Thread: Tlalocs Workbook

Mr. Skywalker, congrats on squeezing the lds in your busy Saturday work schedule!

I've been thinking about the stabilization issues and wondering if it is always necessary to perform it. I know a lot of beginners' lds are shorter and it takes practice, also with wilds stabilization or rather anchoring is recommended, but you may not need to stabilize at all times. Personally, I rely on my feeling about the dream rather than mental reasoning to decide if it needs any stabilization techs or so. My usual ones in case needed are moving hands around, grabbing objects or walking briskly around. But as I said, I don't quite necessary do those every time, but rather go about my tasks or just go exploring around. Do check out the podcast about this by the way. You can give different stabilization techs a try to see if a particular tech yields better results, but also try to go without performing them sometimes, because dreams need not always be unstable by default. Hope this helps!

http://www.dreamviews.com/dreamviews...-mistakes.html

Stabilization starting from min 24.

Been about a week since I updated this. Busy and a bit stressful at times.

Had 2 occassions last week where I'd set time aside at night to try the technique - but cocked up both! I hadn't realized but on both nights I'd set the timer to go off only once rather than on repeat so it went off the first time and then I just returned to sleep until my main alarm went off.
In some ways this was useful as it kind of acts as a control set of 2 nights - if you wanted to verify that its not just my intention to get lucid on the nights I used the IAM method to get lucid, as on both of these nights I had hoped to get lucid and didn't, largely (I think) because I was able to interupt my sleep.

So my feeling is that the interupted part is the key. But the audio is also crucial to 1) prevent me from becoming desenitized to the vibe signal
2) increasing my awareness by forcing me to take action and giving me a message to wake up and listen to
it also helps me catch FA.

I couple of nights later I stayed at a travelodge as I was away on a roman dig, in of all places, a place called 'cockermouth'! Dig was great, travelodge was ok but a bit of an interupted night gave me LD 55 - Lucid 55 - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views
after that I set off the IAM (first time I had been able to do this properly since my last lucid) and got another short lucid (56) after realizing I was in a dream seeing my wife and kids were telling me to get up and knowing that couldn't be possible. Unfortunately this ended very quickly.

Had another couple of nights off then tried again yesterday morning - IAM and got another short lucid (57) again disappointed as very short. Basically I was dreaming I was talking about lucidity with my wife in our 'bedroom' when I realized the room was not like our bedroom at all - actually now I'm writing this I realize my brain was reimagining the travel lodge room with a tv on the wall - anyway this triggered me to become lucid but it all faded to black really quickly before I could start to stabilize it. I went into the void and was about to try something when the vibe went off and I gave up.
I then had another NLD where I started to wonder if I was dreaming but decided against it. Wish I had done a RC just to check.

Tried the tech again this morning (IAM) but no lucids - first time this has happened in a while. Unusually though I seem to have turned the audio on during a RC but fallen asleep again straight back into REM and a NLD without turning it off (its hand held and audio repeats with break inbetween) as in my dream I could hear my voice talking over the dream conversation I was having, but because the voice was correct I assumed it was real life and that I was playing around with the device during the day and it was on some sort of speaker and malfunctioning. In the dream I was stressed because it was loud and I couldn't turn it off! Doh!!!! Shows how I need to do more RC's, the audio kept going on and in the dream I couldn't turn the device off. I then seem to have actually woken up and switched it off, or I think rather it just got to the end of the track (around 2min total in lenght) and it stopped itself.
Interesting that whilst it was non-lucid it incorporated the audio track exactly as in real life - that was why I accepted it within the dream.

Anyway I guess another 3 lucids isn't too bad, and the plane crash one was amazingly vivid and more stable. Will take a few days off due to work and then try again.

Final thoughts - need to really concentrate on the audio to wake myself up more rather than falling asleep during it.
- need to do RC rather than relying on just 'knowing' I'm in a dream - which increasingly seems to be the case (a good thing, but I don't want to miss any inbetween ones like this morning when I wondered if I might be dreaming, then talked myself out of it).
-spinning worked well. I was interested as to whether this might be due to the OKN response (an eyemovt which occurs during spinning) mimicking REM and when I did it I could really feel my eyes flick, flick, flick in my head, almost more than in real life. It was kind of cool, as I am sure this have showed up on an EOG. It also seemed to stop me losing the dream when I kind of panicked again so worth trying again.
-anyways better be off!

I just looked and 11 LD for the 23 days of this month so far. Really want to focus on stabilizing and getting a positive experience from them. Still got time to try and get some wings as well.....

T! Congrats on the lds! You seem to be keeping up the momentum despite the busyness and stress! Very impressive.

The loss of lucidity was an unexpected but interesting side effect of your contemplations. I actually see this outcome in a positive light since you managed to prolong the dream.

Best of luck with future lds and don't forget to tie your shoes.

Hi NyxCC - got a bit of a cold at the moment and working the weekend but managed to do the method this morning and got a lucid from it. Before I report that one - I've just done a thread on the method - just in case others find it of use, or a useful starting point - let me know if it needs any work appreciate your views as always - http://www.dreamviews.com/induction-...b-newbies.html

The LD this morning 58 - I did the method from around 5.00ish and got the LD around 6.45ish, I had done through quite a few repeats of the vibe going off and listening to the audio and had thought it wasn't going to work.....so I am in a NLD, dreaming about being in the kitchen, and I'm thinking about how the method hasn't worked and how disappointed I am and I'm spooning this stuff which looks like baked beans but which is supposed to be coffee out of the sink where I dropped it...and then I think - I am disappointed about not getting lucid - hold on - this is weird - I am dreaming! I look at the kitchen clock it says 10.10 I look away and back but too quickly, it stays the same but I know I am dreaming. I start spinning round, but then I think....maybe I should do another RC just to be sure - I stop the spinning to do this - and WAKE UP - DOOOH!!!
anyway - I am a bit crook so perhaps didn't help, and to be honest I was pleased that I HAD gotten lucid, when I started the NLD thinking I hadn't. But - sigh - as usual have to work more on stabilization. Might be a few more nights before I have another go due to my cold, and my daughter is now sick too, plus work continues on as normal. But will try sometime this weekend I am sure - probably last chance to tie those laces! Hope you're well cheers - T

T! Hope the cold goes away quickly for both you and your girl.

I checked out your thread, it's very well written, love the structure, explanations, everything. Great thing you took the time to write it all down. I'm sure it will be useful for many and can also inspire others to either give this method a try or develop a similar one.

and then I think - I am disappointed about not getting lucid - hold on - this is weird - I am dreaming!

Haha, this can be such a dream sign at times. I've seen others also get it. My version of it is slightly more confusing because I dream of the time before going to bed, with other people around and so loud that I can't go to sleep in order to ld. Anyways, great catch on your side.

Hi Nyx - got lucid again this morning - usual method - #59. Woke up after 6 hrs at just after 5am, did about 3 22 cycles of the sleep/wake/audio thing and then I am dreaming I am in an office, there is a woman telling us as she shuffles files a long story about how she used to be in the Cabinet and now shes resigned and working for a chariatable org and shes working her way back up into politics to get back into public office - just to prove it can be done (sorry - don't know why I'm relating all this dull stuff! Of interest this was direct day residue = watched the news for the first time in ages last night before sleep - politics as usual). Anyway - back in the dream a massive cartoon like locust/insect flies from inside the office outside a window and a green but red chested kaka (a big parrot native to NZ) follows it out chasing it (=more day residue, I had been reading about these that night). I chase both outside, and the insect start buzzing my head and ears. I charge around trying to get it away from me - but then realise - this is too weird - its obviously a dream! Lucid I start to spin around but only get a quarter turn before I get chucked into the void. I try spinning but find I can't as I am disembodied and realize I should imagine I'm rowing instead - but am more awake by now.
About 5 mins later the vibe goes off, pinning the dream to 6.05ish. I figure I've got a good chance to get lucid again - I am really keen to give it another go - as I reckon I've got the panic thing licked and want to do the TOTM, but just as I am drifting off I start to think about work stresses and this kills my concentration as I get closer to my normal wake up time and this + the cold and my daughter waking up (who is now also ill) stop me from drifting off again - ahhhh!

Will have to give it a rest for a few days with work pressures, but hope to try again at the weekend. Thanks for your kind words about my forum post - glad you liked it - and again thanks Nyx for all your ongoing support. - cheers T

Tried twice this weekend. Yesterday morning wasn't the best for a mixture of reasons - tried placing the IC on my wrist rather than my ankle (to avoid moving it as much) but it feel out and so I slept through a few of the 22min cycles and missed one def REM period until I woke and realized it was out of contact with my body on the bed. Also got really hot under a winter duvet and I think this makes me dozy and less aware.

So tried again this morning - with duvet off and IC on ankle. Again wasn't the great success - one short WILD only #60 - WILD - Jack Bauer - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views - mostly interesting for meeting jack bauer in person! Perhaps a sign I should cut back on the 24 DVD's with my wife!

Had a couple of what I'd call protoWILD's today and yesterday as well - some also seem like lucids - not sure if others have them. They are dream scenes where you become aware its a dream but it doesn't 'hold' like a lucid dream - I am assuming these are vivid Hypogonenic Hall's that I suddenly become aware of and in and that I stop the process of them turning into a WILD by becoming aware too soon. Anyway that's my guess. That's why the WILD itself was nice in a way as it was a full developed dream, I could feel, move, talk and the DC talked back - quite incredible to see it form around me. Hopefully more might follow.

that's it for now - hope you had a good weekend NyxCC. Ps I always wonder does your name reflect your from New York? cheers - T

It's really cool that you have been experiencing more of these wildlets, T! I think your frequent lds plus the tech keep you at a more alert state and you are able to catch more of these subtle transitions.

You know, I told you with dilds I don't assume that the dream is unstable per se, so would do stabilization on a less frequent basis. Now, with wilds one usually needs to do a little bit more anchoring. I look from the perspective of changing clothes or costumes, so to speak. One moment you are in bed, nicely relaxed, the next moment you end up in a dream, mid action or in the least ready to act. Sometimes there is this distinct feeling of getting inside your dreaming body, which feels as if you are putting on new clothes, kind of. So, when this happens, I do my best to try to feel comfortable in my new outfit. I make some steps forward, sometimes continuing to walk until I feel it's alright and wave my hand around, can touch an object or so.

There might be another more exotic option, which would be to try to surrender a little bit of awarness to allow the dream to develop its own plot and as you become more involved it will become much more concrete. That obviously carries some risk of going non-lucid but with practice, and remembering your intent to ld and tasks, it becomes easier to regain one's awareness.

PS: lol, not from there.

Hi Nyx - quick update - had a couple of lucids 2 mornings ago - my headphones had crapped out a few nights earlier - but hadn't realised until that morning (they were bought for a pound anyway that explains things!). Anyway did the vibe thing, waking me up every 24mins or so, and just did the autosuggestion in my head - concentrating on 'keep lookin for the vibe'. Anyways about 45mins later had this lucid #61 - 'Oh NO! - Whats that in the bed.....??' - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views - bit odd I know! Maybe influenced by my daughter who's 4 and had a couple of 'accidents' recently!
After that short lucid could feel more REM coming, got some good H-audio when heard someone yell near my head, then suddenly realised I was in another dream and lucid - unfortunately after quickly looking around this one suddenly 'popped!' - and disconcenteraly I was back in bed. Still felt had more time to play with and started trying to DIELD - imagining I was waving my arms up and down like a bird trying to hover (or more like in the pool when you can hover by just pumping your arms and down) seemed pretty effective as I kept getting flashes of this and a 'real world' feeling, this happened twice but each time when it transitioned from 'thinkin it' to actually 'feeling it' I would get excited and it would 'pop' - after the second time, decided to drop back to sleep but my daughter got me up mins later.

Happy to have a bit more LD time, but will go back to hand rubbing and just try and calm down more.

Tried again this morning but had to get up to go to work, had had some beer the night before and couldn't really concentrate on the audio enough, kept drifting off so no lucidity but a few good NLD.

Had a couple of good NLD's recently, nice one especially of excavating a roman amphitheatre. Also tried the tech 1 time before the above lucids (when the audio wasn't working well) and got frustrating close to lucidity - dreaming about my parents in NZ and having their compost full of snakes of all things - struck me as bizarre in the dream - but didn't become lucid - maybe just bad luck, or maybe due to audio not working. The next night I tried again - this time working out why the audio wasn't working and thats when I got the above 2 lucids.

So 3 attempts with some dud equipment issues, 1 morning success and 2 LD's. Gotta keep going - my thing to get lucid is to not be hungover (white wine ok, anything else = bad) so can really concentrate on the autosuggestion....and my stability 'issue' of course I think sensei (aka Brandon boss) had mentioned in a prev post not to be panicked if your first 100 lucids aren't that stable as practice improves him......I REALLY hope I am not going to be the one who proves him wrong! Ha Ha
cheers Nyx

T! Your latest ld cracked me up, especially the thorough inspection you did there.

Wouldn't even say the occurence is so strange, our dreaming mind can conjure all kinds of stuff in the living room or the bathroom. Mine seems to especially like leaking pipes regardless of location.

Keep them rolling, T!

Hi Nyx - glad you enjoyed the 'bed' incident! Ha ha! Actually came to back to bite me on the bum - as this morning both my daughter (4) and son (7) both independently wet their beds! Dooh!

anyways - had 1 lucid night before last(#63) . This was a suprise as I wasn't doing my tech - night off. But as I'd gone to sleep I'd been thinking I wanted to concentrate on 2 actions in my next dreams to try and have a simple task to do. If I were indoors I'd try and hover/float, if outdoors I'd fly. Anyway went to sleep on these thoughts and at some earlish stage in the night I had a dream I was flying and after a short bit I realised that I only ever fly in lucid dreams and so became lucid and continued flying for a bit, before waking up - so good bonus! I think the dream was a bit longer than normal, no RC required. But it was much earlier in the night and my recollection of it is a bit hazy as I woke up from it at the end but immediately fell back to sleep (I'm guessing it must have been 2ish in the morning). Anyway - this is the first LD i've had outside out doing the tech in AGES so nice to get a bonus.

This morning after my daughter woke us up at 4am having wet the bed did the normal tech. And got lucid around 5.00ish I think (#64). The 'wbtb' (if you want to call getting up doing a short spin cycle and showering her as a wbtb!) probably helped. The NLD part of the dream I've frustratingly forgotten (unusual for me but I was pretty tired from the days work and had been out doing an outdoors fitness class in the dark and rain so pretty smashed when daughter woke us up early) - but I was walking out in the dream to an outbuilding, plywood and as I got inside it , it was dark and I just got the feeling that whilst it was unlikely, there was a tiny poss I could be dreaming, I tried to do a watch RC but the light didn't come on on my watch and I immediately thought 'I'm dreaming' anyways - sigh - I think the surprise of made me jolt a bit and the lack of light meant I just stopped doing anything, and woke up.

I figured I had plenty of time to play with so went back to sleep. After one more cycle of audio/vibe/interuption I was dreaming I was in bed and I just knew I was dreaming (#65), I did a watch RC again and the time changed each time, so in the bed I started rubbing my hands together, this stabilized the dream, until I realized, oddly I was holding my son's minauture rugby ball in one of my hands, the texture (rubbery and rough) made the rubbing good - but I can't remember why - but I lost the dream after that - waking up- I think I just was too knackered. I checked the time on the clock and it was mid way between cycles.

At that stage I feel really sleep deprived so disconnected the audio and clock and went 'free dreaming'. Had several very vivid NLD's and it was interesting how my NLD self really spent alot of time trying to explain the oddities in the dreams away - trying several times to create false memories (in one I was looking at a photo album with my sister of places I'd never been and was trying to explain how this could be). Interesting how maybe without the awareness the regular interuptions bring my awareness quickly degrades - but then I was pretty tired too. After that my son came in crying that he too - for the first time in years - had wet the bed! And that was that for the day dreaming wise!
Anyways another 3 short LD's in the last 2 days - can't complain, just gotta fix on keeping them going longer. cheers T

quick final bit to add, was looking at my LD freq by month so Jan - not enough info in this diary as just started DV
feb - vibe nites = 8
mar - vibe nites = 4 (felt I became desensitized and no more lucids, stopped by april)
april = 0
may = 0
jun = 0
july = 0
aug = 12 - develop new method - interupted sleep audio method
sep = 13
oct = so far 6 (middle of the month)
so def spike upwards again and last 10 wks pretty consistant rate of around 3 LDs a week - hurray! Thanks for your support NyxCC!

T! Excellent incubation of the ld, even if unintended, worked out really well and so early in the night too. Our thoughts before bedtime can really have an impact on dream contents, so it pays to spend a few mins to passionately think about lding and plan our next move. Well done!

Fantastic stats too! I wouldn't be surprised if you continue scoring bonus lds on top your IAM tech, as your mind is really getting used to doing this almost daily. And with more practice those lds will get longer too.