awareness takes over and always makes it go away. My excitement kills it often. Anyways I think I see a scene developing and end up opening my eyes and it is just some pictures in my hotel room.

For the last week or so I have been WBTB with some kind of supplements, sometimes I get back to sleep and sometimes I don't. I have been setting intentions and even saying mantras usually but don't actually try WILD then. Sometimes I have very good recall with supplements, sometimes not. I don't remember a single dream from last night. Tonight I plan on doing a WBTB either at a natural wake time or later. I will stay up, set intention, read some old dreams and then try a WILD. This may be where I am messing up with the G since I expect it to make me have DILDS, which for me have been very hit or miss. I think valerian also makes me too foggy to remember to do a RC in my dream too.

Listening to OpehliaBlue and CanisLucidius pod cast kind of helped. I figure I can WILD at night after WBTB, if that doesn't work or I fall asleep, hope for a DILD and again if that doesn't work try for a DEILD. I do need to practice DEILD since I have only been successful at that once. I usually wake up and move right away.

I have also done reading on the SSILD which I have kind of tried but don't know if I was doing it right. I need to go back and read the tutorial again.

That attempt was pretty close. Sometimes, it can even be hard to ascertain if one has transitioned or not, especially if the ld is your own room (or at least in the beginning). Apart from possibly being in an uncomfortable position which might have influenced these sensations, it is quite likely that you were getting some sort of transition-related sensations. Those can be quite different for everyone, some common ones are floaty feelings, phantom limb movements, twisted body parts or even tension in different places. Hope the next time you get those they won't be as unpleasant. Maybe try not to focus too much on them. You might try imagining repetitive movements as in swimming, riding, touching objects, imagine a scene or just think of rolling out of bed or floating. This will take away the attention from anything like this and help you move to the next step.

Also, do give SSILD a try, it can be helpful for insomnia (remember to relax while doing it) and also get you some lds. Good luck!

So on a bit of a dry spell. This has been the longest stint I have had without going lucid in about 6 months of trying. I am sure it has some to do with being away from home. I am back home now so hopefully the routine will kick back in. I have had a little bit of a difficulty getting good recall on dreams too, they have been a bit blurrier than usual or not even there. It may be when I am waking or how I am waking but I am really not sure.

I have been doing RCs daily about the same amount as I always have. I may be taking them for granted though although it seems like I really am not. Instead of checking my hands more I have been stoping and thinking if this is right, am I dreaming, what was I doing 5 minutes ago and what am I going to be doing in 5 minutes. I may start incooperating another reality check in since apparently I dont think to look at my hand any more in my dream.

It has been puzzling that in my waking hours I often wonder and think about dreaming but still in my dreams I dont do this often. I have really only been trying supplements twice a week or so but have had minimal success. I am going to stop taking valerian since I think it may be keeping me from thinking straight in my dreams.

Tonight is a 5htp pre, 3mg G and 250mg C WBTB test. I have not done this combo before without valerian. The one bad thing is that about 75% of the time the G keeps me up for a good hour before I can even begin to get back to sleep.

I have not attempted any more WILDs. These are very hard for me while at home since there are many more distractions.

Hi 501 - good luck on your attempt! Hope you break the dry spell! What do you think has been your success rate with the supplements?

I would echo NyxCC about using SSILD to get to sleep - I use it as a kinda last resort if I can't get back to sleep after a wbtb (and before my vibes go off) and it seems to work well for that - it forces you to stop getting stuck on one train of thought but switching you to think about other things. I haven't gotten lucid from it per se it might intergrate well with you G related wakefulness.

The other thing I did - and I don't know if you can do this with the supplement is that I get as relaxed as I can BEFORE i activate the countdown on my vibrating clock. In other words I wake up for a wbtb, do a MILD for a few mins then try and relax as quickly as possible (doing SSILD cycles if necessary) then just as I feel I'm drifting off I reach down and hit the button which starts the 21 countdown clock on my alarm. That way I'm asleep before the first vibration hits. I dont know if you could do this -if the g is in capsule form have to in your hand by your mouth and just chug it before falling asleep?

best of luck - T

Schedule disruptions can indeed have a negative effect on recall and lding. The good thing is that you have been keeping up the RCs, and it seems like you are putting the right effort into them, so this ought to transfer to dreams sooner or later. I wish you to be able to get back on track easily and lots of awareness in your future dream sessions!

Well finally another lucid. It wasn't near what I wanted it to be but it was a lucid experience none the less. I guess I wasn't as focused on the task as I needed to be. It is quite difficult to maintain the straight dream awareness after the initial eureka of discovering you are in a dream.

I am probably going to try the same combo tonight and see what happens. Only able to sleep in at all on the weekends and since G usually gives me insomnia for 1 to 3 hours I am really only able to use it on the weekends.

My other dreams were pretty cool last night too, pretty vivid and memorable. I do think the valerian makes things a little foggy in my dreams so I will probably avoid taking it during WBTB at least.

Full dream below. I think I was excited about getting my wings too.

On the toilet and a moment of clarity - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Originally Posted by Tlaloc

Hi 501 - good luck on your attempt! Hope you break the dry spell! What do you think has been your success rate with the supplements?

I would echo NyxCC about using SSILD to get to sleep - I use it as a kinda last resort if I can't get back to sleep after a wbtb (and before my vibes go off) and it seems to work well for that - it forces you to stop getting stuck on one train of thought but switching you to think about other things. I haven't gotten lucid from it per se it might intergrate well with you G related wakefulness.

The other thing I did - and I don't know if you can do this with the supplement is that I get as relaxed as I can BEFORE i activate the countdown on my vibrating clock. In other words I wake up for a wbtb, do a MILD for a few mins then try and relax as quickly as possible (doing SSILD cycles if necessary) then just as I feel I'm drifting off I reach down and hit the button which starts the 21 countdown clock on my alarm. That way I'm asleep before the first vibration hits. I dont know if you could do this -if the g is in capsule form have to in your hand by your mouth and just chug it before falling asleep?

best of luck - T

Hey T. I have actually been a lot better about getting back to sleep after G. I tried to WILD a lot last night but just get irritated at the attempts. My foot cramping always messes with me. WILDING for me is very uncomfortable. Every time I jumped into a dream from wakefulness I didn't keep my awareness. I remember for my lucid last night that when I woke up I absolutely remember putting myself in the sleeping position I was in when I woke, if that makes sense. It seems like after about an hour with the G that as soon as you drift off to sleep a dream starts. Its very strange. I can know I am in a dream and know I can wake up but not really know enough to control it. Very strange but I enjoy it. I can always get right on the verge of drifting off aware but every time I am right on the brink my brain tries to focus too much on the scene. I will get it one day. I have really only been attempting WILDs on and off for two months now. I have really only attempted around 7 or 8 times I think. I usually don't plan on wild but I get to this point when I am falling asleep when I realize that I am on the brink so try to hold on to my consciousness, this usually just keeps me awake.

Sounds like your vibes are working pretty good. I will be trying that sometime.

Oh and about your question on the supps the success rate isn't great. I think the body chemistry and surroundings and everything have to be spot on. up to this point they have been hit and miss with nothing consistent. I do know the dosage that wont keep me up and will help me achieve lucidity though. I just have to work on the sleep cycle WBTB part along with getting back to sleep and being able to WILD.

So two lucid dreams last night. Both sucked. I believe something I need to do is focus on something, stabilize for awhile and let my body/mind calm down from the excitement of realizing I am in a dream. I think this keeps pulling me right out of the dream. Seems like I just go right after I realize and immediately get sucked right out. I have had to stabilize quite a bit in almost every other dream. I think there have been two semi-long lucids where I didn't have to stabilize and it lasted awhile. The excitement is killing me. I don't know if this is strictly the supplements or the supps mixed with sleeping in on weekends or me being back at home but this weekend has been good for lucids, 3 all together. Although if you add the time on all three up I doubt it would add up to a full minute. That is the sucky part.

So goals now, stabilize, stabilize, stabilize and use my surroundings to do so. Don't go until I am calm and very clear in my dream. As I am stabilizing I can reconfirm my intentions of the dream so I am not thinking too much about what I am doing. This seems to mess me up as well.

I still struggle getting back to sleep for about an hour after I take G but after that I am in and out. I had 5 very clear dreams last night which was cool too.

Red Box LD and a FA LD - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Great you broke that dry spell!

A few ideas about the totms - while our first thought is to go somewhere where the context would enable the completion, we don't have to follow the constraints/habits of real life. I recall the totm in April last year was to eat something, I was in my room and started panicking and thinking about going to the kitchen to look for something to eat there. In that case an unconscious summon - my bf's DC was holding a piece of bread just behind me. Now, I'm kind of flexible, sometimes I go to a place of context, at other times I summon things right on the spot. Try out just thinking of particular items and scan the environment with your eyes, as if you dropped the object somewhere near and know it's around. It also helps to look at pics of task items during the day, pre bed or wbtb.

About stabilization, there are quite a few factors that may be contributing to the shortness of dreams (excitement, thinking about stabilization, rushing, supplements, wakefulness, or just end of REM). At any rate, I'm sure that with some more practice you will overcome this and enjoy longer awesome lucids.

I think it is mostly the excitement and rushing. I also think my lack of stabalization is something that is contributing. I always do some sort of stabalization in my lucids that last for a bit. I think concentrating on something right before me gives me a change to calm down a bit and really focus on the dream.

This is pretty funny since I am not an overly excitable person and am normally very calm in waking life. I guess its just the excitement of the lucid experience that messes everything up. While I wish that exciting feeling would go away even a few second lucid is worth the prep work. Its very exhilarating. Ill keep in mind about remembering to summon things. I haven't really tried that before. Right now I need to re-focus on actually staying in a lucid dream again. I thought I had nipped this one, apparently not.

Hey dude - congrats on the 3 lucids!!!! I know they were brief but you're in good company with me - ha ha At least you were lucid, more than I was over the weekend - it helps I think to be able to think that although it didn't work out like you wanted, because you are getting lucid on a regularish basis at least you should have the opportunity to try again fairly soon. Thats what I'm trying to think anyway, I'm hoping it will finally kind of click and I'll stay stable longer and more frequently.

I'll have to keep your G tech in mind if I hit a dry spell, its good to hear someone is having success with it! cheers and stay in touch - T

This is pretty funny since I am not an overly excitable person and am normally very calm in waking life. I guess its just the excitement of the lucid experience that messes everything up. While I wish that exciting feeling would go away even a few second lucid is worth the prep work. Its very exhilarating.

Well, it's understandable, lds are just too awesome to be indifferent to the experience. One would think that after many lds this feeling disappears, but there are times when I do feel overly euphoric too.

Sweet dreams everyone!

Originally Posted by Tlaloc

I'll have to keep your G tech in mind if I hit a dry spell, its good to hear someone is having success with it! cheers and stay in touch - T

It still keeps me awake for awhile but it does give me very vivid dreams. It took awhile to find out how much I could take and it be effective. I don't know how some people take 8mg! 2mg has been plenty for me but I am still toying with it.

Originally Posted by 501

No lucids since the last. I have been trying a combination of things from supplements to WILDS with no success. I have been getting better at getting into the deeper stages of WILD. When I have taken the supplements mostly G and C I have a heck of a time getting back to sleep usually. This may be due to excitement but I just think I am fairly sensitive.

I used to have a big issue with this as well. My best advice is to try not to think about it, try not to worry about what time it is, whether you'll fall asleep etc.

Just treat the whole thing as an experience. Observe as passively as you can, stay relaxed, and focus on something like calm backward counting. Keep your mind on a slow, relaxed pace. It may still take some time, but if you don't let this worry you, you should hopefully be fine.

Good luck!

Thanks for the information! I have still been trying it off and on during the work week. I think it keeps me up a little more on those nights since I have to be up a decent time. I have been less stressed about it. Laying there relaxing and thinking about dreaming. I realized that even if I don't have lucids I have some pretty kick ass and crazy dreams. I still get surprised when I wake up thinking I hadn't slept and then remember that I just had a dream. Its pretty strange. I enjoy it though. 2mg does it for me though for sure.

Another Lucid last night but again just a short one. Once I gained lucidity I came out. Still forgot to stabilize. I am going to lay off sleepy meds during the week. I may do a 5htp and G with C but no melatonin and valerian. I think I need to work on a different WBTB routine that really gets me in the mind set. I need to really set the goals.

Supplements in the Kitchen and Lucid after a Late Night at Work - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Nice! Congrats on the 7-fingered success!

Had another last night, this has been my first non supplement induced lucid for about 2 months or so. It wasn't amazing but I remembered to work on stabilization a bit. It did increase the dream time but I really didn't do it long enough. My mind is still stuck on "Oh this dream is going to end, I hope the dream doesn't end, this will suck if the dream ends" instead of just embracing the dream. I don't think it ever really came in focus like some of my others but at least it lasted longer. I just really need to remember this and instead of just looking use my voice and my other senses as well. It seems that all I remember to do it look very hard at stuff and nothing else.

Full Dream
http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/501/...rdboard-55941/

That's great - supp free and so early too! You did a good job prolonging the dream, I so much liked how you took time to examine all the details on the slice of bread. Been telling myself that I need to pay more attention to the texture of things in dreams. And what a better place to have an ld than the fridge.

Well a little better. After not taking supplements at night all week I did the combo that has worked for me a few times in the past. I think I have the WBTB time and the sleep time as well as the supps I need to take just about perfected.

I managed to do one of the TOTMs from last month, I was bound to do the dog biscuit one. I also plan on giving my heart to someone, maybe next time. Anyways lasted much longer with not much of a need to stabilize. I instantly just started going and interacting with the dream environment and after the initial eureka moment didn't think about it anymore. I plan on doing the same combo tonight almost identically to what I did last night and see what happens. It seems like when there is a huge gap between my lucids I get overly excited when I finally do become lucid like it is the first time all over again.

I probably could have done another but everyone started stirring around the house. Oh well one is good enough for me.

Full dream below.

FA Lucid, in the fridge again and TOTM from FEB - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

congrats 501!!! You've got me fired up to try and get lucid again! I think your idea of reading old DJ entries during the wbtb is a good one.

well done - really stoked for you! cheers - T