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Eyes

I was semi lucid. I was distracted because I was in a wooden floored room with people just standing there. They had blue bandanas hiding their right eye sockets. I had an uncontrollable urge to see what was behind them. I went to an older woman and I was trying to pull the bandana away but she was heavily resisting. When she realized I wasn't giving up she let me and I saw an empty eye socket when I lifted the bandana.

Note: I would not have remembered this dream unless I hadn't been browsing the FYP on tik tok. On it a Woman spoke of a dream where she had a vivid lucid where she kept telling her mother that it was a dream. Her mother covered her face with her hands and when she pulled them away she saw empty eye sockets.

Short Lucid

I was entering my home with someone but I forget who. I was lucid right away for no reason. I said aloud, "I have to find Jamie." I asked Asuka if she could tell me where Jamie was. Asuka was now a black man. I laughed and asked Her why she decided to look like that. Asuka began to gave an answer but the dream ended abruptly.

How rare. Not a WBTB or WILD attempt. At bedtime I did relaxation techniques and a mantra, before I knew it a wonderful WILD happened.
I am standing outside my father's house (he is deceased) and the lights are off. A narrator lets me know I am a young teen and he said he would be here but is not. It is clear I should be disappointed and angry. I am not as I know it is a dream. I am interested because it might involve seeing my dad and sometimes it feels as if I have contacted his spirit, plus the obvious emotion stuff seems deep. I look around back and observe some garden stuff. When i go back to the front lights are on and I see through a window a scant clad nurse. Now some other half exposed women. I go to the door. Dad comes out. He is drunk. He is bitter at the interruption. He rambles on about stuff. We are all in the car now, mom sis, me, dad. He is being a slobbering blubbering drunk which does not reflect on the last 20 + years of his actual life. He expresses anger at me and even knocks meanly on my head. We stop and are now following him up stairs. It is a hotel lobby and there is a bar. He loudly orders a bottle. I think what ever usefulness this aspect of the dream may have held has played out, so I just turn around and leave.
My sister and mom and now step dad are following me. Sis wants to talk about it and is crying. She had been yelling during the car part trying to make him stop. mom is falling behind as sis is rushing up some stairs on a hillside in a urban setting. I ask her to hold up so we can keep all the DCs in the scene but she is not concerned. She reaches the top and a helicopter is parked there. the whole area looks dangerous. I talk with her and wonder to her why she was yelling at him to stop. being a dream it was not really him and I had wanted to try and make sense of what he said. I decide this whole thing is no longer interesting and go flying.
The flying is awesome and it is night time. I land and a car pulls up behind me. It is Judy and the car is full of her kids so I get in. We talk as I watch the car driving and doing some not real stuff on the freeway. I get out in a familiar area of town. I am now in a basement area of an industrial site and her oldest Todd gives me a hug. I do not trust him IRL and now in the dream I assume he has put stuff in my pockets to smuggle for him. I walk off and there are things I dump out of my pockets as I go up the stairs. Guards are in this area and I try to not manifest a scene involving any of the smuggling stuff but a guard comes my way. I decide it is a cute female, and so she is. I suggest we move aside so I can speak quietly. I pull out some pills and tell her she can have them but it will cost a kiss. She kisses me but I stop it from becoming a distraction as there is no quicker path to loosing the dream.
I move away from there and am still in a dark industrial area. I see a building and the thought tries to happen that bad gang types are coming out the door. Sure enough the thought/shape of a couple bad guys start to form. I summon many Catholic school kids in uniform to come happily out the doors and it disrupts the delinquent thought. Now Todd is back and wants me to join him at a near by restaurant. I am not interested as a Mexican Cafe starts forming so i spider climb up the building. I reach a fenced roof top and relax. I enjoy the textures and looking up at the side of a tall building. Below is scene where I summoned the school kids but only adults dressed casually are still down there. I go for a nice spider climb up the very tall building. Near the top I have to move some gargoyles to get on a balcony and go inside.
It is an office and some lady tries to give me a box of files and asks me to take them upstairs. I am not interested but she is aggressive about it. I create a corner of the room with other file boxes and assure her this one actually goes with those. I set it with them. She is irritated and follows me. I go up some stairs and it comes out under an overpass. She is still following me. I tell her it is not very realist for them to have a freeway overpass at the top of a sky scrapper I just climbed, chuckling at my own humor.
I see an open area I get to near the top of the incline so I go there. She is openly angry and summons a monster. Oh yeah?! It is an invisible force that arises full of hostile emotional force and with a feeling of pursuit and snatching jaws. I work my way backwards through the open area. I face the thing as it has real presence but am not terribly interested in having a monster in my dream. I enthusiastically call it a good boy and make conversation like you would with a big puppy. "Oh you are a good monster, so scary, who wants to play? Oh what a good boy!" It becomes a giant rotwiller dog and I keep up the good boy stuff. It does want to play! It doesn't like being mean anyways. We trot along down the street I am now on and find play equipment. We go jumping around playfully. the dog can fly by the way. At this point I can sense my body and clearly have to urinate. I decide to end the dream.

I think I was inspired by MoonAgeDayDreams dream about preparing for a jungle vacation. In a dream I decided to trek to a jungle in a made up place in the jungles of a tropical country. I never really got there despite trying to keep the dream from going off track. I got a couple friends (DCs) together and we walked along a desert hill terrain. We got up on a hill side for the view and I could see back to the ocean where we seem to have started. I knew we started there but it was not part of the actual dream. I considered just popping over to the ocean and swimming, but stayed on task. We had an opportunity to explore some exciting caves but I wanted to make it to the jungle (note: not create it out of thin air or teleport), so we continued. I decided to know that the jungle was at a higher elevation and that just up that valley we would see it. I see a visitor center and a moment later the scene is inside it. A nice big building and I think a scene with a fancy fish tank but I continue on through the back doors onto an observation platform. My friends are gone. I look around. Pretty good scenery but no jungle theme or animals. The dream fails briefly and I loose track of what I wanted to do.

In the slow long grass
16/06/20
Lucid# 3 - DILD

I’m making my way hastily from a large building with papers screwed up in my hands. I haven’t had time to fold them or put them in my bag. There’s no time, I feel like I have to be quick and get the papers home before I am stopped. I feel as if at any moment some secret, shady organisation is going track me down and stop me as if this is all a big conspiracy. I now start running down a wide flight of concrete stairs and weave in and out of crowds. I quicken my pace and hope it doesn’t draw too much attention. It’s then when I reach the bottom I arrive in a large courtyard almost like the front of my old high school but full of long flowing grass which blows around and looks like grassy waves. everything has become dreamlike and it is now in slow motion with a slight de saturated and grey tinge to everything. I know I’m in a dream but I don’t quite comprehend what that means. I run into the grass but I’m only able to move in slow, jerky movements as if I’m wading through water and every step is twice as hard as if a force is constantly pushing on me. “Feel the grass” I tell myself and do so. It feels so real as I run it through my fingers. I look around and notice how real everything else feels as well. it feels like waking life. I look up at the sky and I can’t believe all this is actually in my head. Im everything I can see. I am one with it all. I then notice a large arrow in the grass made out of rocks. I wonder if it has been put there for me to follow? It feels almost like it’s a video game and the arrow is a side quest. “Another time” I decide and carry on towards the exit to the courtyard in front. I turn back and look and now the front of the arrow is broken and I wonder if I had misread the sign. I make my way painfully slow to the front gates and the exit. I see a big slope to the left leading down to a river. “listen” I tell myself and listen to the sound of the river.
After I have lost lucidity and I’m in a room laid on a floor, I have the papers. I then feel an odd sensation in my mouth, I feel with my tongue and I’m missing a tooth! I can feel the gap and gum underneath, it feels saw and tender but I think it’s normal.


Analysis:
I’m not sure why I was running away but it felt like I was escaping and people would be looking for me. Then it just transitioned seamlessly into a lucid moment. I remember the slow movements and the effort it took to move forward. I’ve had this sensation before whilst trying to run in dreams as if I’m trying to move but it’s as if I’m half frozen. Then I seemed to be telling myself to do ADA. I felt the grass, listened to the river and looked at how real everything was. The flowing wave like grass came from a real video I saw on Facebook before bed but I barely looked at it for longer then 5 seconds. The arrow was also interesting and I wonder now what would have happened if I had followed it? Maybe the dream wanted to show me something? I didn’t really have much conscious control though and I wish I had done a reality check, it probably would have stabilised the dream more and made me in control. Instead I sort of slipped back into a normal dream at the end.

Waking Notes:

Stability: Medium
Control: Medium
Clarity: Medium
Awareness: Low
Length: Low

Trigger: Spontaneous
RC: NA
Length: 1 minute approx.
Goals: none
Techniques: WBTB
Time: 6 - 6:30am
Lucid count: 3

Last nights dream was super interesting. I was in an older era, at what seemed to be a Victorian finishing school, and we were meeting possible suitors. It was rather interesting, there were about a dozen girls including myself, and we were dressed in lovely silk dresses, silk slippers, and had our hair done in intricate styles. I recall some of the men wore powdered wigs and long waist coats- one in particular was blue and gold with silver buttons. I also recall one had taken particular interest in me, but I did not find him to be as interesting.

We were on the grounds of a lavish Estate, with many trees and flowers. There were no other properties nearby, but there was a lake which connected to a small river which ran up the side of the main house. We were allowed to use the rowboats, but only with a suitor. We were watched over by a small amount of staff, strict older ladies who were very good at keeping an eye on us. I thought it was strange that the men were allowed to stay in the main house, but if there was anything untoward going on I didn't notice.

One major part of the dream was a dance, we were dressed in even finer dresses and stood in a line to see which suitor would choose us. I was picked by the man in the powdered wig and waistcoat. The other girls thought I was lucky but I didn't have any interest in him at all. My dream kind of fast forwards here, as it's now a different night and I'm outside with the rest of the girls. Things seem to have taken a dark turn, as Mr. Powdered Wig is going on a spree of violence. I am hiding in tall grass, and can see 4 or 5 of the girls on a row boat in the river. Since we were never allowed to use one, they were idly floating and didn't know how to use the oars.

One of the girls runs up, she is heavier set with dark hair. I can see her dress is a lighter color made of silk, and she seems very scared. She starts yelling about..something, and trips over a lump in the grass. Mr. Powdered Wig shows up shortly after, armed with a shovel. I watch (as do all the others) as he raises it and brings it down on her body. Naturally, the girls in the boat scream in terror, and I cannot seem to find my voice. I seem to gain some lucidity here, so I stand up out of my hiding place and start walking towards him. I feel no fear, as I can control the dream if I need to. He turns and stares at me, and I embrace him. He doesn't attack me, which I was expecting. Instead he drops the shovel and I wake up.

I tried to go back into the dream, but I felt too rested and was not able to.

I was in an open area that had incredibly rich color. I realized that I was dreaming and recalled that it had been a long time since I was lucid. I was very aware of the dream, and it immediately felt far more stable than my usual lucid dreams. The scenery was also far richer than I am used to. I was in a wide open field with bright bold grass on flat green hills, like a digital place. The single tree next to me had very green leaves and red apples, but nothing had texture to it. Everything was more like a surface mesh made of triangles. I was astounded by it and took note of how lucid I was, how stable it was, and how fantastic the perceptual experience was. I was enjoying perusing around this weird digital mesh world for about two minutes until all of a sudden another character showed up. A building appeared, it was a school, and we walked in together right before the dream ended.

non-dream dream semi-lucid lucid FA / AP


I am a college student and I hit and run a man and left him bleeding to death on the road. My thought was that he was going to die anyway, before help arrived and so I rationalized that fleeing wouldn't ruin even more lives, namely mine and of those around me who would suffer immensely if I was convicted of manslaughter. So I decided to run away and pretend I had nothing to do with it and act normally. I was absolutely sure I could pull it off, even when the police appeared on campus and started investigating the students.
I am heading to the library and the detectives are in the corridor talking to people and my paranoid mind believes a couple of them seem to be watching every movement I make and my facial expressions. I do get a bit nervous and I bump into a table and throw an ashtray to the ground, but I am already out of their sight. At the library I steal some chips from some kid who has a bag of chips open on his table. He doesn't even flinch. Wonder if that's because he is my friend or he just fears me. I go meet a friend at the most far back table and he is playing a computer game with cars and he is very proud that he managed to fit a car with a long hood into the back of a truck cabin and make a weird truck trailer, just to prove his smart and ability to bend the rules and codes of the game. I couldn't care less and cars actually trigger me at the moment, but I engage with his enthusiasm, to not raise suspicion. Later on I meet a group of friends, who are all very shocked with the events. One of the girls (looks my old friend Mara) says she would have no mercy for whomever the killer is. I feel very uncomfortable that I am the person and imagining if it is ever found out.
We go for a walk outside the campus and we pass by the road where the accident happened, but they don't know that. There is no longer any sign of what happened, besides a patch of sand the authorities spread to soak up the blood. But my friends don't know, they have no idea where the accident happened, so "Mara" asks what is this for and I swiftly say probably to cover some oil spill. They look at me a bit strangely and I say I am just guessing. We arrive at some snack-bar / pub by the side of the road, where they like to go, and the cops and detectives are gathered there. This makes me anxious. There is also Master Harry, a Scott who is like the keeper of the campus. He spots us and invite us along. But my friends feel super interested in talking to the cops. The owner of this place is a surfer and has a long board decorating the place, above our heads and one of the detectives apparently also surfs so they engage in conversation regarding the long board. I am not interested.
Then the older detective throws me a bate, by teasing me about a plant cared by the bar owner. I am not the least interested. He asks me stuff like if I can identify it, if I'd like to have one too and what I think about this guy managing to have one in this climate. And I am like "why should I care?". Then he shows me it is a pineapple and asks me if I shouldn't I be more enthusiastic about plants. I realize he already knows too much about me and my interests, which means I am a suspect. I do have a greenhouse that I care for meticulously at my parents house and I care a lot about plants, just not in this context with the stress I am feeling. I am seeing my life going down the drain. I don't know how they know, but they already suspect it was me, and are just trying to catch me. I think about my plants dying if I am arrested and I feel extremely sad for that, more than anything else.

Back to previous dream. I am not caught yet, but I am going crazy with the guilt and duplicity. I have to deal with several people related to the victim and the feeling that I am keeping this secret from them and they would hate me if they knew the truth is consuming me. I am wishing to go to some island where nobody knows me and start a new life.
I am staying at some pension of a lady who isn't particularly fond of me. She complains of something I supposedly did in the kitchen and asks me to clean it, but I am relieved to know it is just a silly thing I didn't even do. She has no clue that some other night I was drunk and peed in the kitchen. So I go look into the fridge and instead of cleaning whatever, I steal something, like some cheese and bread to make a sandwich. Then I hear her talking to her daughter, who just arrived from school and is complaining about something. Her mother says "well, you're not doing anything, because her mom is Carolina Herrera and nobody dares to upset that family at this moment, because of the terrible thing that happened to her dad."
They are talking about the man I killed. I feel guilty again and run to my room. The room looks like my mom's office and there are tigers outside of the window trying to come in, so I rush to shut all the openings and lock the door.

At my mom's house, It's night and I look outside. I spot a UFO, just a white light orb dancing around at distance. Then I spot another one, static and the first one moves towards the still one and then they both move away. During the day I spot one again in the sky. I start seeing them a lot. One day I spot one very small just hovering a street. I now am able to spot them all over the streets, spying on people, unaware of them. Only I seem to be able to see them. with the help of some friends, I capture one. It is the size of a basketball and it loses the ability to camouflage when offline. I show to my friends, who believed me but had never seen one themselves. I teach my friends how to spot them, and we can see them in the sky, in strategic places, positioned in geometric clusters. They form ice crystal like shapes with arms connecting them inside pentagonal areas. These bigger structures seem to be regulating the climate or other purposes. The little ones at the street level are watching us on a daily basis.

Back to the dream. Me and my friends are now a rebel force meeting in secret and collecting data on these UFOs, trying to understand what they are here for. One day, I am on a bus ride with one of this friends and we spot one in the sky, after a long time not seeing them. We wondered if they found a new way to cloak or had simply disappeared. Then we see two jets flying on each side of the orb but at some point leaving and the orb staying fixed in a position. Me and friend point to it but no one else seems to see it. As I point to it, I feel like I am pushing a button and the orb opens up into a square of squares of different size, like a virtual keyboard. On top rows are bigger blue squares and bellow are smaller red squares. So I do what I did before and also pretend to click them as if they are buttons. I push a random combination of keys. The UFO/keyboard disappears and immediately strange things happen, like some cars on the road going bananas as if they lost their electronics, and going over the rails and crashing. We rush to meet with the others and tell them what happened. They are a bit incredulous, but I explain maybe all orbs are programmable but we need to crack the code and see which combinations do what. Then the girl who usually brings us food comes in looking scared. Says the building is surrounded and they threatened her. Everyone wonders how they found us and I say I actually told them and it is part of a bigger plan, but they think I am just crazy and are in shock that I did that. I seem to have a really intricate plan, but I wake up before finding out.

I partially succeeded last night, I was able to take slight control of a dream before I woke up. I remember only one dream for the most part, but only a small portion. I was talking to someone (I know who the person is, but I'd rather not say), and headed upstairs to a wash room. It was a small, tiled room. The sink and other things such as the shower were also white, and I feel the walls were pink..there was a small shelf in front of the toilet that contained flowers, spray, and magazines. The shower curtain was white, and I recall turning the water on to presumably take a bath.

I notice I am waking briefly or having false awakenings, because I sleep in an eye mask and I can see when I wake up. I don't realize I am still asleep when this happens, yet.

Morning of June 13, 2021. Sunday.

Dream #: 19,900-04. 2 min 20 sec read.





After letting go of attention to post-hypnagogic navigation (lucid in every sleep cycle long before I ever heard the term), typical residual factors eventually become the foundation of a new dream. Often, staircases emerge from a wall and drop like a Murphy bed to correlate with my transitioning vestibular phasing response. (This process occurs after my first dream of walking and losing my footing with rapid falling, and in another dream signifying my loss of mobility of my arms - sometimes with another dream character dropping something. The third correlation typically displays REM atonia indicators such as a statue or sleep simulacrum as the corresponding feature in this dream.)

I become aware I am an unknown woman in a sheer white nightgown sleeping with her body draped over an outdoor staircase in daylight. I am also a giant tarantula about the size of a person. It is an ambiguous dual perception, though I am more focused as the spider on the woman’s left. I am still both. The building is on stumps with open space underneath, and its outdoor staircase is about five steps, leading to an open doorway into a large empty room with a wooden floor. There is a vague essence of the Arcadia, Florida school grounds in the 1960s, but with no correlation with its waking-life appearance.

I consider what I should do. I am not focused enough to viably navigate my present status, but I recall the dynamics of ASMR and summoning content to stimulate my emotions. I try to create another giant tarantula.

Another giant tarantula (protoconsciousness) appears. Its legs are as big as tree trunks as I hear its loud steps. It is exponentially larger than my tarantula form. It is so big that I only see its legs at times. Although it continues to walk past the part of the building I am near, I anticipate it will look through a different doorway (about 20 feet away), perpendicular to the entrance I am near, and it does. Even so, both my sleeping woman form and my spider form are below the doorway’s line of sight. (In this dreaming experience, I forget that waking a sleep simulacrum sometimes vivifies a dream.)

The giant tarantula speaks in a human voice, “You may be asleep now, but will you be asleep at this time tomorrow?” He is speaking to both my forms. I could pull the woman down the steps, and we could both go under the building and remain there for a time, but I decide not to do this. I do not feel much emotion as it is more like a surreal game.

I decide to leave my sleep simulacrum and run at an angle toward a beach. It feels strange running on my eight legs. I notice a long pipe that is open on its end, but I consider it might be too small to navigate.

The other giant tarantula keeps going in a direction away from me and is no longer in the area.

Now there is a duck hunter at a distance who shoots at me with a rifle with no effect. I consider I will be able to walk on water over the ocean. I think if the other tarantula returns, he will be too big to follow me. Additionally, the man has no boat.

I become annoyed by the duck hunter continuously shooting at me. I shoot small missiles at him from my eyes (REM ocular response) without any effect as my dream fades.

---

I wasn't able to get lucid, and I only remember tidbits of my dream. I was in a bush in the front lawn of my late fathers house, hiding from something. I suddenly popped into the back of his truck as it drove down the road. That's all I can remember.

I will attempt tonight as I am quite tired.

12th June 2021

Fragment:

At a supermarket, buying some things I think in the frozen food aisles.

Unfortunately can't recall more than that anymore.

I was able to have multiple lucid dreams last night! I fell asleep, then awoke some time later and started thinking of the last dream I could recall, then imagined I was back in that dream. It was incredibly fast and seamless, as I never noticed I fell asleep- I was able take control very quickly.

I flew around, and experimented on physically changing what I looked like. I could turn 'on' sensations such as touch and smell, and go through solid walls if I wished. I really hope I can achieve this again tonight, how amazing!

11th June 2021

Some in-line notes, in brackets.

Fragment:

I'm in the bathroom at the old home. I'm having a wee or something, I think I'm fully naked (probably since I sleep that way and if I got up for the bathroom, it would be the case anyway). I notably recall that the light is on (but there is no reason for it not to be and the situation seems normal enough).

I hear the front door opening and notably I hear T's voice and a male stranger. I deduce they are friends and hear them come into the house. I'm aware of it being quite late and so I find it a bit odd. I can sort of see through the wall, mentally, getting an idea of where they are. T either comes up to the bathroom door to talk to me or I called. We talk about something but I cannot remember what and I feel pressed to put some clothes on to get out of the bathroom, maybe to find out more?

The feeling I have around the stranger is mostly that of suspicion, I think because of the late time. I think about going back to my bedroom and possibly imagine it visually.

Dream From June 1 '14:
apparently the location is Levi's living room.
i'm looking in the direction of his backyard.
the driveway windows would be to my left.
there is a spray can on the floor on the living room.
not sure that i physically remove it myself or whether i see it get removed.
well, the can is "hissing" like that of a flat tyre.
the can hasnt been used to spray anything, so i don't know what the go is with the hissing.
thats rather odd.
the can is taken, by someone, or so it appears, from inside, to the backyard.
and the can being taken outside, is repeated more than once.
the can is upright, on the floor, and then positioned upright outside.
the blinds in the living room could be open, and the light could be on.
unless there is sunlight coming in, through the blinds.
as for outside, when the can is out there, the time could be dusk.
and i can see the sunset, through the trees in the backyard.
or, over the roof, of the house behind Levi's.
the hiss inside, is either one long one, or its some short hisses.
upon outside, the hissing stops.
and then it appears inside again, before being taken out, as a repeat.

any comments or questions ?

I had multiple dreams last night.

The first dream took place in apartment complex. It was quite large, some of the buildings were a white stucco while some others were a tudor style. Time in the dream seemed to bounce between daytime and the evening, but I didn't notice at the time. I'm not exactly sure what I was doing at the start, I think I was inside, and went out because there was a very loud alarm going off. I was with some people I didn't recognize, but in my dream I knew they were my friends.

The air was incredibly smokey, and I could smelled charred wood. The building we had just exited was on fire, with thick black smoke billowing out of the windows. I didn't feel scared, mostly curious. We spotted a large crowd of people at the front of the complex, so we started walking over to join them. All of the buildings were on fire, thinking back on it I'm surprised we could see so clearly and breathe so well. Dream logic, I guess. We make it over to the very loud crowd, and I notice the building in front of me had traveling pink flames all over it. A random neighbor (I assume) said something about the apartments across the street, so I glance over at them and they are completely charred, as if they were already on fire. My dream ends here.

Dream two

This dream was much more light hearted, and delicious. I'm at a convention center in a mall, and the interior is filled with circular tables draped with white tablecloths. Each table has a large plate in the center, each with it's own kind of dessert. Being me, I am ecstatic about this. I glance at the main buffet, which is loaded up with what seemed to be meats, dumplings, and all sorts of savory things. My main focus, however, is finding the perfect dessert. One table in particular quickly catches my eye, it has a plate with 2 very large cake slices. The size of my head large. I didn't think it was strange they were decorated for Christmas at all. The first cake had cut out geometric fondant pieces in light green and red, with edible bulbs. The second looked more like a large slice of pie, and had a dark red exterior.

A waiter came over and helped me move it onto my plate, which it easily dwarfed. It had a very nice cardamom smell, with a hint of mint. I was incredibly excited to eat this cake. I referred to it as a pie in the dream, so maybe it was a giant pie piece? I'm not sure. Dream logic. Anyway, I am about to tuck in to this cake when I am suddenly teleported outside to a picnic table, where I am sitting with- my moms late cat, Sugar. Sugar passed away over 5 years ago, but she looked very young and fluffy like she was young again. I told Sugar to stay, I was going go get my cake which didn't teleport with me. As I'm walking back inside, I see a homeless man excitedly ask about the cat, and start sprinting over to her. I rush back to Sugar, as I am worried he will take her- I wake up at this point.