Thread: A method (Interrupted Sleep Audio Method) for lucidity for those who can't get up to WBTB or newbies

Kia-ora / hello - thought I would post about a method I have been using which currently is giving me a pretty effective rate of lucidity. I call it the Interrupted Sleep Audio Method (I-AM or IS-AM). I wanted to share it as I thought it might be useful for people unable (or unwilling ) to get out of bed for a WBTB or for newbies who are struggling to get lucid. I am profusively sorry in advance if this post is too long, or if you try and method and don't like it! It works well for me and I just wanted to share.


The Basics
I do everything I can to avoid disturbing/annoying my wife (and not just during the day but also at night!). So I don't get up out of bed to do this, and its all done silently. Before bed (unknown to my wife) I stick a small pair of $1 ear buds inside my pillow slip and attach them to a small mp3 player. The mp3 player has a short audio track that repeats and says in my own voice that 'the reality check is successful' to relax and 'keep looking for the vibe'. I attach the mp3 player to a sweat wrist band. As I get in bed I place a vibrating alarm clock on my wrist and attach the mp3 player to my pj bottoms. The vibration on my wrist wakes me up silently after 6 hrs of sleep, or at least 1 30mins before my workday alarm is due to go off. I don't get up, I just set the alarm to vibrate on a low setting for 2 secs every 24mins or so and place it against my ankle. I then transfer the mp3 player with the audio on it and attach it to the sweat wrist band on my hand so it stays in place whilst I'm sleep with my thumb resting on the button which turns it on. I play the audio track once and centre my ears over the ear buds in the pillow. Then I return to sleep, sometimes this will be immediately (within a minute or two of setting things up), sometimes I won't be till after the first vibe goes off after 24mins. When the vibe goes off several things might happen:

a) most commonly I get 'normally' woken up subtley by the vibration going off, I stay still but depress my thumb, this activates the audio - I listen to it, focusing especially on the words, turn the audio off and return to sleep with hardly moving...or
b) I depress the audio button - but the audio is garbled or makes a beeping sound - I realise this is a FA and am lucid....or
c) the vibe is incorporated into a dream - ideally I do a RC and become lucid

80% of the time its a) the vibe wakes me up - I do the audio reality check/message and return to sleep and by doing this I have a very high chance of having a DILD within 1 30mins of starting the process. If I can sleep in longer I've got a chance of multiple lucid dreams.


Results -
Over the last 7 weeks I've done this method identically 19 times mostly within a 90minute time frame, I got lucid 15 of those mornings (79%), and on a couple of those mornings I got multiple lucid dreams (generally when I had 2 hrs from waking to play with) - in total I got 16 LD's total from those 19 attempts (84%).

On 2 nights I accidently failed to set the alarm on repeat mode and so woke up and returned to sleep with the intention to get lucid, but failed to get lucid at all - these 'control' nights suggest it is the method and not my intention which is working (those were frustrating!).

In contrast to the above my baserate LD rate without using any method is zero! I am not a 'natural' lucid dreamer. I have tried other methods to get lucid and have had limited success but with nowhere the success of this method.


Of interest - of this 19 LD's almost all are DILD's - which suprised me. I had developed the method to try and get the vibration incorporated into my dreams (EILD) and the vibration has indeed been incorporated a couple of times, with lucidity sometimes following. I have also had 1 WILD in the process of returning to sleep after doing the audio check. But the vast majority of the LD's are 'normal' DILD's. The method (to my mind) works by increasing the brains awareness through repetitive awakenings, with the audio acting both as a reality check and a way to prevent desensitization to the vibration signal and a way to pick up FA's and reinforcing the awareness and focusing ones intention on the task, it requires no visualization or particular thought - you just listen and the words get reinforced in your mind. So when I return to REM I either just realize something is obviously dreamlike and become lucid quickly (generally without the need to do a reality check) or I find I am thinking about lucid dreaming and then it dawns on me this IS a dream and I become lucid. The vibration cue is subtle enough to not be jarring and won't disturb a sleeping partner, neither will the audio as the ear buds are tiny. The fact you hardly move to activate the audio (I return to sleep with my thumb on the button) means you can return to REM sleep very quickly - but note the intention is NOT to DIELD, it is simply to listen carefully to the audio track.


I like this method - because a) its working
b) it works without me having to get up, and I don't feel especially tired after doing it
c) I can do it even on the mornings I have to get up at 6.20am to go to work, I just set the initial alarm to wake me up at 4.50am. I generally don't do it on consecutive nights if I'm working. I also often do it after I've had 2 glasses of wine and that seems to have no adverse effect (as long as its NZ white wine ha ha!).


Anyway - hope this of some interest to anyone! And sorry for a long post!
Cheers - T

Congratulations on inventing your own EILD! Your success rate so far is amazing.

I like the idea of using vibrations as a trigger. What device are you using for the vibrating alarm?

This looks quite promising. How long is your audio recording?

Hi Verre - thanks for you comment and congrats on your wings! I had a look at the dreams that got you them - pretty epic! To answer your question - I use a small vibrating alarm called the 'Invisible Clock II' - its very small and light and customisable. Its quite a cool experience to have a signal you've programmed in real life be incorporated directly into the dream and get you lucid - a direct EILD - as close as you can get I guess to sending a message 'to the other side' - but most of the LD's I've gotten through this tech have been DILD's and the clock is essentially just a way of quietly interrupting my sleep on a very regular basis.

Dahaka - regarding the audio - it lasts around 8-10 secs in length, so not long. I guess you could think of it as an autosuggestion, focusing your intention as you fall back into sleep (as well as raising your alertness and acting as a reality check to pick up FA's).

Hope this helps -thanks for the questions - cheers - T

I used this method this morning and got lucid through it again (yay!) so I thought it might help if I worked through how it happened as the method might sound a bit more involved than it is. I went to bed around 11.00pm and set my vibrating alarm for 6 hours, it woke me up at 5.05am (out of REM sleep) and I immediately set it to go off for 2 secs every 22 minutes and tied it against my ankle. I then played the audio on my mp3 player once (telling me that this was a 'successful reality check, to relax and rest and keep looking for the vibe' - this last bit means - to be alert) and whilst it was playing I centred my ears over the buds in my pillow and switched the audio off with my thumb and returned to sleep.

I went into a light sleep - dozing and the vibe went off 22 minutes later at 5.27am and I stayed still, played the audio once - listening carefully to the words without moving or opening my eyes other than the slight movement of my thumb to turn it on and off.

I dropped more quickly into deeper sleep after this - this time into deeper NREM until the next vibe went off 22 mins later at 5.49am and again I stayed still and played the audio once - listening carefully to the words and returned to sleep.

At this stage I went from NREM into REM after a few minutes as I had a dream which went on for a few minutes and in which I became lucid when I realized an oddity in the dream ('an insect attacking my head'). I didn't require a reality check as as soon as I thought how improbable this was it was obvious that I was in a dream. After becoming lucid I spun to stabilize but unfortunately lost the dream into the void and woke up (doohhh - I was hoping this was last chance to get the TOTM! I'm not great at stabilization but that's a separate issue! ). I stayed still after the void ended hoping to drop back into REM and get another DILD and about 5 mins later the vibe went again, pinning the LD to around 6.05am, 1 hour after I initiated the process. I did the audio again, but my mind drifted to work stresses and after a bit I had to get up.

So the LD was a DILD, and it occurred after 1 hour after I started the attempt - 3 cycles 22 mins apart of interrupted awakenings and playing the 8 sec audio each time (one at 5.05, 5.27, 5.49am) - this is pretty typical of how the tech tends to work 80% of the time and means I've now had 17 LD's on the 20 times I've used the method (the last one prev to this was 2 days ago which prompted me to write the initial post 2 days ago).

Hope this might make the understanding of the method easier

Thanks for the detailed explanation! I definitely need to find a method with more reliability. My LDs do tend to be quite long and elaborate once I do get lucid, but getting there is the hitch... these days little short of hours-long WBTBs seems to do the trick, and that is just not practical on a regular basis! SSILD and FILD gave great results at first but I got habituated to them almost immediately. EILD is just about the only thing I haven't tried at this point, so I think I'm going to shop around for one of these little vibrating alarms.

This gave me good idea for people who don't have this timer of yours. I will try this EILD by putting my phone into long socks and set it up to vibe alarm. I already downloaded app for it.

And about the sound message, is that really neccessary? Would you try it without?

How many times out of 17 tries was it : c) the vibe is incorporated into a dream - ideally I do a RC and become lucid? c - is what I would like to achieve

Hi Nfri - in the method I described above (the original post) I just refer to a vibrating alarm - I'm sure using this feature on your phone would work well - its a good idea -although the clock I use is good in that you can vary the strength of the vibration - but really the key bit there is that your sleep is interrupted on a very regular basis - audio or other natural methods would be fine too. I found I still got multiple lucid dreams (not included in the above tally) when I stayed in a hotel room and got woken up every 45mins or so by my daughter grinding her teeth for several hours! She would wake me up, I'd lay still, du the audio bit in my head and drop back to sleep and DILD's would follow. The interruption bit is the most key bit (I feel) - using the vibe just makes it happen reliably and silently, but the audio is important to enhance your chances - but reinforcing your intention and also acting to increase awareness (and as described below to prevent habituation to the thing waking you up). The vibe is also the benefit - as you were interested in, that occassionally you might get it incorporated into your dream directly - but these are more of a bonus than a staple.

I also have a soft spot for direct incorporation of the vibe signal into the dream - its quite a cool feeling but from personal experience I would be wary of just using the vibe without the audio - and heres why. I did what you're outlining above some 10 months ago, just used a vibration signal on a timer to try and get lucid (with no audio). And it was moderately successful (I think of 19 times 10 LD's approx?) - although again interestingly only half the times were the LD's through incorporation of the signal into the dream, the others (I think) were because of the interruption to my sleep. HOWEVER I rapidly became habituated to the vibe going off and within a few weeks even the strongest signal wouldn't wake me up or get incorporated into the dream. This is because the vibe is going to go off alot of times NREM sleep and unless you actively do something when this happens (like my audio reality check above) you will be teaching your brain to ignore the signal after a while. Using the audio as directed above stops this habituation (in me at least). The downside is that there are less incorporations (but more total lucidity) in the above method. So in the 20 times I've done the above method I've had maybe 3 incorps, 1-2 LD's, because its much more likely the vibe will wake me up - and I am using it on its lowest setting. If you are interested FryingMan has put a link up about a device which is being developed in which a vibrating cue would be delivered when REM sleep was detected. This may resolve some of the habituation issues http://www.dreamviews.com/lucid-aids...neirics-2.html. Of interest too if you read his post in his thread #23 I think he mentions hes used the REM dreamer, a light cue on a timer, and now sleeps through even the brightest signals - having become - in his own words - habituated to the signal. I have also noticed people doing CAN-WILD, which again involves using an alarm to wake up at regular intervals - also mention that they become more 'immune' to the signal after a while of doing it. The method I've mentioned above counteracts this tendency by associating a definite action with the signal going off - preventing passiveness - which is the root cause of desensitization.

Hope this helps - I think my final advice would be - experiment! You'll have fun and probably get some fun incorporations of the vibe even if you just use the vibe by itself. And if you start to notice you're becoming desensitized to the vibe signal then add on what I've described above and it should help.

cheers - T

Hey Tlaloc! I was inspired by your method to buy a programmable vibrating timer for myself, and I used it last night with excellent results!

Here's the part of the dream relevant to the device:

Spoiler for EILD-triggered False Awakening:

After reading about Tlaloc's homebrew EILD technique, I wanted to try something similar, so I compared the devices available on Amazon and settled on the "MotivAider." Although bulky and overpriced, I liked that the vibration length and intensity are fully customizable, and the fact that it has an option to go off at random intervals. It recently arrived in the mail, so I read the instructions before going to bed last night, but decided to wait until my WBTB to program it, since I figured the task would help reawaken my mind as well as focus my intention.

Went to bed at 1:30am, woke naturally at 5am. I realized my motivation wasn't as high as I had anticipated because I remembered how much work I needed to get done before the weekend was over, and reasoned that sleeping in after a long WBTB and writing a dream report if successful would really cut into my available time. However, the MotivAider beckoned, so I decided to do a very short WBTB, just long enough to program it and set it up before going back to sleep. I set the vibration to its minimal length (two seconds), programmed it to go off in random intervals up to 45 minutes, and placed it in the case of my leg pillow, where I should be able to feel it through the fabric. (I am a side sleeper and always use an extra pillow between my knees.) I thought the vibration would be too disruptive if it was near my head, so I wanted it somewhere closer to my feet. I returned to bed at 5:20am. I lay awake for a while with anticipation, and eventually decided I had better also put the vibration on its weakest setting, so I reprogrammed the device by the light of my phone.

At some point I must have drifted off to sleep, and then I felt the device go off. But something had gone wrong: the vibrations were pulsing repetitively without cease. I tried to ignore them, but they seemed to be going on for over a minute. I decided I must have programmed the device incorrectly, so I got up and took it out of the pillow, setting it aside. Tomorrow I could figure out what the problem was.

Shortly after that I was walking through the house, and I noticed something odd. Glancing through the sliding glass door in the kitchen, I saw that the water level of the river next to the house had risen way too high. In fact, the water was coming right up to the base of the door, like it was on the verge of flooding in. This observation was so startling that it made me realize I must be dreaming... maybe the EILD had worked after all! Had I ever really gotten up, or had it all been an FA? [...]

Sure enough, the whole experience turned out to be a false awakening: when I got up to start my report (at 6:10am), I discovered that I had never removed the device from the pillow like I remembered doing. And this indicates that it must not have malfunctioned after all, and that the extended sequence of vibrations I felt was most likely an experience of time dilation conditioned by the dream state.

Full DJ account here: October 5, 2014, "If there's water near the house, it's a dream."

I hope it continues to work this well or else I'll have to figure out ways to counter habituation, but it definitely works in principle!

He tino pai - that's GREAT Verre! Wow! A lot of the dreams I've had where the vibe has been incorporated it has ended up changed slightly - frequently repeating as you found. Its cool to have someone else discovering similar stuff I'd love to hear how your experiences continue. I often pause and 'listen' to the vibe when it goes of (I know I'm mixing senses but that's how it feels!) - I use a single 2 sec pulse, and when it goes off I 'listen' to it, if it repeats multiple times or if theres a noise associated with it like a beep then this is almost certainly a sign I'm dreaming and I often won't even have to do a RC to confirm it. Your explanation of time dilation is interesting. Its fascinating to see how the signal is 'almost' directly incorporated, but at the same time morphed by the sleeping brain - kind of like a tourettes effect!

I did occasional day training with the device just to reinforce doing a RC every time it went off - I found it quite fun as it mimicked well how the vibe works in the dream - the vibe goes off in the middle of everyday activities - having a haircut, having a conversation, at work, which mimics well how it can occur in the dream - at any point - and this gets you good at doing a RC whenever the vibe goes off - regardless of the activity. The ones which were hardest to catch in many ways were like the FA you had - dreaming about programming the device, because its hard to remember do a RC then even in real life.

I'd like to know more about your device - I'll PM you if that's ok? - and again CONGRATS! I am really excited someone is doing this too - I am very keen to team up and share results - best of luck Verre - cheers - T

Another good result from the vibrating alarm, despite a minimal WBTB. This was a very unusual experience in that this time the alarm actually seems to have worked through anticipation alone, because based on the timing I don't think it ever even went off!

Spoiler for MotivAider as EILD device:

Ritual: Second try with the vibrating timer, successful but strange experience. This time it seemed to work not so much from going off (in fact I doubt it ever did), but because my anticipation of the trigger kept my mind alert during the process of falling asleep—to the point where I thought I was still awake long after I had evidently slipped into dream.

It's becoming apparent that anticipation can serve the same function as motivation. Actually my motivation was relatively low, for the same reason as last time: it is the busiest part of my work week and I realized that I wasn't sure I wanted to have to spend a long time writing up my dream report if successful. I went to bed a little after 12:30am, and woke up naturally around 5:40. (I checked the clock but can't recall the precise time, I think it was somewhere between 5:37 and 5:43.) I decided it was too late to do full WBTB and recognized my lack of motivation, so I just shoved the MotivAider in my pillow and went back to bed with no further technique, letting things take their own course.

Although normally I would fall back asleep in seconds or minutes at most after such a brief WBTB, I noticed that now I was oddly wakeful... it seemed like just waiting for the device to go off, even though it was set so that it wouldn't trigger initially until 45 minutes had passed, was keeping me awake. After a few minutes trying to get comfortable I grabbed the sleep mask from my bedside table because I knew the sun would come up soon. I then spent a very long time trying to get back to sleep... or so I thought. In retrospect it is apparent that for much of this period I was experiencing that obscure counterpart of a false awakening, a "false falling asleep" (FFA).

FFA: I think I must have actually fallen asleep very quickly, since a lot of the things I experienced while I thought I was trying to fall asleep turn out to be have been things I dreamed. For instance, at one point I was convinced that I was lying in bed with my body rotated in the opposite direction, my head facing the foot of the bed, but then I fixed this without really moving my limbs... a maneuver that would have been impossible to do physically.

Eventually I decided that I ought to have a back-up EILD method so I tried to program my sleeping mask. I reached up and pried apart the velcro near the top to flick the "on" switch, remembering to hold it down four seconds to enter "nap mode." I couldn't tell if I saw the indicator lights or not... I thought I did, but the impression was vague. Did I have the brightness set too low? Oh well, I don't remember how to change it. I'll just turn it off and turn it back on again to be sure. Hmm, same thing, the lights are vague... I'm not sure if I'm really seeing them or just imagining it. And then I realize... hang on... I'm not even wearing the Remee, this is just an ordinary cloth sleep mask! So I tried to correct the situation by putting my Remee on under the regular mask... and I really thought I had done this until, while writing this report, I began to have doubts and went to check. Sure enough, the Remee hasn't been touched all night! At least I can verify that I was wearing the ordinary mask, since that one has been moved and is now lying on my bedstand where I must have left it after waking up.

At another point in the FFA I even felt the MotivAider finally go off. The vibrations felt lengthened and distorted again. I ignored them since I thought I was still awake, and hoped I would be asleep by the time it went off next. In retrospect I realize I must have dreamed even this, because the MotivAider could not have gone off until 45 minutes had passed (even on random mode it initially counts down the full maximum set interval), and I got up to start writing this report at 6:14am, less than 45 minutes after going back to bed around 5:40... so it is very unlikely that it actually went off in that whole period!

I was getting annoyed with how long it was taking (or so I thought) to fall asleep, and eventually in my impatience I decided to just start "practicing" WILD separations in my imagination. I tried to envision an almost physical pull on my dream body that would tug it up from the lying position into a standing one, and after each repetition of this I imagined myself landing with both feet on the bed with the flourish of a gymnast who has just finished an acrobatic move. It felt at first like I was only visualizing this rather than experiencing it: as though I were just going through the motions, practicing for when I got closer to falling asleep... but before long the sense of immersion set in, and I realized that I was already in a light WILD state. I was surprised that I had been able to move so easily from full wakefulness to full REM, still unaware that I had evidently already been dreaming for quite some time already!

Full DJ entry: October 7, 2014, "Indecisive Witch, Invisible Song"

Thanks TiaLoc for this thread -- I'm very keen to try vibration notifications. The device I currently have is "remee", not "rem dreamer" which is a REM-detecting (eye movement tracking) sleep mask with LED light/beep notification.

And thanks, Verre, for the pointer to the MotivAider....any other recommendations for highly (and easily) configurable vibration devices (preferably small) would be greatly appreciated.

It also inspires me to continue trying sleep interruption. I like the idea of having to do something active to avoid the habituation, I'll have to think of something....

You have quite a clever setup there, I have the same situation about not bothering the wife!

Verre: yes, I believe anticipation is incredibly powerful. The goal-seeking center of the brain is highly activated, like when we have an important meeting we must wake up for or a plane to catch at the airport. The trick is to maintain that high level of anticipation over time. Maybe building up a toolkit of many different kinds of notifications would help, and switching from time to time.

So glad I stumbled on this thread. I think this technique is definitely worth a try, so I just purchased an Invisible Clock II...which seems to have all the bells and whistles I need to experiment with either sleep interruption OR signaling myself to do a reality check at times I KNOW I will be in REM sleep. I have only had two meaningful lucid dreams so far, but thanks to a well-placed digital clock I know the exact times I woke from each, and they were within TWO MINUTES of each other. I'm going to use the Invisible Clock II to vibrate at about 4:08am as I've awoken from my LD's at 4:18am and 4:16am respectively. I should have it in-hand mid-october - a week from now.

DH

Hi Verre! - congrats on your latest lucid (and wings ) - I had a very similar dream to yours almost exactly 2 months ago when I restarted playing around with the vibe signalling and first began the method described above. I had a dream the vibe had gone off, so I did a reality check - in my case as above - starting the audio on my mp3 player, but the audio came out all garbled so I realised immediately it was a lucid dream (a failed electronic reality check). After awakening for real shortly after I checked (in real life) the timer on the vibe alarm and found it still had 3 minutes to go in its 24min cycle so the initial vibe had occurred only through expectation! As FryingMan said the anticipation factor is very powerful - but I found this only happened the once, when the novelty and 'weirdness' of using the vibe was still high. Its interesting that you've had 2 incorporations of the vibration (one real incorp, one expectation generated) - but neither time did you do a reality check after the vibe went off! you might find it quicker to get lucid from the vibe if you associate the vibe with reality checking - just a thought.

FryingMan - thanks the contribution - the 'partner factor' in lucid dreaming is an under-rated topic I think! Those who are happiest lucid dreaming have the most understanding partners I think This tech has worked well for me and its all done without getting up or disturbing my light sleeping wife - at least so far.....
You were asking about the vibe devices - I think there are more and more of these available. Verres sounds very good and customisable. The invisible clock II is also very flexible and is also very small and light, its about the size of a match box. I found it really easy to sleep with and also, crucially to wear in my sock during the day without any one else knowing it was there. That way I could do daytime practice of doing reality check whenever the vibe went off without any one else knowing as its pretty quiet.

DoubleHelix - wow! - you ordered the invisible clock II - cool! I hope it works well for you! It takes a day or so to get used to programming it - and if you wants any more hints or help I will do as much as I can to help - and now Verre is using her device they'll be another opinion as well. Be good to all be experimenting together! My feeling is - it won't be long before you get a lucid from it - good luck!

Thanks for sharing. Will try this simple non-expensive method. I'm having trouble staying awake during WBTB or even starting them. I'm too tired after work and my sleep is so important these days.

Hi, Tlaloc:

I'm hoping that Oneierics device will fund on Kickstarter, but in the event that it doesn't, your technique and utilization of a silent, vibrating alarm is inexpensive, clever, and flexible, so plunking down a little bit of money for the Invisible Clock II in the hopes of reaping a benefit was a no-brainer. As you say - it will likely prove useful for all day awareness and day time reality checking as well, so I expect to get use out of it both night AND day. I can't say that about most possessions in my life, even the ones I hold dear, like my guitar!

Again, thanks for the excellent post and clever re-purposing of this inexpensive device. Like the commercial says "Brilliant!"

DH

This is actually a timely thread because I was already starting to look into finding a "little vibrating device on a timer" since I got excited by the Oneirics kickstarter project, and would like to experiment with the vibration as a notification signal....so, again...cool!

Hi DoubleHelix - you said you'd have the clock by mid oct - so not long! You could do some prep in the meantime if you wanted to start early - if you use a phone with a vib function I would probably change this to maybe a short audio tone to alert you of messages/calls etc, because its possible the vibe might get incorporated as a phone vibe if you are already used to this.
The alternative to this if this isn't possible (or desirable) is that you just do a R/C when the phone vibrates as well - that way you're doing more random checks anyway. I had one or two dreams where the vibe came through as though I had my phone in my pocket, so I switched the phone to a tone and then it came through after that just as the clock which made it easier to get lucid.

The clock comes with a clip you can clip to your watch if you want to use it as an alarm to wake yourself up with (say to do a wbtb). To do the actually bit where you are trying to get lucid though I would recommend placing it on your ankle. There are few things in the real world that vibrate your ankle like the clock will, and by associating the ankle vibe with the clock going off it maximises the chance of the vibe being directly incorporated into the dream and spotted by yourself. Verre put her clock in a pillow between her legs whilst sleeping which seemed like a clever way to use it - mediating some of the vibe strength (which initially will seem very strong) - I hadn't thought of that and its sounds like a good option.

the tech I use and you could ready for is pretty simple. I take a pair of old cotton socks (like business socks) and cut the toe bit off so the sock is just a hollow tube with both ends open. I fold the sock in half into iself so theres a space between the sides (like a U) and slip the clock into this and pull the sock on to my ankle. Its very comfy to wear like this under my normal sock at work for daytime practice (without it the plastic gets a bit hot) and at night I put one on my wrist for the wbtb then transfer it to one on my ankle without moving much and disturbing my wife.

Anyway - just a thought! you might come up with a different way of using it which would be better! I would recommend a couple of days of daytime practice setting it to go off every 50mins or so for a few hours during the day at a 5 sec duration on setting 2 strenght and doing a reality check everytime it goes off. That way when it goes off in a dream - no matter how busy the dream is, or how involved you are in the dream story - you'll be trained to do a RC and become lucid!

let me know if you need any more help! By the way I've been continuing the tech as discussed above (I know you might not be doing it that way intially) but still having good success, beyond what I reported above, I've since had another 3 lucids in the last 5 days, 1 WILD 5 days ago, 2 DILD's this morning using the same tech (interrupted sleep with audio/autosuggestion) (but with technical probs - my audio speakers stopped working for 2 nights!). Anyway - have a good weekend to everyone (nice to hear you are interested in this starletdreamer) and good luck DoubleHelix - and thanks FryingMan for the post on the oneirics - hope it gets funded as well. cheers - T

My Invisible clock arrived early! I live only a handful of miles from where it shipped, so I got it this afternoon. I'm shocked at how many functions it has and how complex (and flexible) the alarm options are. Your sock idea is great. Just so happens I have an unmatched white sock I can use. My wife has a special talent for losing solitary socks when she does the laundry. In this case, I can't be mad!

I can see I'm going to have to rely (and not lose!) the instruction sheet. I'll let you know if I encounter any problems. I'm looking forward to employing this device in my LD training. We should keep this thread alive and see how many clever ways people can think of to re-purpose this device to aid in attaining lucidity.

EDIT: hmmmmm....Looks like I have to wake up to turn the vibration alarm off. I was hoping it would vibrate for 20 seconds or so and then stop on its own so that the vibrations would bleed into my dream in a manner similar to the lights on a Remee. A little bummed about that. Looks like you have to manually shut it off with a button press. And that means waking up fully.

You would think with all the complexity built into this device that programming a discrete period of vibration would be an option. Too bad. That inability greatly diminishes the utility of the device IMHO.

EDIT#2: I take it back. It MAY shut itself off after 20 seconds. The instructions aren't exactly clear. There is a "tip" that alludes to a 20 second vibration which may not need to be shut off. If I programmed it correctly I guess I'll find out in a few hours.

DH

Short notification auto-snooze (not needing to touch it to turn it off) is critical -- let us know if you can figure out how to do this. Maybe the other more expensive one has this option? BTW I googled invisiclock and found the instructions online so don't fret losing the sheet. Maybe try contacting the company for clarification about the auto-off.

Yep. It shut itself off after 20 seconds. The vibration isn't overwhelmingly powerful, which is GOOD - although it might just be that the triple A battery I used (not included) was old and weak. Lucky we even had ONE in the house!

I happened to already be awake at the time the alarm vibrated thanks to the callousness of my daughter and her idiot friend who let themselves into my house drunk at 1:00am, then proceeded to talk and walk around the house until 3 am. I was so annoyed I couldn't fall back to sleep, and was still awake at 4am when the vibe happened.

On the PLUS side, I fell asleep eventually, had two awesome long dreams with excellent recall. No lucidity, unfortunately.

I'm gonna exploit this tool. I hope people will suggest possible ways to use it expressly for LD purposes.

DH

OK well that's good about the auto-shutoff, whew!

Ugh about drunk daughter & friend. Let me tell you, though, being pissed does NOT help you get back to sleep and dream. I've learned this the hard way. So now I tell myself, "every sound, every sensation I'm experiencing, serves to relax me more and more. I sink deeper and deeper into relaxation..." and so on. Helps a lot! Meditation is rehersal for these sorts of scenarios, practice it!

On the PLUS side, I fell asleep eventually, had two awesome long dreams with excellent recall. No lucidity, unfortunately.

That's fanTAStic. Sageous says it best when he says: "Some dreams are fine just the way they are." I treasure my LDs but I have to say my non-lucids are way more interesting most of the time. What makes the lucids so fabulous is the *presence*, the *awareness* of being in the dream. But the plot of the non-lucids and the scenarios and the situations are way more exciting (not to mention I have absolutely no issue with keeping up a non-lucid sex for a good long time [albeit sensation is muted]). I guess I have a long way to go to get LDs at the excitement level of NLDs.

Love all your dreams, including (especially!) the non-lucid ones. Stay "close" to your dreams. Sensei calls it "dream awareness" and I think it's a major thing. Dream awareness + state awareness = lucidity. Dream awareness alone though is awesome!

Using it for LD purposes. Well, in case you haven't thought about it yet: DEILD timer is the obvious thing that comes to mind. At the appropriate time (4-6 hours? 7 hours? depends when you can get back to sleep *quickly*), have it go off every 10-15 minutes for a sleep cycle or two. Heck, try for every 5 minutes if you can. Experiment. You want to be very often roused and fall back right asleep into a dream, lucid.

The other main use is to set it up to be a dream sign. During the day, when it goes off, say to yourself, "there's my dream notification, I'm now lucid in my dream," do a RC or two, and try to keep your awareness raised, that is, become lucid when it goes off [you can be lucid while awake as well as when asleep!]. Then set it to go off when you think you'll be in REM (having a regular sleep cycle or mapped out REM times can be golden here), during the night, and do the same ritual in-dream, and because lucid and enjoy!

Only make sure you always respond to it fully every single time. Never take it for granted, it should always perk you up. If you find your reaction getting dulled, take a break or make it less frequent. React with joy and excitement!

OK well that's good about the auto-shutoff, whew!

Yeah, my bad. The directions are more complicated than those for putting together a 10 speed bike!

Originally Posted by FryingMan

That's fanTAStic. Sageous says it best when he says: "Some dreams are fine just the way they are." Love all your dreams, including (especially!) the non-lucid ones. Stay "close" to your dreams. Sensei calls it "dream awareness" and I think it's a major thing. Dream awareness + state awareness = lucidity. Dream awareness alone though is awesome!

Agreed! Now that I'm remembering my dreams almost nightly, I find the "story lines" quite amusing. I have taken to writing down just enough information to remember the dream later on when I can write the full narrative. Today I'm catching up on my dream journal (I type it) because it's raining and I'm precluded from doing any outdoorsy stuff.

DH

Originally Posted by DoubleHelix

Yeah, my bad. The directions are more complicated than those for putting together a 10 speed bike!




Agreed! Now that I'm remembering my dreams almost nightly, I find the "story lines" quite amusing. I have taken to writing down just enough information to remember the dream later on when I can write the full narrative. Today I'm catching up on my dream journal (I type it) because it's raining and I'm precluded from doing any outdoorsy stuff.

DH

I find that after doing recall for a bit over a year that a quick summary spoken into the voice recorder of my smart phone cements the dream enough in my memory to do a full journal write-up up to a week or even beyond in fairly good original detail. It is worth recording the summaries even if you think your memory is beefy enough to last a few days or more until you have time to journal, because more than once I've completely forgotten fun little dreams that my quick notes brought right back to me.

edit about amusing story lines: oh, yeah. Where do we come up with this stuff? Last night I was flying DO through a giant park of replica mountain scenes from around the world. Including fake mist (made from cotton or some other cloth) hanging from the rock outcroppings. Fabulous stuff.

HeHe...that's pretty good. I'll tell you a small part of mine from this morning. Four high school kids came around, ringing my doorbell looking for donations for the elderly while I was playing my guitar in the house. I insulted them royally through an open window before answering the door, stepping outside, and agreeing to make a donation. They hand me their clip board and I see my current address displayed (typed) in the top far left box. I ask them for some proof or ID of the cause they were collecting for, and they show me a picture. The picture depicts my front door to my old house from ~25 years ago with my niece Jodi and one other female standing on the stoop. The interesting thing was that the picture was animated, like in the Harry Potter movies, and my niece and the other gal were moving inside the picture. I had stepped outside to greet the boys to sign the form regarding my donation, and this afforded me an opportunity to surveil the sky and see what kind of day/weather we had that day. The sky was a deep blue, but there were white X's and check marks in a short vertical cylinder shape which I believed had appeared there because a TV weatherman was marking up the televised weather map at his station, and his markings bled into and became superimposed on the "real" sky. How's THAT for weird????

DH