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    Thread: Age and Lucidity

    1. #51
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      Quote Originally Posted by lenscaper View Post
      How does age affect the ability to experience lucid dreams as a beginner?
      Welcome dreamer. 62 here, born lucid dreamer (since earliest memories). Very practiced in dream yoga.

      I'd think an advantage of waking up to lucid dreaming later in life might be that you've already had time to sort out much of the nonsense of youth, unless of course, you've carried that with you. But even if so, you've probably got more critical thinking skills that in your youth you might not have yet developed. You might be less inclined towards magical or otherwise crazy thinking so you might be able to see what you are experiencing more clearly, less cluttered and associate it more integrally with the rest of your thinking. You might be less affected by peer pressure so able to consider your experiences in a more independent way without the coloring of everyone else's opinion.

      There are numerous issues of lucidly dreaming in youth. For instance, I didn't know the difference between when my body was awake and when it was asleep as a young child. So I'd "have conversations" that those people would later deny. When I got older it wound up take me years to sort out what was memory and which was dream.

      Also odd at my age, slightly younger than you was that early on we had no internet. We didn't even have much of the eastern works such as Dzogchen and its dream yoga yet translated. So even if you could find info in the library, that was limited, severely. There was very little research at the time in the west. LaBerge was just cranking up. Tart had done a book on altered states. Castaneda was having fun with fiction. But most of the Tibetan works from those who'd studied dreaming for 100s of years was not yet available. So we were for the most part all on our own. Trying to figure out what was hardly if ever spoken about. Certainly we gained from that experience of doing that work but it would have been nice to have had all the resources available to you today.

      Also I'd think there's a confidence to our older years replacing cockiness of our younger selves that might help stabilize your dreaming as well as maybe a humility required to extend the view of what you might be able to see.
      Last edited by dream yogi; 03-17-2019 at 06:38 AM.
      when we dream that we dream we are beginning to wake up ~~ novalis 1772-1801
      our truest life is when we are in dreams awake ~~ henry david thoreau 1817-1862
      dreams can be opportunities not to be slept through but to be explored ~~ me 1957-lololol

    2. #52
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      Thanks for those excellent perspectives, dream yogi. Everything you said fits with what I have realized in these past weeks about my predisposition for this. While I left the nonsense of youth behind fairly early, the many paths that I found myself on during my life were somewhat diverse, sometimes to the point of distraction, even as I always maintained a strong connection to the center.

      Quote Originally Posted by dream yogi View Post
      Also odd at my age, slightly younger than you was that early on we had no internet.
      This, I think, is a huge factor. My only contact with the possibilities of dreaming came in the early 70's through Castaneda and it was not until just this past year, when I picked his books up again, that I discovered the fictional aspect of his writings. If it was not for the internet I may have never found myself on this path and I do not believe that I would have progressed so quickly. One of the most powerful tools that I have found in this journey is total immersion. Since I am fortunate enough to have a completely autonomous work space during the day, I have been free to peruse every lucid dreaming website and listen to every blog and video that I could find.

      Also I'd think there's a confidence to our older years replacing cockiness of our younger selves that might help stabilize your dreaming as well as maybe a humility required to extend the view of what you might be able to see.
      Absolutely.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    3. #53
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      Quote Originally Posted by lenscaper View Post
      Thanks for those excellent perspectives, dream yogi. Everything you said fits with what I have realized in these past weeks about my predisposition for this. While I left the nonsense of youth behind fairly early, the many paths that I found myself on during my life were somewhat diverse, sometimes to the point of distraction, even as I always maintained a strong connection to the center.



      This, I think, is a huge factor. My only contact with the possibilities of dreaming came in the early 70's through Castaneda and it was not until just this past year, when I picked his books up again, that I discovered the fictional aspect of his writings. If it was not for the internet I may have never found myself on this path and I do not believe that I would have progressed so quickly. One of the most powerful tools that I have found in this journey is total immersion. Since I am fortunate enough to have a completely autonomous work space during the day, I have been free to peruse every lucid dreaming website and listen to every blog and video that I could find.



      Absolutely.
      You're very welcome lenscaper. Sometimes seems just about anything can distract from pretty much everything else.

      While there's time saving benefits to not reinventing the wheel, even given the now relative abundance of information on dreaming, I'd rely if at all on that more as clues, less as map; less as instruction, more as confirmation, reaching places in the mind more by self direction, by our own mistakes even, more by experience, less by imagination, the object being to establish the neurological pathways that drug taking or living vicariously though others might not provide.
      when we dream that we dream we are beginning to wake up ~~ novalis 1772-1801
      our truest life is when we are in dreams awake ~~ henry david thoreau 1817-1862
      dreams can be opportunities not to be slept through but to be explored ~~ me 1957-lololol

    4. #54
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      Quote Originally Posted by dream yogi View Post
      reaching places in the mind more by self direction, by our own mistakes even, more by experience, less by imagination, the object being to establish the neurological pathways
      I added that bold because I think this is a huge piece of advice. There is an aura of fantasy and mysticism that surrounds the concept of lucid dreaming but there is also a great deal of hard science. I have been allowing myself to go in whatever direction felt right and it has been very rewarding. Of late, however, I am feeling myself drifting a little.

      Neurological pathways........never too late to establish new ones........

      EDIT:

      In my office now and researching neural plasticity.
      Last edited by lenscaper; 03-19-2019 at 01:04 PM.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    5. #55
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      I ran across a very cool video as I was researching neuroplasticity and how it relates to lucid dreaming. This has me realizing that I can really create new neural pathways that will make this whole process happen naturally.....if I just keep at it with diligence and intent.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmHlBi77FdQ
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    6. #56
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      And Then........Silence

      After my first seven weeks of pretty constant lucidity the spigot has turned itself off.

      I'm good with that. I have lots to ponder now as I feel the stream flowing by me now just out of reach.

      I am patiently waiting.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    7. #57
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      The Ebb and the Flow

      It's interesting feeling how that ebb is slowly returning to flow as I let go a bit. These last two nights were the first nights in these eight weeks of my training that I did not attempt any lucidity techniques at all. In spite of that, last night's non-lucid dreams were, once again, filled with very aware and almost lucid moments with clear possibilities (in hindsight) for dream sign induced lucidity.

      Relative to age and lucidity.......I am realizing that us old folks need more sleep in general and when we try too hard we disturb the balance between restorative sleep and REM sleep. Anybody care to comment on that?
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

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      Set In Our Ways

      Last night, after some very strong SSILD cycling, I fell asleep but immediately woke back up and started cycling again. This time my partner was there egging me on.......it was, pf course, a false awakening.

      It was extremely real, until I decided to go out into the kitchen and check on the pancakes. As I looked down at those perfect looking cakes on the griddle lucidity hit me like a wet fish. I woke up chuckling out loud.

      I got to thinking this morning that my biggest hurdle on this path, as an old guy, is that I have spent the better part of 67 years creating my realities and learning to trust them. Now, after all this time, those neural pathways are like super highways, i'm finally learning to question those realities so I can change them in this dream duality. It's going to take time.

      Oh, to be young again.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    9. #59
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      How lucid dreaming is pushing me towards awareness

      Consider the following:

      Dreams

      Death (and NDE…Near Death Experiences)

      DMT…the psychedelic drug Dimethyltryptamine…which some claim we can all synthesize.

      NHS/Imperial College London research claims similarities between NDE and a DMT trip.

      If true, where is the DMT available in hospitals and theatres of war?

      Such trips are usually profound, and some say life-changing. Many people who trip get déjà vu (a feeling of being there before) and have difficulty expressing experience.

      Lucid dreaming…the ability to “wake up’ within dreams. It exists (I’ve done it a few times)

      Some people are natural LD’ers. They may be awash with the hormone melatonin, (derived from the amino acid tryptophan) which regulates sleep patterns.

      Most of us need to work at lucid dreaming. (keeping dream-journals, spotting common dream themes, conditioning the brain to be more aware during sleep.) It’s quite hard to do.

      Most dreams are quickly forgotten unless recorded immediately.

      Buddhists maintain one’s persona evaporates during death and only a degree of awareness remains. If we do re-incarnate, they say it’s only awareness that does. Consider a new born baby. Is that not just awareness at first?

      Buddhists maintain the opportunity exists to avoid reincarnation, by conditioning oneself to recognise a source of radiance when it occurs. As in dreaming, it can easily be missed unless one’s awareness is finely honed.

      Why would one avoid reincarnation? Because it may be endlessly reoccurring and with the likelihood of unpleasant existences because it may be so random?

      Common factors?

      Cycles…Dream themes, reoccurring experiences on DMT trips, maybe reincarnation.

      Deja Vu…(done this before) experienced on DMT trips and by some people who ‘remember’ previous lives.

      Awareness…facilitates lucid dreaming and after-death experience (according to Buddhists.)
      If the World didn't suck we'd all fall off.

      We are going through the eye of the needle; make sure you leave what you don't need behind. (Terence Mckenna 1946-2000)

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      All great stuff in that post, LukeSid. Two months ago most of what you said would have been of just passing interest to me but now that I am firmly planted on the LD/Dream Yoga path, all of your above comments really resonate.

      Regarding awareness......this is where my life seems to be changing the most, even at this somewhat advanced age. I always considered myself to be more aware of the world around me than most, due to a few various disciplines in my life, but now that I am basically dismantling my perceived realities on a daily basis I am more aware of detail than ever both awake and a'dream. I find myself becoming the lucid observer almost every night now.....fully aware of the dream state and yet just letting it flow around me as I reach out and grab little pieces of it to take back with me across the threshold.

      Quote Originally Posted by LukeSid View Post
      recognise a source of radiance when it occurs.
      I like that a lot. I'm going to put it into my mantra tonight.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    11. #61
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      The Lucid Observer

      As I enter my third month of training I am coming to a pretty clear understanding and acceptance of my personal lucidity. I am able to achieve lucidity often.....just about every time I make a sincere effort, but I rarely have adventures. Instead, I find myself passively observing people around me....occasionally interacting....while in a state of very clear lucidity. These are almost always people from my past. I am definitely attributing this to age.

      At 67, I have had my adventures already. I do not feel a strong need to have more. Instead I seem to be working out karma in my dreams and it feels wonderful. Last night I sat at a cafe table in deep conversation with a young woman whom I did not know.....helping her to understand lucid dreaming. Later in the night, after a WBTB, I met that same woman in a mall and she was struggling badly with something I could not see. I watched for a while and then beckoned to her. She came to me and I was able to comfort her.

      I did, however, have a very exhilarating flight off a snowy mountain the other night. Guess there's still a bit of the adventurer left inside somewhere.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

    12. #62
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      i often wonder this my self. i am so glad and happy for you! i got into lucid dreaming when i was younger. in fact when i found it. by researching astral projection, i thought it was a made up thing that was on the internet so i totally understand how happy you are the line from the matrix movie. why are my eyes so sore? Morpheus: you never used them before. welcome to the real world lenscaper.
      now back to what i was saying, i wonder this my self all the time. jeswiz i am even asking the occasional older person here and there if they dream more or less now? compared to when they were younger. it could be a brain chemistry thing as others have said. it could even be your perceptive on it. your beliefs even. i wish i had all the answers i did a quick google on it and got this, maybe it will help you? https://www.sleepfoundation.org/arti...ging-and-sleep. i hope it helps
      i couldnt imagine getting into lucid dreaming at a older age. you got so much to explore my friend. prepare thy self, a good book on the whole brain chemistry thing is called Advanced_Lucid_Dreaming-The_Power_of_Supplements. you can download it in pdf form
      Last edited by acillis; 04-09-2019 at 05:52 AM.

    13. #63
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      Hey acillis......thanks for that link and for your support. Truth is that I am still very good at falling asleep and I as I got older I have had more vivid dreams. My dream recall has always been good as well. I suspect I have had lucid dream moments in the past without recognizing them. It was a massive such moment a few months ago that brought me to this wonderful LD path now.

      I guess I am a bit of an anomaly, though.....as an older person in general, because I have spent my life in search of any path that led me toward greater self realization. This has kept me a bit younger than my years. That said, I after a lifetime of changes I find myself content to sit back a bit these days and watch things transpire around me. I suspect that laid back attitude stays with me in my dreams as well now. I find myself looking for depth of meaning in the plots that my mind spins up and only changing things when they go in odd directions. I wonder if that is the halmark of an older lucid dreamer.

      I did try a supplement early on, btw, but I did not like how it made me feel. We'll see if I go back to it later.
      The more I gaze....the more I crave to see

      Breathe In The Water
      https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v4/...ongID=13859524

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