• Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views




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    Thread: No matter where you go, whether you live or die, you will always be in this one place.

    1. #1
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      No matter where you go, whether you live or die, you will always be in this one place.

      That my friends, is the void. Let me explain in detail. I have been pondering this for a day, this thought just came to me one day and I would like to share it with you all. The universe is not infinite, the fact that it is expanding right now means that it currently has an end. Think of yourself as a track star and you see the finish line, but the finish line is extending faster than you could run to it, however if you got in a really fast car (cheater!) you could make it to the finish line, so although the universe is expanding if we can build something that moves faster than the universe could expand, then eventually you would make it to the end of the universe so really, the universe isn't infinite but it is trying to become infinite. So what exactly is infinite? If the universe isn't infinite then, the space it is trying to occupy must be infinite, this space is the void. The universe is trying to fill in the void, but that is impossible since the void is infinite. If you go out into space, then take out all the stars, planets, random rocks floating and everything else, all you have left is just blackness. This is the void. According to the big bang theory the universe exploded into existence and from then on it has begun it's futile quest to fill in the void. Right now as you are reading this post, you are in the void it is just that this part of the void that we are in is being occupied by this stuff we call matter.

      But even matter isn't solid. Solidity is an illusion. What we feel as touch is the repulsion of the electromagnetic forces. Basically when you sit on a chair you are technically floating. Anyway, enough of this science. Basically the main point here is that first there was the void and nothing else, then something comes to occupy the void. Now lets look at dreams. Sometimes when a dream ends instead of waking up the dreamer is in a pocket of empty space then a new dream scene materializes and spreads out before them. This is very similar to how our physical world was created if the big bang theory is correct. The difference between them is just how long it took to manifest. Dreams manifest far more quickly than things in this physical world but in principle the way a new dream scene is created and the way our universe was born is very similar. First there was a void then it becomes filled.

      A more simpler way to experience the void is to simply close your eyes and cover them. For a moment there is nothing however even that too starts to get filled. People would see colors, images, dots of light, etc. Can you see the pattern here? In all instances the void gets filled by something, be it physical matter, or ideals and beliefs which is the stuff dreams are made of or random colors. The void seems to be able to get filled by intangible things as well as tangible things. Not only that but it seems that the voids purpose is to simply be filled, because the void never remains empty for long it always gets filled. So there is one last void that I must discuss. There are people that believe in the after life, some believe there is nothing after death and they may be right, maybe there is nothing after death however how long will it be that way? If the void awaits us when we die then what makes it any different than the void we encounter in our dreams when we wait for a new dream to form? What makes it any different than the void we live in now currently being occupied by this universe? Why cannot the void of death be filled? It seems apparent the it's nature is to simply be occupied, not only that but it can be occupied by many things, be it this physical substance or beliefs and emotions and ideals, the stuff dreams are made of. The void of death, is no different than the void of life, and the void of dreams, or even the void of our eyes being closed, because in the end, something begins to fill it. So just because the void awaits us when we die, you have to understand that we are always in the void but it is always being occupied.

      Thanks for reading my ramblings. Take what resonates and leave everything behind.
      Last edited by Daredevilpwn; 01-06-2013 at 10:56 AM.
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    2. #2
      Xei
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      Common misconception. The 'expansion of the universe' doesn't refer to a finite object expanding into empty space. Rather, it means that space itself is inflating; 'filling with more space' (kind of like stretching rubber).

      There is no 'void' and the jury is currently totally out on whether the universe is infinite or not.
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      I dont know if i completely understand your theory so i cant say if i agree with it or not but i think its a very interesting theory and it made me think , so thanks for sharing it , i just have one question, so now that you have reached to this conclusion or theory what do you believe will be the impact of it on your life personally?

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      I agree, I can't see exactly what you are trying to bring across.

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      What I was trying to convey is that we live in an empty space that is occupied, this space is filled with anything, be it what we call physical matter to simple thoughts or ideas. If death is indeed oblivion then it is no different than anything else. I was trying to say that we are living in an oblivion right now but it is occupied. (Physical matter). Or the oblivion people see in their dream state before a new dream scene comes into existence. Basically, oblivion doesn't remain empty for long since something else takes it's place relatively quickly. So when the concept of death = oblivion comes along, it doesn't make it any different than other forms of existence we have experienced, be it waking life, dream life, etc. That is what I was trying to say.

      Sometimes when I meditate my mind ponders things and comes up with something like this and I feel like I should write them down. Hence the existence of this post and also why I call it my ramblings at the bottom of the OP And also since I know that this could very well be wrong I say take what resonates and leave everything behind. Also I like to get people to ponder and think. At least one person thought it was interesting.

      Quote Originally Posted by gogodoll View Post
      I dont know if i completely understand your theory so i cant say if i agree with it or not but i think its a very interesting theory and it made me think , so thanks for sharing it , i just have one question, so now that you have reached to this conclusion or theory what do you believe will be the impact of it on your life personally?
      You don't have to understand the theory. This was just something I thought of while meditating and thought it was interesting. As long as I got you to think then that was all that matters. As for the impact on my life? Well my behavior isn't going to change. My life is the same before I thought of this and after I thought of this. But it makes me change the way you view the world. If scientist were to just discover that the physical world is a 3d hologram, it wouldn't change how we behave but it will change our view on reality. So besides from a different change of perspective there was no other impact on my life besides from a change of perspective. But a change of perspective can be powerful thing sometimes. Maybe down the road the way I view life will affect my future.

      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Common misconception. The 'expansion of the universe' doesn't refer to a finite object expanding into empty space. Rather, it means that space itself is inflating; 'filling with more space' (kind of like stretching rubber).

      There is no 'void' and the jury is currently totally out on whether the universe is infinite or not.

      well, there goes my attempt of being a little scientific....
      Last edited by anderj101; 03-20-2013 at 03:49 AM. Reason: Merged 4 posts

    6. #6
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      It's difficult to explain void because words become meaningless regarding that which neither exists nor does not exist. We are left with worthless signposts that point to no where in particular.

      The void does exist (as a concept) when you regard time, and in fact if you take your argument and use time as the medium rather than space, it becomes easier to swallow. Time continues to expand forward, and the end of time continues to elude the passage of time itself. Once this reality is contemplated, time ceases to exist at all.

      The same conundrum exists with space, which is where one realizes that observation takes primacy over beliefs regarding the observation. But that's just basic existentialism.

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


    7. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by Original Poster View Post
      It's difficult to explain void because words become meaningless regarding that which neither exists nor does not exist. We are left with worthless signposts that point to no where in particular.

      The void does exist (as a concept) when you regard time, and in fact if you take your argument and use time as the medium rather than space, it becomes easier to swallow. Time continues to expand forward, and the end of time continues to elude the passage of time itself. Once this reality is contemplated, time ceases to exist at all.

      The same conundrum exists with space, which is where one realizes that observation takes primacy over beliefs regarding the observation. But that's just basic existentialism.
      That's a nice way of viewing it. Thanks for your input. Glad that there are those that get what I was trying to convey.

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      I think that what we may think in our minds and be absolutely sure about what we know now but I am beginning to question whether there is a place we can just live and die in without any possibility of living again and perhaps how we feel was necessary or to the fullest of how we felt was missing from our own lives while alive is how we will live in the future after death. This is only a question of my conscious, a peculiarity of this reality, and perhaps if it were to be true I still have a lot of space to fill in, and that is the void, space.
      I think that even though we may collectively think things and be aware of the vastness of our Universe there is still a closed space in our minds that really doesn't allow us to think and comprehend how superior this vastness of the universe is to our conscious minds. I may not know the stars beyond the milky way or even past the moon but there is so much more to this void and space that I cannot just possible now with given evidence and study, and that to me is amazing.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Daredevilpwn View Post
      That my friends, is the void. Let me explain in detail. I have been pondering this for a day, this thought just came to me one day and I would like to share it with you all. The universe is not infinite, the fact that it is expanding right now means that it currently has an end. Think of yourself as a track star and you see the finish line, but the finish line is extending faster than you could run to it, however if you got in a really fast car (cheater!) you could make it to the finish line, so although the universe is expanding if we can build something that moves faster than the universe could expand, then eventually you would make it to the end of the universe so really, the universe isn't infinite but it is trying to become infinite. So what exactly is infinite? If the universe isn't infinite then, the space it is trying to occupy must be infinite, this space is the void. The universe is trying to fill in the void, but that is impossible since the void is infinite. If you go out into space, then take out all the stars, planets, random rocks floating and everything else, all you have left is just blackness. This is the void. According to the big bang theory the universe exploded into existence and from then on it has begun it's futile quest to fill in the void. Right now as you are reading this post, you are in the void it is just that this part of the void that we are in is being occupied by this stuff we call matter.

      But even matter isn't solid. Solidity is an illusion. What we feel as touch is the repulsion of the electromagnetic forces. Basically when you sit on a chair you are technically floating. Anyway, enough of this science. Basically the main point here is that first there was the void and nothing else, then something comes to occupy the void. Now lets look at dreams. Sometimes when a dream ends instead of waking up the dreamer is in a pocket of empty space then a new dream scene materializes and spreads out before them. This is very similar to how our physical world was created if the big bang theory is correct. The difference between them is just how long it took to manifest. Dreams manifest far more quickly than things in this physical world but in principle the way a new dream scene is created and the way our universe was born is very similar. First there was a void then it becomes filled.

      A more simpler way to experience the void is to simply close your eyes and cover them. For a moment there is nothing however even that too starts to get filled. People would see colors, images, dots of light, etc. Can you see the pattern here? In all instances the void gets filled by something, be it physical matter, or ideals and beliefs which is the stuff dreams are made of or random colors. The void seems to be able to get filled by intangible things as well as tangible things. Not only that but it seems that the voids purpose is to simply be filled, because the void never remains empty for long it always gets filled. So there is one last void that I must discuss. There are people that believe in the after life, some believe there is nothing after death and they may be right, maybe there is nothing after death however how long will it be that way? If the void awaits us when we die then what makes it any different than the void we encounter in our dreams when we wait for a new dream to form? What makes it any different than the void we live in now currently being occupied by this universe? Why cannot the void of death be filled? It seems apparent the it's nature is to simply be occupied, not only that but it can be occupied by many things, be it this physical substance or beliefs and emotions and ideals, the stuff dreams are made of. The void of death, is no different than the void of life, and the void of dreams, or even the void of our eyes being closed, because in the end, something begins to fill it. So just because the void awaits us when we die, you have to understand that we are always in the void but it is always being occupied.

      Thanks for reading my ramblings. Take what resonates and leave everything behind.
      You are on the right track! as far as the universe itself goes, the dimension of space/time is expanding if I understand correctly. There is no dimension of empty space outside it. This is a common conclusion though to come to as it is the mind's attempt to understand infinity and finity.
      But you are on the right track. It is easy to get caught up in conceptual thinking. You are on the right track but it is still conceptual thought. In our experience, the void is the space between two thoughts. Outside our experience there is no void. There is the vacuum of space, but that still has dimensions and things like radiation and solar winds. But still, inside atoms between the particles is vast amounts of empty space.

      Since you are aware of the space between dreams you are very very close. This space between dreams, that dreams come from and return to, is the same space that exists always. You can stop dreaming, you can stop thinking, you can die, you can go into a coma, anything can happen but you cannot destroy the space between thoughts or between dreams. This space is creative, hence it manifests as experience, phenomena. Endlessly. After death, the Universe still lives on. This space keeps manifesting phenomena. Even though all this phenomena is empty of any inherent reality, being the stuff of dreams, it still continuously manifests. It is the empty void between thoughts, between dreams, between particles, etc. that makes it possible for all of this 'stuff' to exist, including the vacuum space. You can destroy a cup but you cannot destroy the space the cup occupied.

    10. #10
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      It's a bit late to write a long comment, but I think this was a very interesting read OP. Thanks for sharing.

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