Thread: What is a Lucid Dream?

I noticed this question on the sticky notes, and going there I was hoping to be informed. However, I do not believe that the question was answered.

Now, I am not the sharpest tool in the shed, no, not by a long shot, and therefore it took me a considerable number of years to figure out the answer to the question.

Lucid dreaming appears to be in fact, a form of communication. As in all communication, that which establishes the limit of communication is, of course, the less intelligent of the two. This means a great deal. All miss representation and fantasy about what is said and why is effected by the least intelligent of the two parties.

A great deal of non-sense, will of course, be perpetrated by the least intelligent of the two parties.

And so, "I the Lord will speak unto him in a dream." It is a language. The evolution of a sentient being is paralleled by its linguistic comprehension.

I am not religious, however, if I reference the Judeo-Christian Scripture, I find the text is sealed, but simply by principles of language. No magic. I find that the Eden, or the Garden of God, is a metaphor, as God is given as a metaphor for truth. Garden of Truth. The entire text is about judgment, which cannot be effected without basic understanding of langauge. Principles not yet recognized or taught.

Sometimes I day-dream. I realize that any significant space travel will always be impossible. Men fantasied its possibilies by contradicting physical facts of reality. However, one does not need to visit physically if telepathy were a simple fact of sentient existence. However, like children, before one leaves the nursery, they should at least be able to speak.

It is written that at some point in history lucid dreaming would reappear--however, people would be ashamed of what they see. The lessons, so to speak, address our own short commings. We are children, one might say, savages. So, I do not believe that any of us are even a tool in the shed at all, yet.

What, exactly, is it you want to know? If it is a more spiritual matter, put in it the forum dedicated to religion/spirituality.

Perhaps if you read it slower, and think a little more about what was said, you might comprehend a little more of what was said.

When you read any work, to assume that you have understood, and then hold the writer responsible for what you imagine, is a form of rudeness. Confucious made a remark about that, search rectification of names.

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

Perhaps if you read it slower, and think a little more about what was said, you might comprehend a little more of what was said.

When you read any work, to assume that you have understood, and then hold the writer responsible for what you imagine, is a form of rudeness. Confucious made a remark about that, search rectification of names.

If people cannot understand what you write...then you have failed as a writer. The responsibility for reading comprehension is on the author...not the reader. Do not place the blame on Burke for being unable to comprehend what you have written. If you really interpret it as a form of rudeness, then it's obvious you don't have the first clue about decent writing, and you come off sounding very arrogant.

Originally Posted by Aquanina

If people cannot understand what you write...then you have failed as a writer. The responsibility for reading comprehension is on the author...not the reader. Do not place the blame on Burke for being unable to comprehend what you have written. If you really interpret it as a form of rudeness, then it's obvious you don't have the first clue about decent writing, and you come off sounding very arrogant.

Where on earth did you acquire your education? I suggest if you paid for that bit of wisdom, you might want a refund. That is as intelligent as telling a tree that it fails as a tree because you do not comprehend it. What a train of thought!

Apply the same train of reasoning to every one of your bodies environmental acquisition systems, and see if you do not eventually end up laughing.

Originally Posted by Walms

That is one of the uses it can be given of course, but a lucid dream is a "dream in which you know you are dreaming, while in the dream", I get that didn't satisfy you in the sticky, right? Why not?

How a thing is done is not what is done. I hope you understand that.

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

Where on earth did you acquire your education? I suggest if you paid for that bit of wisdom, you might want a refund. That is as intelligent as telling a tree that it fails as a tree because you do not comprehend it. What a train of thought!

Apply the same train of reasoning to every one of your bodies environmental acquisition systems, and see if you do not eventually end up laughing.

The tree is not attempting to communicate what it is to anyone, you on the other hand are attempting communication. The comprehensibility of a written work falls first on the writer and then on the reader. You write what you wish and believing it is understandable relay it to the reader. If the reader judges it to complex then the writer must either revise and submit it again or end his/her attempt at communication.
Your arrogance, that is judging someone based on their inability to grasp your thoughts is very off putting. If I write "fish hello no" it is not the readers job to just know what I meant.

"Lucid dreaming appears to be in fact, a form of communication."
This is the main part of the topic, right? That is one of the uses it can be given of course, but a lucid dream is a "dream in which you know you are dreaming, while in the dream", I get that didn't satisfy you in the sticky, right? Why not?

Yup, which doesn't answer the question I asked, care to answer? Also, you are being insulting up there, language is a skill, and as such, you should understand that insulting isn't the best way to use it, you are just putting language to shame.

I am very ignorant about langauge. I only know two facts for certain.

1) Predication is the inverse function of abstraction.
2) A definition is a social convention which associates the name of a thing with the names of that things various forms and the various material differences in those forms.

I suspect, I just failed again. Poor me.

Walms basiclly summed it up. The definition is when you know you're dreaming in a dream. I don't know if what your saying is defining Lucid Dreaming or what, because i too can't fully comprehend what you're saying.
That's the "official" definition anyway...

I am well aware of your reaction. I have seen it all my life. In fact, when I was very young the educational system made just the determination I find here, and made preparations to send me to a school for the mentally handicapped. However, the required IQ test put them on the floor. Psych books say I think differently, quite differently--but that I am harmless. Most of us just disappear, never to be heard of again. A few still keep trying to bridge the gap. Stepping down is easy, how do you get someone to step up?

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

A few still keep trying to bridge the gap. Stepping down is easy, how do you get someone to step up?

If you would stop approaching the gap as if it is a step down, and instead just a lateral gap, perhaps others would be much more inclined to meet you half way. As it is, you seem to be shouting across a ravine, telling us all we are beneath you when we can see quite clearly that your elevation is about the same as ours.

I love how I need to read all your post over again and still don't seem to get it. I'm not trying to diss you, I think it's interesting.

My posts are not that intersting. Try Plato.

Imagine this, writing using a technique where the outline of a piece is based on a principle of logic. And if you see it, (it might take a while, it did me) imagine how it can go not understood for 2500 years. Now there was a smart man.

Or take the Delian Problem, that man has said is impossible to solve. But it is not, the reason men find it impossible is because a principle, which they parrot is not really resident in their mind--again, definition.

Or the Scripture, which tells you plainly that it is sealed, but no one understands, it is sealed only because principles of judgment are not resident in the human mind.

Or Lucid Dreams themselves, which use the very same principles and if those principles are not resident in the mind, they cannot be understood.

Be all this as it may, I just find it all--interesting.

If you can hear, man is crying, looking for the way. When you hear "How do we know which Geometry is true." You hear a blind man asking for light. You hear someone saying, I don't know the foundation of grammar itself. I am trying to learn how it may be taught, if it can. No one can think for you, but one can provide tools, like lucid dreaming, Like the Platonic dialogs, like the Scripture, Like Euclid, that one might learn to use. But refusing to pick up the tools and learn and then blaming those who make them, is just savage.

No one can see beyond the limits of their own psychology--but there were great men who could see that hole and they did the best they could to provide a path. Imagine what it is like to live a life in a vacuum.

And, you are not dissing me. You cannot make me dumber than I already am--you are, however, biting the hand that is trying to help. Why do you think I deveote thousands of hours making free educational material? Because I think I am better than anyone?

Can you imagine the not the man hours, nor the man years, but man lives that can be saved if someone would write just the principles of correct grammar? A grammar that could help people distnguish between gibberish and fact? One that could very simply show that Einstein was a fool, but Plato, though making errors, was a genius?

Well, it beats crossword puzzles.

So when you communicate with us, who establishes the limit?

You could argue those who don't understand your posts create this limit, and are therefore the least intelligent of the two parties.
You could also argue that it is you who limits the communication between the two parties by choosing to write in a manner that many can't understand. Does that make you the least intelligent party?

Or I could have completely misunderstood, I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed either.

I don't have any idea what you're on about :L. Are you saying that dreaming is a form of communication and dreaming is limited by the less intelligent person, who is that?
Then you start comparing it to God and Eden and metaphors I'm really confused, can you explain what your main point is please .

I have pointed where one can get a meal, now you want me to chew and digest it for you? I suppose you dont understand that either.

I once had a boss, an 18 year old kid. I worked 8 hours a day on machine repair, and went to school in a hot tin roof building 6 hours a day to learn welding. Then my boss asked if I would take 10 min a day and teach him to weld. Incredible.

stop patronising people, you're a MAN and your going 'look how smart I am' ' oh you don't understand because my writing is so superior to yours' I'm 16 years old ffs, you should at least be a little mature by now. Also, stop using stupid metaphors and say what you want to say, I DO understand what your saying. Also I'm the sad one for answering back. Go ahead and patronize me some more, even if that is not how you intend to write.

So we are in fact the superior ones (in my view), and I look down at your attempts at impressing younger (in some cases) people, on a forum that is intended to help people have and discuss lucid dreams.
However I do admire that you obviously took a long time on writing this thread, and you are a bit smart, but thats no reason to use language in ways that people like me feel patronized by it. It also makes you look stuck up.

I think I understand where you're coming from. Sort of. If I didn't get up at 5AM this morning for work, I'd be able to think about it more. I do hope I'm on the right track, because I can't really put into words what I think you're trying to say. Though, I guess that's the point isn't it?

Moved to ED b/c I don't know where else to put it and it definitely doesn't belong in on-topic forum.

Philosopher, I have a friend that seems to think very much like you (minus the arrogance). He's a paranoid schizophrenic. I'm assuming you suffer from something similar? If that's the case, then it is truly a shame that you are unable to successfully convey your thoughts and ideas to others (and seem to lack any desire to try), as I usually find such people to be infinitely interesting.

Actually I have no mental problems, people with problems do not acquire over 30 years sen, and respected as a top machine operator. Sorry. I have won photography awards, writing awards, but that is not the point. The point is, you blame everyone else for your lack of comprehension.

I read the complete works of Plato over 8 times because I knew I did not fully comprehend. Not once did I think it was his fault. You are arrogant.

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

I read the complete works of Plato

"Beauty of style and harmony and grace and good rhythm depend on simplicity — I mean the true simplicity of a rightly and nobly ordered mind and character..."~~Plato

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

Actually I have no mental problems, people with problems do not acquire over 30 years sen, and respected as a top machine operator. Sorry. I have won photography awards, writing awards, but that is not the point. The point is, you blame everyone else for your lack of comprehension.

I read the complete works of Plato over 8 times because I knew I did not fully comprehend. Not once did I think it was his fault. You are arrogant.

I'm afraid everything you just said there just confirmed your arrogance.

p.s. People with mental problems get on just fine, and can be very successful. And if you think otherwise, you need to come out of your little bubble.


On topic:
To me, a lucid dream is just a dream in which one is conscious.
As for the "communication" aspect of it, I suppose I see it as a means of one communicating with the subconscious. I do not however see it as the subconscious doing the communicating, because the way I see it, that is for non-lucid dreams, and the messages are much more reliable when one's consciousness is not interfering with subconscious happenings in the dream.

Originally Posted by Philosopher8659

I read the complete works of Plato over 8 times because I knew I did not fully comprehend. Not once did I think it was his fault. You are arrogant.

You're comparing yourself to Plato? Yeah, you're arrogant mate.

You hardly do my ego Justic, Marvo. Plato is much too insiginificant for my ego. I have actually studied Scripture too! Even hand typed the entire text cover to cover, even made a program spell checker from the concordance. So, If you want to make a complete ass of yourself with your logic, you should say that I compare myself to God!